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Starsector 0.95a is out! (03/26/21); Blog post: A Tale of Two Tech Levels (05/28/21)

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Author Topic: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)  (Read 734525 times)

DownTheDrain

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1395 on: May 12, 2021, 01:23:23 AM »

i keep a vanilla and self modded version of diableavionics to make it run the way i like but im not a verry good modder. ballance is a *** =P

Same.
At least I used to, just getting back into SS after a long break.

As far as I remember that has always been both the strength and weakness of all of Tartiflette's factions. He designs them around a specific strategy or philosophy and then sticks closely to those mechanics, with few if any jack-of-all-trades builds.
If you're able to fully make use of their advantages you'll do okay, but if you deviate too much or try to play them like a vanilla fleet you're gonna get rolled.
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Ryers

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1396 on: May 13, 2021, 04:14:53 AM »

i keep a vanilla and self modded version of diableavionics to make it run the way i like but im not a verry good modder. ballance is a *** =P

Same.
At least I used to, just getting back into SS after a long break.

As far as I remember that has always been both the strength and weakness of all of Tartiflette's factions. He designs them around a specific strategy or philosophy and then sticks closely to those mechanics, with few if any jack-of-all-trades builds.
If you're able to fully make use of their advantages you'll do okay, but if you deviate too much or try to play them like a vanilla fleet you're gonna get rolled.

yes, i agree. his factions, tho truely awesome, have more of a 'made to be and NPC' feel. i love playing 'purity' saves but diable is HARD late game...the player is pushed to just pick the bits they need for their fleets. man i love this faction but i wish it was a bit more rounded out
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Andimar

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1397 on: May 13, 2021, 05:58:05 AM »

@Tartiflette

I love this mod, and I've played with Diable Avionics more than with any other faction since its original release. Still, something bothers me with the two Gust ships. While their ship system is fun but sort of useless from a player perspective, when in AI hands their ship system is just purely useless.

Have you thought about giving the controlled wing a buff of some sort? Since the Heron's targeting feed gives +50% damage to its 3 wings, wouldn't it be fair to maybe make the gusts' ship system give +100% damage to the one single wing they have available?

It would give me more of a reason activate it beyond the cool factor of the first time when I'm controlling one of these ships too.

Also, I don't know if you've ever tried it, but slapping a 90 arc weak (600 to 800) omni shield onto the Frost wanzers gives them an amazing feel. I would love to see an official upgraded version with that for a higher OP cost at some point.  :D
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Tartiflette

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1398 on: May 13, 2021, 01:04:39 PM »

As implied by the system description, the fighters do get a significant buff when they are piloted by an ace, effectively giving them 25% enhanced engine and weapons stats across the board.
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Ryers

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1399 on: May 14, 2021, 02:10:11 AM »

well hot dam, i never knew this... thanks fot the heads up. now, time to mod the *** out of this!
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Thorveim

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1400 on: May 16, 2021, 02:59:12 AM »

Im overall very puzzled by the Pandemonium... I get what you wanted to go for with it (a very big ships with heavy drawbacks, even its lore you added points to that ship basically being a show of force more than a practical weapon) but... Its just feels awkward. It doesnt have the OP for a full weapon suite and wanzers at the same time without giving up a lot of hullmods and maybe even flux radiators. Its reasonably durable armor wise (paragon level), but doesnt want to armor tank because guns break all the time even with armored turrets. It has mobility with its ability, but the cooldown and flux dissipation it offers means you wanna keep it for when it might already be too late... that and its needed if you want the full facing firepower (as the heavy turrets overlap in a very narrow arc, and the shield itself only covers the nose... The shape of the ship not helping in that case)... all of that for a ship that can't really be deployed multiple times in a row on top as it loses a mountain of CR at every engagement.

Overall I want to love this ship, but I have a hard time seeing it beat my XIV Onslaught, which is much cheaper to deploy and less vulnerable to flanking to boot, which is saying something. I dont think it needs much of a buff (even just not having its guns break to a stiff breeze might be enough, though I can see higher armor or more OP/OP discounts on weapons or fighters/wanzers may work too) but I feel it needs something to be worth its paragon deployment cost (and drain on your supplies on every use)... and I have a very hard time seeing it compete with the Paragon while it has the same deployment cost.

Also dont know if its intentional... But the 0 op wall drone counts as a wanzer for some reason for the purpose of the wanzer servicing gantry :p

Lastly... Saw somewhere a diable supercapital, apparently existing as an expansion... Where can it be found, if its still somewhere? (think it was the ironstorm juggernaut)
« Last Edit: May 16, 2021, 11:21:44 AM by Thorveim »
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Phenir

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1401 on: May 16, 2021, 06:59:40 AM »

Pandemonium just needs advanced ground support package.
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Milesofgaming

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Industrial Evolution Reverse Engineering
« Reply #1402 on: May 16, 2021, 12:18:24 PM »

Is there any possibility you'd consider putting your ships on the Reverse engineering list for the Industrial evolution mod? It may be a lot to ask, but I'd love to be able to use the DA ships as my own patrols or custom order them. Thank you!
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ShadowStalkar

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1403 on: May 19, 2021, 11:54:36 AM »

After playing around with this mod....imma be honest,i just love some of the designs not so much on asimetrical ships,not a fan but i have a few issues on the balance side of late game things ,that where probably talked about before multiple times
(i cant check all of the 90+ pages from all over 5-6 years,sorry)
two things:some of the smaller ships feel kinda killer machines(maybe i am wrong on this one as i usually manual them early,so it could be just that)
but
mainly - pandemonium capital (yes i am aware of it being a lore - show-off for the faction, but still),from what i can see its intended to be more of a legion-like battle carrier,but that weaponry makes me feel like it wants actually to be a flagship ,and i am not sure if thats miss-balance or just flexibility

but maybe its just me being crab-ass and not knowing smth,i just end up using this as a missle long range support instead of actual capital flagship ,as when i did try i run either in to heavy flux issues or just lack of weaponry due to op used on flux

my main suggestion , if you are willing to hear it - either increase dp cost but provide a solid OP boost,or make ship modular to trully deserve "oversized hull" title and its rarity,as i dont really think its that oversized compared to vanilla ships or DA itself

or dunno,some sort of heavy balistic integration analogy?to reduce OP used by faction weapons/fighters or smth along the lines of wanzer perk,that shoulnt break any lore?

if you ask me how do i determine how ship is underpowered?throw radiant at it and begin the countdown,then compare to vanilla ships for the same-ish cost : )
« Last Edit: May 19, 2021, 11:53:54 PM by ShadowStalkar »
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Tartiflette

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1404 on: May 19, 2021, 11:45:00 PM »

I have some small changes coming for the Pandemonium that are... different.
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ShadowStalkar

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1405 on: May 20, 2021, 12:18:24 AM »

well,good to see that changes are being made based on what seem to be collective ship bullying feedback

from what i guess,if you say "different",i suppose you will just remove some of the weaponry pile it has to have the intended role of battle cv?(and not confuse people who tries to fully outfit it and runs in to issues)as i havent seen anyone point at it yet,but this also might be wrong on this
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KDR_11k

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1406 on: May 20, 2021, 01:46:52 AM »

Pandemonium just needs advanced ground support package.
For its size it probably need something even bigger than "advanced".
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Thorveim

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1407 on: May 20, 2021, 02:37:59 AM »

well,good to see that changes are being made based on what seem to be collective ship bullying feedback

from what i guess,if you say "different",i suppose you will just remove some of the weaponry pile it has to have the intended role of battle cv?(and not confuse people who tries to fully outfit it and runs in to issues)as i havent seen anyone point at it yet,but this also might be wrong on this

Will have to wait and see... Seems like maybe a new integrated hullmod. Removing slots... Didnt the pandemonium go through that before already? Think it used to have 4 large slots. And wanting to use it in a more direct combat role makes sense: its too slow to keep its distances, and the only diable ships with more than 1 large slot (if we ignore the cruiser with 2 of them... But if im right its impossible to get rn out of cheats, as it was made to appear in another mod which isnt updated for 9.5)
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DownTheDrain

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1408 on: May 20, 2021, 08:24:30 AM »

some of the smaller ships feel kinda killer machines(maybe i am wrong on this one as i usually manual them early,so it could be just that)

They're nice but not better than some vanilla designs or ships from other mods, at least as far as I can tell.
They also happen to be the only thing in this faction that I'm somewhat decent at piloting myself, so I'd appreciate it if they remained that way. I'm not good enough of a pilot to make any of those long heavies with tiny shield arcs work for me. Except the Haze maybe.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2021, 08:28:24 AM by DownTheDrain »
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Tartiflette

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Re: [0.95a] Diable Avionics 2.62 (2021/03/27)
« Reply #1409 on: May 20, 2021, 10:03:58 AM »

I shouldn't have said anything. I'm making small adjustments and now everyone will expect 6 large turrets and the 0.91 Hyperion teleporter system...
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