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Messages - TaLaR

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46
General Discussion / Re: IR Autolance uses?
« on: July 28, 2023, 09:07:24 AM »
Eagle with triple IR lance and S mod expanded magazine is a menace to things that drop their shield and have light/stripped armor. The beam speed is so fast that it frequently pops things that angle the shield to deal with 'more dangerous' threats.

What do you stick in the other slots though? You need something to force the shields to drop in the first place.

Gravitons do very little to drop enemy shield as well. For the most part they act as defensive buffs for the attacking ship (in sense that target ship has less flux left to use on weapons). So unless you want a short ranged Phase Lance build, breaking shields is always left to ballistic slots. Usually 2 kinetic + 1 HE, but I guess with 3 IR lances, all 3 kinetic may be better.

47
Burnout bowling is quite inconsistent though, both mechanically and as part of the setting. Why can't we override speed-down behavior after PB? It's clearly possible (by collision), potentially useful and not inherently harmful to the ship (if you get bonked into safe direction).

48
Afflictor is comparably easy to control though. Only 1 manual weapon group with all AM blasters centered to cursor, no shield direction to worry about, system roughly in sync with weapons (with Expertise). Most of the time you are under time dilation too, with only short bursts of pre-planned activity on each uncloak.

Shrike has way more things to juggle simultaneously to fight optimally.

49
All of them have frontal weapon setups
Shrike and Fury are both left-sided, if you use guided missiles.

It's pretty much impossible to efficiently handle anything faster/smaller than Odyssey with keyboard tank controls. And you can't use offset turn to mouse style with any manual fire weapons (like Heavy Blasters, that can't be allowed to autofire flux-wise), it also causes issues with any but the widest omni-shields.

Also, Imo, guided missiles taking significant part of OP budget do not belong on any player ship. I want an efficient workhorse that can grind down many times it's own DP without running into ammo/PPT issues. Pure energy/ballistic or at least long lasting stuff like Reapers.

50
A player piloted Odyssey can make decent use of Plasma Burn due to being a broadside. Come in at an angle, rotate while fighting, ready to retreat a few seconds after engagement started (even Odyssey can last that long, generally). You can also slingshot a volley from plasma cannons beyond their normal range during approach.

But smaller ships simply can't extract as much use from this system. All of them have frontal weapon setups, and smaller ships wouldn't work with broadside tank controls for player. Plus AI piloting lacks any nuance, AI just activates ship systems when their effect aligns with what the ship was going to do anyway, but never modifies behavior to utilize the system better.

51
Suggestions / Re: Odyssey tweak
« on: June 30, 2023, 11:32:54 AM »
Core issue is that AI doesn't adjust it's actions to make better use of PB (or any other system) possible. It either activates PB to improve what it was it going to do anyway (move forward toward the enemy), or doesn't.

Player can use PB to dodge shots (reducing flux levels somewhat in process - drop shield while dodging, makes you smaller target and frees up shield upkeep), to retreat (if approaching too strong enemy in reverse-broadside, when you know you can't win in one round), to get behind an enemy, to slingshot projectiles beyond normal range (with Plasma cannons), etc. Using PB only to approach enemies is complete waste of system's potential. And AI isn't good even at that (proper timing to catch a venting phase ship, a Medusa out of charges, etc).

52
Suggestions / Re: AI controlled ships switch targets too often
« on: June 29, 2023, 12:14:07 PM »
Well, it's not a good idea to split soft flux weapons between multiple targets (or switch too often) in general. Though 4TL Paragon vs frigates is the most extreme case of this.

53
Suggestions / Re: Odyssey tweak
« on: June 29, 2023, 11:54:24 AM »
No, Odyssey is the only ship that makes good use of Plasma Burn. Fury and Shrike do it much worse due to not being broadside (though a small broadside ship wouldn't work anyway). Plasma Burn is stronger and more fun for player piloted Odyssey.

And AI-wise, I'd rather want to see AI making better use of ship systems in general, PB included.

In old times when Odyssey had HEF, it also could converge all 3 large slots on single target. Was a bit annoying to pilot due to the narrow and offset-to-side sweetspot, but 3TL HEF Odyssey was a very good kite-and-snipe ship. For player. AI obviously didn't do that, as always.

AI makes quite terrible use of Scarab (wastes most uptime, needs to be much more aggressive with system active) or Medusa's system though (skimmer is much better used to dodge, catch venting enemy or circle behind them, than wasting limited charges on simple approach/retreat).

54
General Discussion / Re: Insulated Engines are the new meta.
« on: June 24, 2023, 10:05:06 AM »
Imo, any use of s-mods on logistic ships is post-game luxury. Like level 15, filthy rich and don't know what to do with piled up story points.

55
Suggestions / Re: Harbinger AI Bug
« on: June 20, 2023, 07:16:40 PM »
Whenever I pilot an Afflictor and get extracted from phase by QD, Harbinger 99% fails to capitalize on this. Presently, there doesn't seem to be any sync between weapons and QD use.

56
General Discussion / Re: Thoughts On Destroyers
« on: June 18, 2023, 03:52:42 AM »
I think the "defense" against that is that you're then committing 45 DP or 35 DP to take care of a 10 DP destroyer; in other words, the destroyer is successfully splitting off the other fleet, at the cost of its own survival. So the capital might win the "local" matchup, but it makes the "global" matchup i.e. the rest of the fleet more likely to lose.

Which hardly matters when your goal is to win without losses. Or at least not lose any s-mod ships (losing some of cheap distraction Shepherds is fine)

57
General Discussion / Re: Thoughts On Destroyers
« on: June 18, 2023, 03:31:10 AM »
Medusa is wholly dependent on smart skimmer use. Player can do that, AI can't.
Hammerhead and Sunder's survival strategy is to unload system boosted dps on approaching fast cruiser. Both have enough firepower to make something like Falcon back off (but Falcon is better in long range build anyway, in which case it has absolute speed + range advantage).
Enforcer is just not built for solo survival. In theory it could play broadside and kite with Burn drive, but AI won't do that and player shouldn't either (because it's waste of player's piloting impact).

And that's only if we conveniently forged about fast capitals like Odyssey and Retribution. Which are fast and powerful enough to leave destroyers no survival options at all.

58
+1 to lategame non-phase destroyer. Either a quest reward similar to Ziggurat. Or something available earlier, maybe taking Blackrock Desdinova (mod) as inspiration.
And a usable phase destroyer too (or revert some of Harbinger's nerfs).
Maybe also a good speed 10 destroyer to give player incentive to use something other than Falcon(P) or frigates early.

Other than new ship, I'd also like a bit more awareness from AI on how phase really works, from both phase and shielded ships. Because top-tier phase ship play is quite non-interactive - AI literally can't do anything to stop me, because it doesn't understand the nature of the threat. The only possible reason for dying is gross execution mistake on my part (killing a capital from too close, most of the time).

59
  • You could make the fighters have really small hitboxes like Gothars suggested so that the chance to dodge is based on the fighter having a very small hitbox. This makes trying to hit them with an inaccurate gun very frustrating for the player, and because guns have inbuilt inaccuracy it does not actually change the fact that the hit is determined by RNG.
  • You could make the fighters have good AI, so that they avoid your gun arcs, camp in the relative blindspots of your turrets firing their guns and dodge bullets which they are fully capable of, such as in the case of this bomber we'd have it just sidestepping the Hellbore shot instead of proceeding with its attack run on its trajectory. This is likely to cause many players to rage and is not an enjoyable experience.
  • You could give the fighter an equivalent damage reduction like Hiruma Kai suggested. This makes fighters seem heavily armored. For example if you gave it a 50% damage reduction, then a Broadsword could barely survive two Hellbore shots, while a Kite or Shepherd will die to them. This seems esthetically off. Also note that a 50% damage reduction will result in a 0% chance for a Hellbore shot to kill a Piranha while a 50% dodge chance will result in a 50% chance to kill.

1) You can't aim manually at too small hitbox (if it's going to be few-pixel-sized). Entirely dependent on auto-aim and fighter AI remaining as dumb as it is now will become a necessary feature to hit at all.
2) Best option in terms of gameplay it provides, but probably too computationally intensive. This shouldn't apply to just fighters, frigates are capable of dodging quite a lot too (and currently they do not try to).
3) In a sense it's even worse than pass-through chance, because this makes a dense fighter screen the best form of defense.

One realistic option is to add a random component to fighter movements (and some extra speed, to retain same overall forward speed despite inefficiency). So that a fighter never stands still or moves in a straight line - it should always weave around a bit. And make large fighter groups spread out more, so that they never become too dense target. Ideally, this means that weapons auto-firing at fighters should also not try to hit their exact current trajectory, but add some extra spread (to avoid perfectly missing the fighter with all shots). So the key factors for hitting fighters would be projectile speed and amount/density, not accuracy per se (unless insta-hit or close to that).

Not an original observation here, since people have pointed this out many times, but the current system is strange regardless of whether this change is made or not, because the carrier skills reward you for running a fleet of mostly non-carriers, since you get the most out of them that way.

I've always viewed it as getting the most out of it by having 8 or more wings.  It just so happens the a 24 wing fleet and a 8 wing fleet get the same net bonus.  8 Heron's with officers get their fighters back 25% faster with Carrier Group.   4 Drovers with officers get their fighters back 75% faster with Carrier Group.  You have no additional incentive to add more than 8 wings, but despite how people feel about it, you save the exact same amount of time on respawning fighters across the fleet either way.  Making it a smaller maximum bonus, but increasing the number of wings it applies just make the skill overall weaker and forces you to go all in on carriers.  Same thing is if it just applies to 240 DP worth of combat ships - Alex would likely drop the bonus from 50% to 20% for Carrier Group.

Recovery bonus from Carrier Group remains same 4 virtual extra decks, true. But speed bonus from Fighter Uplink genuinely goes down.

The core issue is that with only 15 points, you want to really focus your build. And 2 skills to buff a small portion of your overall fleet that is never going to be player-piloted just doesn't sound attractive enough to me. I already have to cut more important stuff to stay within the 15 limit.

60
@CrashToDesktop
Shepherds are jacks of all trades - ok combined fuel/cargo capacity, while drones allow them to have some contribution to combat while remaining reasonably safe.
A Shepherd with Converted Fighter Bays is pointless - it loses drones that made it worth deploying, at which point it's better to use more efficient pure cargo/fuel non-combat ships.

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