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16

General Discussion / Re: Legion XIV > STD Legion

« on: September 20, 2021, 02:12:36 PM »

I really prefer the XIV legion because hurricanes exist. I just run 5x HVD for 1000 range firepower anyway. It's consistently one of the highest damage output ships in my fleet, and like 60%-70% of that damage is just hurricanes with as much ammo as I can get.

I'm just now getting to read your post and I'm wondering if you invest any OP in fighters or just leave the bays empty? Also, what hullmods are you using? Thanks!

17

General Discussion / Re: Build Two Items into new Paragon

« on: September 19, 2021, 08:05:28 PM »

Just be aware that bigger battle size means the enemy can deploy more forces at once as well. It can help, but isn't guaranteed.

It seems like you have the basics down so improvements are going to start being harder, especially as you don't pilot. Fine tuning builds is part of improving combat performance, as is overall fleet composition. I personally do not like cruisers very much for endgame and prefer capitals + frigates and/or destroyers depending on tech level and build (low tech doesn't use frigates, mid tech likes unofficered tough filler frigates + destroyers, high tech might not use destroyers because their frigates are so good and benefit from wolfpack so much and might use their destroyers as unofficered ships rather than their frigates). For me the reason is that, in general, cruisers have a lower ratio of offense/DP than the other ship classes, the truly offensive cruisers do much better in player hands and at that stage capitals are a better player amplifier, the 'anchor' role is better done by capitals, and there is a lot of value in just having more ships on the board than the enemy (or at least not be outnumbered so badly!).

Oh, and if you aren't using lots of missiles: use lots of missiles.

I guess it depends on what Cruisers you're talking about. Any Cruiser that can't be highly specialized does become a liability in the end game but I find that Champions and Furies (of all things) still do well in the end while more middle-of-the-road Cruisers like Falcons/Eagles/Dominators are much less useful. The AI isn't aggressive enough with Auroras so that 30 DP cost is much better spent on 2 Furies and the Doom...well, that's another beast entirely. Champions really are the Platonic ideal of what a late-game line Cruiser should be, able to punch-up while still maintain some speed advantage over Capitals. I'm hoping that the Dominator buffs bring it back into the fray as a reliable line cruiser but at present, it's not there. If it becomes a better brick, I'll load up with double Mk. IXs against Remnants and spam Harpoons.

As for Destroyers, the only Destroyers I might even consider in endgame are Sunders, Medusas, and Harbingers. Sunders can at least match range with larger ships and can bring a heavy weapon to bear for just 11 DP. Medusas can escape and still bring enough firepower to do something and Harbingers are the ultimate interference ship. Hammerheads, Enforcers, Shrikes and the like are great in smaller battles but their lack of range and relative firepower makes them pop against any kind of Capital. I'd rather have a Wolfpack Tempest/Scarab or Hyperion than any of those Destroyers.

Thanks for the info. The Champions are quite an expensive ship to replace and they die pretty quickly in my games. Maybe I'm doing something wrong? I went with the Assault fit as one of the four choices and I gave it a five point aggressive pilot with the shield modulation skill. Maybe this is a better support ship similar to a much more durable Apogee?

I sure appreciate the info on the destroyers not playing a significant role in late game with the current build. There is also quite a bit of talk about the Wolfpack Tactics skill and using more frigates, which is not something I have tried. I dislike the uncertainty of having to salvage ships and dealing with more d-mods, thus I tend to favor more durable ships or ships with longer ranged weapons.

It's funny that you and other veterans with much more experience steer away from the Dominator heavy cruisers. Of all the cruisers, outside of 15 point Fury which I love, these have been quite good for me. They are tough and they can deal quite a bit of damage to larger ships with the Mark IX Autocannon + Heavy Mauler + Annihilator Rocket Pods and a captain with extra missiles. These cruisers really made the difference in my last encounter with two huge Hegemony fleets I was forced to take on at the same time. The Champions (I had two) ran in and died quickly, while the Dominators stayed and took out an Onslaught XIV nearly by themselves. It took three Dominators, but they did it without any of them being destroyed.

Edited: I confused Aurora with Fury. They have a similar shape. The paragraph above reads correctly now.

18

Bug Reports & Support / Re: NPC Fleets Don't Use Jump Points

« on: September 19, 2021, 07:49:47 PM »

Thank you! Best of luck to you and your team!

19

Bug Reports & Support / Re: NPC Fleets Don't Use Jump Points

« on: September 19, 2021, 07:37:34 PM »

Thank you, I really appreciate it!

(And, yeah, bugs that aren't straightforward to reproduce are the worst.)

You're quite a fast responder. I was editing my message. Would you mind taking a look at the edit? Maybe one of those changes caused the difference in our experiences? I'm not a mod user for any other games and it simply slipped my mind. Thanks again and good luck with the game!

20

Bug Reports & Support / Re: NPC Fleets Don't Use Jump Points

« on: September 19, 2021, 07:32:38 PM »

The game keeps one save, yeah, though there's a "Save Copy" option in the campaign menu that lets you save your current game to a new slot. But if you hadn't done that, a newer save wouldn't be much use, unfortunately.

On the other hand, this should be very easy to reproduce. Maybe it only happens with AI interdiction fleets, or maybe only after you've told your colony peeps to refuse the first inspection and thus the Hegemony doubles up on the inspection fleets for the next trip. There are quite a few people here who are familiar with the console and I'll bet a few of them would be glad to test the hypothesis that fleets don't use jump points.

Ah, I'm sorry I wasn't clear! This definitely isn't a general issue. Something specific must've happened to cause this; I'm not sure what, exactly - a reasonable explanation doesn't readily come to mind.

For example, here's a screenshot of an expedition coming from Arcadia to Duzahk, jumping out of the system:

https://i.imgur.com/ciYv3Yb.png

I did pretty much what you've described to try to reproduce this but it works as one would expect. I haven't seen this sort of thing reported prior to this, which makes me think the conditions that trigger this are not very common (which would make a save where it's happening super handy, but no worries!). At the very least, though, I will look out for this - it's good to know about potential issues; thank you again for letting me know.

Thanks, I get it now. Glad it's working for you. It must be extremely hard to troubleshoot with so many different versions of Windows and endless hardware configurations. Next time I have another inspection I will repeat my actions with the same game that resulted in the issue last time to see if I can locate the fleet at their starting destination. I'll be sure and save before I try. Good luck with the next iteration of the game. We're all looking forward to it!

Edit: My apologies. I have modified the game a little. Changed to 8GB RAM, and I installed two mods - Automated Commands and Detailed Combat Results. I usually play completely vanilla, and I simply forgot about the mods. Maybe one of the changes above led to my experience?

21

Bug Reports & Support / Re: NPC Fleets Don't Use Jump Points

« on: September 19, 2021, 06:37:57 PM »

I saw the fleets forming and I waited until they were heading to the jump point. If you look at the area around Samarra in hyperspace, it's a beautiful open space. There's no way two huge, slow moving fleets could not have been seen, especially since my fleet was just flying in circles in the middle of the jump points. The fact that I ran into them about one day's journey from the Duzahk jump points let you know that part of the game is working, because they became visible on the edge of the screen as that portion of hyperspace came into view. 

Thank you for explaining. I'm happy to send you whatever I have, though I fear that the way the saves work is they appear to erase the previous save once you have moved on in the game and have saved again. Maybe I'm wrong and there's a whole list of saves. If that's the case, then tell me where they are and I'll see if I can attach some of them. It happened just yesterday so it should be somewhere.

On the other hand, this should be very easy to reproduce. Maybe it only happens with AI interdiction fleets, or maybe only after you've told your colony peeps to refuse the first inspection and thus the Hegemony doubles up on the inspection fleets for the next trip. There are quite a few people here who are familiar with the console and I'll bet a few of them would be glad to test the hypothesis that fleets don't use jump points.

22

Bug Reports & Support / NPC Fleets Don't Use Jump Points

« on: September 19, 2021, 04:47:06 PM »

I was notified of a Hegemony AI inspection that was gathering at Sphinx in the Samarra star system, so I went there and watched it happen. They were heading to one of my colonies in Duzahk, so I knew what direction they would be traveling. It seemed easier to intercept them at the jump points near their own system which was relatively clear of hyperspace nebulae than to wait and hope I could find them in all the hyperspace nebulae near my own. The problem is that the AI fleets never left their system or they did, but by magic and not through any jump points or any place that was within an entire view of their systems, while centered on their group of jump points in hyperspace.

The AI fleets formed (two of them) and they headed to the Samarra Jump Point. I was closer to the Fringe Jump Point so I went there and entered hyperspace. I was there several days before their slow moving fleets could have made it to the Samarra Jump Point and I waited and waited. There was a pirate incursion in their system so I thought maybe their two fleets were delayed by a pirate encounter, though I kept checking the "Colony Threats" notification and the part detailing the impending inspection kept counting down the days until the Hegemony's arrival. When the notification indicated 3 days before arrival, I left the empty area of hyperspace surrounding the Samarra system jump gates and flew as quickly as I could towards Duzahk, where I found both fleets near the Duzahk jump gates. How the heck did they get there, if I haven't discovered the gate technology yet, and they technically never left their system.

Surely I'm not the first to work this out rationally and choose the better battle ground? Why not give enemy fleets the same rules for travel that the player has? You've gone to great lengths to develop a story that draws the player in. Why not do away with "magic" that breaks the immersion and works against the benefits of the story plot?

23

General Discussion / Re: Build Two Items into new Paragon

« on: September 19, 2021, 04:27:41 PM »

Harpoon Pods and Sabot SRMs, a combo made in heaven.

Now this makes sense! I'm already a huge Sabot SRM fan.

24

General Discussion / Re: Build Two Items into new Paragon

« on: September 19, 2021, 03:42:26 PM »

I like bigger sizes because I want to deploy more than a few ships.  (Small ships do not count because they lack PPT.)  The default of 300 is too small, feels like I play Star Control or a tag-team fighting game instead of a free-for-all or battle royal.

I do not like size 400 much either, it is barely big enough.  Would like size 500 or even higher.  If enemy wants to abuse capital spam, I want to too, and want as many ships out at once instead of three, give or take, squeezed out at a time like a devolved Star Control style duel.

If capital spam (by the enemy) is here to stay, then it would be nice if in-game settings max size was restored back to 500, or better yet, raised higher to 600 or even 800+.

Your observations match those of Thaago, and I believe you make good points. I'm going to seriously spend some time experimenting with larger fleet fights and different ships / builds. The mod below as well as the "Noob's Insight on Ships" is helping me gain a better understanding of who is doing what. Thanks again!

Detailed Combat Results by Nick XR --Highly recommend this mod as it breaks down combat results by ship and weapon.

25

General Discussion / Re: Build Two Items into new Paragon

« on: September 19, 2021, 03:37:12 PM »

Just be aware that bigger battle size means the enemy can deploy more forces at once as well. It can help, but isn't guaranteed.

It seems like you have the basics down so improvements are going to start being harder, especially as you don't pilot. Fine tuning builds is part of improving combat performance, as is overall fleet composition. I personally do not like cruisers very much for endgame and prefer capitals + frigates and/or destroyers depending on tech level and build (low tech doesn't use frigates, mid tech likes unofficered tough filler frigates + destroyers, high tech might not use destroyers because their frigates are so good and benefit from wolfpack so much and might use their destroyers as unofficered ships rather than their frigates). For me the reason is that, in general, cruisers have a lower ratio of offense/DP than the other ship classes, the truly offensive cruisers do much better in player hands and at that stage capitals are a better player amplifier, the 'anchor' role is better done by capitals, and there is a lot of value in just having more ships on the board than the enemy (or at least not be outnumbered so badly!).

Oh, and if you aren't using lots of missiles: use lots of missiles.

The last part really made me laugh! Yes, all my officers have the 2x missiles trait, and I do focus on missile spam as I can. The preceding info on fleet comp made me think. I read quite a few posts indicating the meta was faster/smaller ships in the current build, though my experience in game was leading me to your conclusions - capital ships are king and cruisers for the most part just can't do much compared to Capitals, besides using their long range beam weapons to discourage blobs from overwhelming your capital ships. I also believe the AI is good at many things, though escort pathing is awful. I've watched escorts time and again either rush out in front of the capital, only to be focused and die, or get stuck behind the capital, unable to contribute. Cruisers do seem to escort each other quite well, and I do like to put two Apogees together. Capital ship escort is where things devolve, from my limited experience at least.

BTW, just noticed below your sig, "Harpoon Fan." Are you referring to the predecessor of the Command line? If so, I'm right there with you. I played the entire line from the original Harpoon game, though Harpoon 97, to the Gold Edition and now own all the Command releases though I've slowed quite a bit with the latter. Command has been plagued by bugs which is a deterrent since my game time is quite limited. It does appear to have more support the last year or so than I've seen previously, which is a good thing.

Thanks again! I've got quite a bit more learning to do about this game and maybe a change in my fleet comp once I find more blueprints. Exploration!

26

General Discussion / Re: Build Two Items into new Paragon

« on: September 19, 2021, 01:39:07 PM »

Thanks everyone! It's good to speak with others who have been there and can provide wise counsel. Frankly, the fleets you folks warn me about have me concerned.

I just intercepted my first Hegemony AI patrol when playing last night, and it was certainly the hardest fight I've had yet. Must have been six to seven capitals total, in two huge fleets with what seemed like an additional 40 or so ships - fought both simulataneously. I had six capitals and a bunch of cruisers and it was simply an exercise in trying to pull my ships out when they got down to 1/2 hull. Just before that I fought four, full-strength pirate fleets simultaneously and the two Hegemony AI patrols were at least twice as difficult as the four pirate fleets. I can't imagine what fighting the endgame fleets will resemble.

I had two Paragons, two Onslaught XIV, one Odyssey and a Conquest, plus several heavy cruisers, a couple Champion, a Doom, and a variety of lighter 22 point and 15 point cruisers. I think I was down to the last couple cruisers while two Capitals were still fighting when the Hegemony fight ended. Keep in mind all ships were flown by the AI and I have 10 at least 5 point officers, plus all my Capitals have two built-ins. I was limited to 240 DP at the time, which I have since raised from max 400 to max 500 to see if there's any improvement in the effectiveness of my fleets.

I'm kind of wondering where the improvement in capability on my side will come from. Certainly after the Hegemony fight I started building another Paragon since the tracking stats consistently show that's my highest damage ship, and I don't have any of the AI ships in my fleets yet, but I am maxed out on character fleet skills and on officers. Guess I'll have to do more exploration, find and capture some AI ships, find more BP's, see if I can get any Tachyon weapons, manipulate the fleet deployment size, and then go from there?

27

General Discussion / Re: Build Two Items into new Paragon

« on: September 19, 2021, 09:47:28 AM »

Low danger systems never have a Nexus, so those fleets are finite. Medium danger ones may or may not have a damaged Nexus and if you destroy it, no more Remnant fleets will spawn there. High danger systems always have a fully operational Nexus.

Thanks! BTW, what kind of danger is at the fully operational Nexus? How many stars? My fleets can kill a standard one-star Luddic Path or Pirate base with just a few cruisers, though I've not had the opportunity to encounter a base stronger than that.

28

General Discussion / Re: Any mod out there that lets me throw every ship in my possession at the enemy?

« on: September 19, 2021, 09:15:38 AM »

It’s actually quite interesting to see how the AI reacts to such big battle sizes. At that point, the AI tends to form what I like to call a “battle wall”, in which both sides face each other off in a line with a gap inbetween them. Anything that moves out of line is shredded and this continues until the losing side backs off and the line breaks up. It’s a behaviour that can only be clearly seen on larger battle sizes as otherwise the AI has insufficient DP to form such lines.

I like to put mine at 1500, which usually lets most fleets bring out their full strength. You can edit max battlesize in the settings.json file.

You and your enemy both, also I think it become an FPS issue for most rigs at this point? I think the recommended overclock is closer to 700. 
Totally second hand knowledge just pointing out what I've read.. or imagined I read.

True, it is pretty laggy. But as enemies get killed, the lag starts to go away, and it’s also possible to just remotely control your fleet without having to render in sections with heavy firefights to minimize lag, as well as the engine flares performance mod.

Fascinating! Thanks for the info. I'll have to experiment a bit more with the larger fleet sizes.

29

General Discussion / Re: Build Two Items into new Paragon

« on: September 19, 2021, 09:14:18 AM »

Gates are not active until I finish that quest, and even if I do, there is no guarantee one will be spawned close enough (to my colonies).  They do cut down on travel at times near the end of a game, when I start killing endgame fleets.  (But I did not grind Ordos for long.)  Also, I want to explore the entire sector to find all gates first before I select the system I want to ruin permanently.

Sometimes, I simply want to explore in an Ordos infested system but do not want to run too far away from them.  I had less than 20 burn before, and it was miserable trying to avoid Ordos (takes longer to "leave their sight").  Burn 20 makes it easier dance around (or otherwise dodge) Ordos, and pounce on one that separated from the group and kill it.

AI can run, but with max burn, they cannot escape so easily.  It is a good thing when enemies run from your fleet because player can auto-resolve them to death for risk-free, fast, and easy kills (deploy the civvies and clunkers instead of your A-team of ships to wipe out enemies via auto-resolve).  If a bigger fleet means more enemies run away, that is good.  Having big fleet also means more ships to deal with big enemy fleets.

Don't mean to cut into this discussion though your last comment brought up a question I have. I know the systems with the "high" danger warning signs have [Redacted] star bases and once you destroy the base then no more [Redacted] ships can be built and the system can be cleared. Does the same mechanic work with the "low" danger systems? Do they also have a star base  you can destroy and thus clear the system? Thanks!

30

General Discussion / Re: Any mod out there that lets me throw every ship in my possession at the enemy?

« on: September 18, 2021, 09:59:48 PM »

I like to put mine at 1500, which usually lets most fleets bring out their full strength. You can edit max battlesize in the settings.json file.

Those are monster battles. Clearly it's working for you, though I would think you would have so many ships on the field that they couldn't fire efficiently. How do you manage those battles when obviously you're using lots of slow capital ships?

Do you have a few screen shots you can share? Thanks!