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[Dri]

Everyone kinda focuses on combat changes but I reread the notes and the ones from the 1st and I have to say there are a lot of great campaign changes as well! I'll start a new game for this patch even if I don't have to (does this patch still support .7 saves?).

[Alex]

Everyone kinda focuses on combat changes but I reread the notes and the ones from the 1st and I have to say there are a lot of great campaign changes as well!

I'll start a new game for this patch even if I don't have to (does this patch still support .7 saves?).

They'll definitely load, but I'm not 100% sure every single new feature will be there. There may be one or two things you won't get, though I can't think of what that'd be at the moment.

[DrakonST]

Instability Java 8 consisted in that that the computer hangs(The picture freezing, the sound vanishes, doesn't react to buttons.)?
The game started on Java 7 will have bigger FPS than Java 8?

[Sy]

I think that'd be too good vs frigates and other such. It's still got all the benefits of being a beam weapon vs smaller targets; the slow turn rate has always been intended to offset that.

then maybe the Tachyon Lance needs to turn slower? with the upcoming buffs to both weapons they will still have around the same dps, but the TL has the advantage of doing high burst damage (making it especially strong against low capacity shields, like those of frigates) and emp damage.

i still feel the turn speed is too low, though. not because TL or HIL seem too weak overall, but because the difference between having them mounted in the hardpoint of a Sunder or Apogee compared to having them mounted in a turret of an Odyssey or Paragon seems too big. even without officer skills, Sunder and Abogee can turn pretty quickly. it feels really weird to me that a cruiser can turn its front mounted laser faster than a battlecruiser can turn its turret.

maybe both weapons should instead have slow beam travel speed (or however the stat that governs how long a beam takes to reach full length is called ^^), so that small and mobile ships have a better chance to avoid a full hit.

Everyone kinda focuses on combat changes but I reread the notes and the ones from the 1st and I have to say there are a lot of great campaign changes as well! I'll start a new game for this patch even if I don't have to (does this patch still support .7 saves?).

i'm definitely looking forward to the various campaign changes as well, particularly regarding commissions and smuggling. :]

[Megas]

I do not want slow beams.  If anything, they, or at least Tachyon Lance, should hit at full range instantly.

[StarSchulz]

"Possible to start non-hostile with pirates"

I know what start ill be using! *Raises Black flag*

[Cycerin]

"Possible to start non-hostile with pirates"

I know what start ill be using! *Raises Black flag*

My first 0.7.2a character is going to be Blackbeard Dickerson.

[ANGRYABOUTELVES]

I like the beam buffs, they should make using beams other than Tac Lasers or Phase Lances a lot more viable. I'm particularly excited for the High Intensity Laser and Tachyon Lance changes, as there's now real competition for Large Energy Weapon slots; I'm going to enjoy figuring out my new preferred Paragon loadout. While you're at it, could you take a look at the Hephaestus Assault Gun being terrible? Halving the shots/minute and doubling the per-shot damage and flux cost (DPS and flux/sec stay the same) might make it possibly useful.

The Campaign AI changes are sorely needed and I'm glad to see them implemented. Having AI fleets just ignore storms and spam EBurn like CR doesn't matter and supplies are free was both immersion breaking and exploitable. The other changes to transponder functioning and cargo scans are similarly appreciated.

The changes to Atropos torpedoes look like an interesting way to increase their usability as well as differentiating them more from the other HE missiles. I'll have to see how well the AI uses them before I pass judgement, though.

This entire patch looks great, so I'll just stop typing before I write 2000+ more characters of "you're doing a good job, please release the new version soon".

[Alex]

Instability Java 8 consisted in that that the computer hangs(The picture freezing, the sound vanishes, doesn't react to buttons.)?

It may, although this sounds like something that might also be fixed by installing a good version of OpenAL on your system:
https://www.openal.org/downloads/

The game started on Java 7 will have bigger FPS than Java 8?

Probably not if it was already running well. But, for example, it'll flat out not work on some windows 10 system w/ Java 8.

i still feel the turn speed is too low, though. not because TL or HIL seem too weak overall, but because the difference between having them mounted in the hardpoint of a Sunder or Apogee compared to having them mounted in a turret of an Odyssey or Paragon seems too big. even without officer skills, Sunder and Abogee can turn pretty quickly. it feels really weird to me that a cruiser can turn its front mounted laser faster than a battlecruiser can turn its turret.

Ah, do you see maneuvering thrusters attached to the HIL? Honestly, I don't see this as a problem. It's slow, yes, but that's the point, and it's quite usable provided you take this slowness into account tactically. It already got a massive buff.


@ANGRYABOUTELVES:

Re: Hephaestus, I had an item to look at it but just didn't get to it.

[Megas]

Hephaestus is not terrible per se.  It is the Heavy Needler of heavy HE.  It is a faster, more efficient version of Hellbore, which means... you usually take Hellbore much like you usually take Heavy Autocannon over Heavy Needler, unless you need the turn speed badly or accuracy badly.

Hephaestus is poor man's Mjolnir, and can sub in a pinch, but that means no Heavy Mauler in the medium ballistics slot to complement HAG.

[Dri]

Saying you just didn't have time to give the Hephaestus a looking over makes me think the patch is virtually upon us, or it takes a great deal more effort to tweak a weapon than I thought. O_o

[Histidine]

Fighting pirates that occasionally attempt to take your cargo will no longer ruin your reputation with the pirates, though it will still result in a slight penalty

Does this mean a new memory key that modders can set to tell the reputation plugin "don't insta-drop status to hostile for fighting this fleet" or is it hardcoded/tied to something else?

[Schwartz]

It does get somewhat outperformed by Tactical + Turret Gyros + IPDAI, but I don't really want to balance against that being always available.

I used to think this was a sweet combo, but they're not that good in actual play. Tac Lasers cannot handle IPDAI because they turn slowly while firing - too slow for missile duty. Resulting in repeated on-off-on-off cycles. This isn't a bad thing by the way, Tac Lasers are fine. But ideally you'd use them with Gyros only, that way they make quick work of fighters without being distracted by (and awkwardly dealing with) missiles. Considering fighters also produce missiles, this works fairly well for hightech ships that can afford to shield tank missiles otherwise.

The weapon changes are good. Medium Burst PD in particular needed the buff. HIL is gonna be another nasty sniper for fleet action. EMP through raised shields will probably tip the Tach Lance over the edge again, but I'm just happy to get to use it more.

[Alex]

Saying you just didn't have time to give the Hephaestus a looking over makes me think the patch is virtually upon us, or it takes a great deal more effort to tweak a weapon than I thought. O_o

It's more of an "I already switched gears from a 'making weapons changes' mindset". Stuff like that comes out better in batches because there's more time to iterate all the changes while working on all of it together, since it's almost never the *first* set of changes for any given weapon that ends up being "the one".

Does this mean a new memory key that modders can set to tell the reputation plugin "don't insta-drop status to hostile for fighting this fleet"

That's exactly it, yeah.

I used to think this was a sweet combo, but they're not that good in actual play. Tac Lasers cannot handle IPDAI because they turn slowly while firing - too slow for missile duty. Resulting in repeated on-off-on-off cycles. This isn't a bad thing by the way, Tac Lasers are fine. But ideally you'd use them with Gyros only, that way they make quick work of fighters without being distracted by (and awkwardly dealing with) missiles. Considering fighters also produce missiles, this works fairly well for hightech ships that can afford to shield tank missiles otherwise.

Just to make sure: when's the last time you used Tac Lasers w/ IPDAI and Gyros? Due to some changes in the autofire AI (i.e. it keeps firing them) they can absolutely maul missiles now, even doing some pretty neat "sweeping" stuff - not entirely intentionally, but rather effectively for all that. At least, that was my experience when testing that combination after that autofire changes.

[Sy]

Ah, do you see maneuvering thrusters attached to the HIL?

now that i'm thinking of thrusters attached to giant lasers... why not go one step further and let us chain torpedos to our ships for some extra boost? imagine a Dominator riding into battle pulled by a swarm of Reapers, chariot style! \o/

It's more of an "I already switched gears from a 'making weapons changes' mindset".

are you still working on some big change or new feature (as in, potentially blog post worthy) for the next release, or 'just' various improvements here and there?

Just to make sure: when's the last time you used Tac Lasers w/ IPDAI and Gyros? Due to some changes in the autofire AI (i.e. it keeps firing them) they can absolutely maul missiles now, even doing some pretty neat "sweeping" stuff - not entirely intentionally, but rather effectively for all that. At least, that was my experience when testing that combination after that autofire changes.

huh. i was about to agree with Schwartz, but looks like i hadn't tried the combination in a while. testing it on a Hammerhead now, it really does work very well. O: