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1

General Discussion / Re: Design Compromise style of limitations feels too complicated for build crafting

« on: April 08, 2025, 03:51:57 AM »

I have tested extensively using detailed combat result, and I can tell you paladin pre-nerf is not a problem. 3 paladin do not out damage 2 HVD in every damage category, from shield, armor, to hull. If you have min-maxed level 7 officer + s mod extended bag, 3 paladin barely beats 2 HVD on it, and at cost of being constantly overfluxed, and overall do not deal more damage than 2 paladin + 2 HVD mounted option, because it is overfluxed.

You've made the wrong conclusion, then. Anyone with a pair of working eyeballs could tell it was OP pre-patch, because of what it did in actual battle. Comparing dps numbers doesn't mean anything. Comparing it to a weapon of different category, even less. Paladin damage is frontloaded, can be fired from behind allies, consistently hits faster targets such as flanking frigates, and naturally also clears missiles and fighters.

2

General Discussion / Re: Design Compromise style of limitations feels too complicated for build crafting

« on: April 08, 2025, 03:17:18 AM »

Couldn't disagree any harder with OP. The Anubis is unique and fun because of Design Compromises, and has lots of build variety thanks to that. Just because you can't fit the usual large energies into it doesn't mean it's "pigeonholed." You can downgrade slots or leave them empty, you can place stronger mediums in the universal slots, you can use converted hangar without penalties to fighters. Few ships have as much variety as Anubis. Just use your imagination, try out things you usually don't, be surprised by how well a full medium weapon loadout + fighters works for example, simply thanks to Temporal Shell. Forget about the tach lance. Also, built-in weapons are the most boring thing ever, please never add them to anything unless they're unique to the ship.

But man, what are some of these comments.

In the sandbox game player agency should  be priority if I want to spam 3 TL with TS and make the game easy this is my choice to make

No? Other people play the game too. Other people might have different ways of enjoying the game. If you want everything to die the second you look at them, mods exist.

remove temporal shell.

"remove this new, cool thing because I don't understand it"

The part I am confused the most is why would Alex think Paladin is a problem. The design compromise is clearly meant to limit the large energy slot to the most efficient weapon, which is Paladin. But he also thinks people spam Paladin ruin build variety. I mean, the more limiting the flux, the more people would use cheapest weapon. And if Paladin becomes too flux expensive, the alternative is to leave the slot empty. I fail to see how nerfing Paladin improves build variety.

Paladin pre-hotfix was too strong, which you would know if you used it, or the ship at all. Yes, having it be the uncontested best in slot in every situation would ruin build variety. No, the alternative is not to leave the slot empty.

Paladin is literally the only large energy Anubis can use.

It literally is not.

Unless you want to leave one or even two mounts empty, but in that case why even have them on the ship.

Options, build variety? Like how/why are you all so mad you can't put high damage, high flux large energies on a Temporal Shell ship? Why not just give the player the omega ships?

Anubis right now has flux profile of Lasher.

It does not.

And that make absolutely no sense for high tech cruiser to be so gimped on flux to the point when 2 PD weapon with maxed vents and stabilised shields can outflux it

There are easier ways to say you haven't used the ship, but for some reason feel like everyone should hear what you think despite that.

3

General Discussion / Re: [Spoilers][Fleet Showcase] High-tech Carrier Group

« on: April 08, 2025, 01:48:38 AM »

Spoiler

The character has Officer Training, Officer Management, Flux Regulation, and Cybernetic Augmentation.

The original build:



For some variety and to play with the toys, swapped out the twin IR Autolances for a single Resonator MRM Launcher:



The way I use these things, they should never be in the front-line: escort a capital and blat over screening ships. When they overflux they dip out, dump flux at +35% rate, then dip in again. If they start getting shot at then they are either way out of position or they should be retreating because I've already lost the fight.

Haven't decided yet if I want to s-mod in Flux Distributor.

Edit: Didn't bother with fighters. IMO better to have those on a capital like a Legion/Odyssey than the Anubis.

Edit 2: The Officer really needs Ordinance Expertise (possibly Elite) instead of Field Modulation, to help with the flux-war.

Edit 3 (again): In fact the officer is very non-optimised. It would be better to have Ordinance Expertise than Systems Expertise. The ship doesn't need to spam Temporal Shell that hard, it needs better flux handling.

Interesting, that such an objectively half-ass set of officer skills still works reasonably well with the ship loadout.

[close]

Interesting. I tried something like this, but with regular flux conduits. I just couldn't get it to vent, which led to frustrating performance. Perhaps it's because my officer was aggressive?

Also, why aren't you using stabilized shields? I figured that's a no-brainer mod for any Anubis. If it didn't have Design Compromises it would still be worth it (9 OP for 105 dissipation, vs 90 on vents), but with DC it's even better (105 vs 54 dissipation).

But yeah, when it comes to officer skills, only elite PD is really mandatory. Elite EWM is really helpful too, though.

4

General Discussion / Re: [Spoilers][Fleet Showcase] High-tech Carrier Group

« on: April 07, 2025, 07:54:51 AM »

I’m curious, why s-mod Escort Package on the Anubis Escort build? It’s a cruiser.

Good question!

First of all, escort package in itself is there because range increases to Paladin are better than other weapons, as they can fire over allies, and because the Escort Anubis is a specialized (as opposed to generalist) ship with a strict purpose and role. The reason it's S-modded is that it's got no good alternatives. I simply value the added capacitors/vents more than any additional effects from S-mods.

• S-Mags are unsustainable. They push the ship to overflux itself.
• S-Converted Hangar is not worth it. Because of Carrier Group already giving a +75% to replacement rate, I basically never had the replacement rate actually drop that low.
  
• S-Stabilized shields convert hard flux into soft - while an excellent effect in itself, in practise it doesn't do much for the Anubis. Temporal shell and just regular Expanded Magazines leads to anubis spending most of its time soft fluxed anyway. This would not be a bad S-mod, and if I wanted to try out different builds on the same ship I'd perhaps consider S-modding this.
• S-IPDAI does nothing for this ship, and S-Advanced optics would have the same effect (nothing)

5

General Discussion / Re: [Spoilers][Fleet Showcase] High-tech Carrier Group

« on: April 06, 2025, 12:38:18 PM »

I love how you guys in this forum always have fun at the expense of the newbies by posting these whacky meme builds that make no sense whatsoever.

Why so rude? Someone *** in your cereal this morning?

Feel free to elaborate how the "whacky meme builds" "make no sense whatsoever"

6

General Discussion / [Spoilers][Fleet Showcase] High-tech Carrier Group

« on: April 05, 2025, 03:20:00 PM »

This fleet was based on the idea of making Tempests as strong and speedy as possible. However, the real star turned out to be the Anubis. I dabbled with including Phase Coil Tuning and 40 DP worth of phase frigates, but immediately abandoned the idea after fighting the Threat and Shroud Dwellers. The end result is 1x Paragon 1x Onslaught mk.1 3x Anubis, 4x Medusa, 3x Tempest. In this playthrough, the Shroud Dwellers prompted me to try something I haven't really done before: Build a few of my ships in a way that lets me switch out just a couple weapons to similar cost ones undocked, so that I can better fight both the Threat and Shrouded while in the abyss.

Player skills:

Spoiler

[close]

Paragon:

Spoiler

[close]

• Classic main character™ flagship. Warms the bench in all but the biggest fights, but crucial in those.
• Shrouded Thunderhead is pretty good with S-mags quad autopulse. It cracks armor, provides EMP, it's hitscan so good vs smaller targets too, gives something to do with excess flux.
• Gunnery Implants+Armored Weapon Mounts to ensure hits land.
• Exceptional burst, which is really good against new enemies.
• Some might find piloting one boring, but being player piloted fixes its biggest weakness: being distracted and losing 0-flux speed boost. Not being distracted is also very important against new enemies.

Oldslaught:

Spoiler

[close]

• The MVP. Extremely strong, "hero" ship similar to Ziggurat. Smashes through everything, useful everywhere. Fought double Ordo, Persean League blockade, Third Strike, max diff Shroud Dwellers, Dorito bounty and everything else without ever dying, post hotfix nerfs. Only came close to dying once: Survived at 8k hull after tanking two Shrouded Eyes, which was my mistake.
• Easy to build wrong due to the AI core. I feel like almost anything deviating from this kind of build is straight up worse.
• Needs to be controlled with eliminate orders against difficult enemies.
• Against Shroud Dwellers: Swap front mining blaster for another Heavy Machine Gun. Swap side Devastator Cannons for Thumpers. In fight, both Paragon and Oldslaught wait for an opening, without orders. When the eyes move to firing positions, Paragon and Oldslaught are responsible for immediately destroying them. Once the eyes are down, the rest of the fight is easy.
• Against Threat: Swap Storm Needler for Hellbore Cannon. Immediately rush Fabricators together with Paragon. Oldslaught eliminates one, Paragon the other.
• Against anything else: Current loadout. Decisions vary depending on battle.

Anubis variant - Brawler:

Spoiler

[close]

• Hit hard by hotfix. Build before it was with two Heavy Machine Guns instead of sabots. Post patch it can't sustain 3 S-paladins with anything else, so either 0-flux missiles or switching a Paladin for an IR Autolance is needed. Neither feels particularly good, so this build seems outdated.
• Has a tendency to overextend/overflux itself while hunting for targets. Shrouded Mantle is cheap and helps with survivability, sometimes granting an "extra life."

Anubis variant - Escort:

Spoiler

[close]

• Probably my new favourite ship, dethroning both S-mags Medusa and Missile Autoloader Omen.
• One escorts the Paragon, one escorts the Oldslaught
  
• 3x Paladin with Integrated Targeting Unit, Elite PD, Advanced Optics and Escort Package create a huge no-missile no-fighter umbrella, deter potential flankers, or bring extra DPS by firing over friendlies.
  
• 2x Unnerfed Sparks with +75% replenish rate and elite PD do what Sparks do best. What's this? A handsome group of flanking frigates woefully underpopulated by Sparks? A large influx of Sparks ought to put a stop to that!

Medusa variant - Brawler:

Spoiler

[close]

• Strong DPS, huge durability, amazing mobility. Can equip different weapons depending on the situation. All around excellent ship, and my favourite destroyer.
• Voidblaster is a strict upgrade to Mining Blaster
• Has a tendency to overextend due to ship system. Shrouded Mantle is cheap and helps with survivability, sometimes granting an "extra life".
  
• Against Shroud Dwellers: Swap Ion Pulser and Voidblaster for IR Autolance and Pseudoparticle Jet.
  

Medusa variant - Escort:

Spoiler

[close]

• It's a shame to leave Cryoblasters unused. Low flux weapons in other slots enable using one on a Medusa.
• Escort package is unnecessary, just something I felt like trying. They don't necessarily have to escort, either.
  

Tempest:

Spoiler

[close]

• Solid duelist, excellent point capper, harasser and flanker.
• Comically fast. 338 speed with 0 flux boost, 288 without.
• Thanks to carrier group and buffs to respawn rate, Terminator Drones spawn fast enough so that it no longer feels bad when the Tempest uses Termination Sequence!!!
• In order to adapt to more uses of ship system, the usual main weapon, Pulse Laser, is swapped for Inimical Emanation. While the raw DPS of a Pulse Laser is gone, I feel like it falls off anyway late game, and Inimical Emanation ensures this seriously fast and quite durable frigate can set up targets for its teammates.

7

General Discussion / Re: [!!SPOILERS!!] New academy quest line ship [!!SPOILERS!!]

« on: March 30, 2025, 01:00:28 PM »

ok the power armor is a good example - strong but not overpowered  . If you want to compare it to fallout 4 the way you are describing the onslaught mark i is more analogous to the overseer's guardian - an item that can be obtained with zero combat and very early in the game, and trivializes all combat for the rest of the game (I don't believe onslaught mark i is at this power level) . And yes it is meta to run straight there for any speed run.

It's difficult to directly compare power levels, because FO4 is just so, so much easier to completely break. There's a huge amount of ridiculous things the player can do. It's fun in its own way, but it's a completely different game. I just used the example to illustrate a point about the importance of balance.

Also, I don't think anything in this game is quite comparable to the overseer's guardian, even keeping in mind the vastly different power levels. Quite literally one-shotting everything, including legendary enemies gets old fast. Good thing even the player piloted, omega weapon-loaded ziggurat does require hands to pilot it.

Also the player has the agency to not use it!! Most fun people have in a sandbox game is from self-imposed challenge runs imo

Agreed.

8

General Discussion / Re: [!!SPOILERS!!] New academy quest line ship [!!SPOILERS!!]

« on: March 30, 2025, 12:12:53 PM »

Also, to unlock its full power, you really need to play a neural link build which will limit the amount of fleet-wide buffs you can get. Without neural link, the MK1 suffers from the same glaring weakness that plagues other AI automated ships : it's behavior. The MK1 will happily ram into the opponent's fleet and be under constant ennemy fire from all sides.

I disagree. The oldslaught is one I wouldn't neural link. Alpha core pilots are extremely powerful, and not having one where you could is an enormous opportunity cost. There's a reason you can only have so many with the automated ships skill, after all. You, and seemingly many others, view the cores fearlessness as a problem, while I think it's in fact ideal. I want this ship to dive into the enemy, to get value from all the defensive hullmods, skills and short range weapons I've chosen for it. In my experience it has more than enough hull for this to work.

I also think that it's easy to go wrong with building this ship. One might intuitively think they can put whatever on this ship, because the remnants seem to be doing well with all kinds of builds. This assumption is wrong. The remnants work because everyone is fearless. For player fleets, because of the AI core, there really is only one way, like a safety overrides ship (which is a part of why I find the implementation of this ship boring). You have to assume it's going to dive and take lots of fire. You need to build around it. If you try to make it a firing line ship, it won't work as well.

One way to make it less appealing in early game would be to increase its base cost and to increase the number of D-mods it has. That means that unless you tech into early Hull Restoration, its power will be severly limited by the D-mods it has and how expensive it will be to restore in early game.

I disagree. It has rugged construction, which means d-mods aren't such a big deal. Giving it more d-mods would actually be a buff (just in the early game though) because they make it easier to maintain without really doing much to combat effectiveness.

9

General Discussion / Re: [!!SPOILERS!!] New academy quest line ship [!!SPOILERS!!]

« on: March 30, 2025, 11:19:44 AM »

man more nerfs... why can't we just enjoy fun things in a single player game.

This might not be the optimal thread to discuss why balance is important to a game at a fundamental level, but I'll bite.

Because fun has different definitions to different people. Some like to become as powerful as possible, perhaps to a ridiculous degree, and absolutely smash the opposition with everything they've got. And there's nothing wrong with enjoying the game like that, not at all. However, it's worth considering that some instead prefer to solve challenges and problems the game throws at them, and derive their version of fun from that.

Balance is a slider. If you're too far to the balanced, problem solving side, the player who wants to become powerful won't enjoy the game, because everything is, well, balanced. Too far to the other side, and the problem solving player won't find the game challenging. See what I mean? Obviously it's best to be somewhere in the middle, so that as many players can have fun as possible.

Historically starsector has been pretty good at this. The biggest "cheat codes" currently are the sentinel XIV ships, which in the hands of the average player require at least a late-mid game fleet to defeat and salvage (not to mention finding the system in the first place), and the ziggurat, which is locked behind a decent amount of story (or meta knowledge), and similarly requires a strong fleet to defeat it first.

This is not the case for the Oldslaught. You can get it very early, without any fighting. Similarly, you can find a guaranteed alpha core for it very early. Despite this it's just as powerful, if not more than the other special ships.

I see this as a problem. Despite how much fun using it might be, the slider is too far to the other side on this one. It doesn't require enough to find, it doesn't require enough to get and gear up, and it's way too powerful despite all that. It's almost akin to Fallout 4 giving you power armor in the tutorial in my eyes.

Maybe one day we will have an ability to record the game footage to present as evidence so we can skip the endless bickering

I realise you might be sarcastic, but I'll still say that I don't think this is necessary. I'll trust everyone's word, there's no need to discuss in bad faith.

10

General Discussion / Re: [!!SPOILERS!!] New academy quest line ship [!!SPOILERS!!]

« on: March 30, 2025, 09:45:26 AM »

I have no idea how anyone is doing this thing die. It has an enormous ammount of Hull, unless your not building it for hull tanking I guess. The oldslaught is completely ridiculous. It's objectively the strongest player usable ship in the base game and It's not very close. I think once it's stats have been dialed back you should have to fight the threat fleet first before you can salvage then.

Without babysitting it keeps ramming enemy ships and take damage from the explosion when they die.
Enough enemy capitals/cruisers down = Onslaught down.

How many is "enough"? Has this actually happened to you? What did you fight, how is yours built?

11

General Discussion / Re: [!!SPOILERS!!] New academy quest line ship [!!SPOILERS!!]

« on: March 30, 2025, 09:23:25 AM »

I feel like the player base didn't even read the quest text. Or, idk, ppl's reading comprehension is in the gutter. Either or.

You know, this is completely possible. I was a bit tired when I read the quest text, and i'm not a native speaker. I did get the part about replacing dead crew with automation, though. This is why I included the "I know this is probably not possible, but I wish it was" in my first suggestion.

I think I completely, fundamentally, disagree almost 100% with OP.

Do you disagree with literally everything, or just the lore/feeling/reasoning parts? If you disagree with the balance, how is yours built (show me?), and what did you fight with it, other than the 5 onslaughts?

12

General Discussion / Re: [!!SPOILERS!!] New academy quest line ship [!!SPOILERS!!]

« on: March 30, 2025, 08:16:58 AM »

I don't know, having a no-cooldown, forward-only mobility system on an automated fearless ship feels like an unsolved weakness to me. The stupid thing literally rams enemies, and tends to die every combat. I don't even think I've seen armor modules destroyed, the ship loses front armor first and dies to hull damage long before that.

How have you built yours? Here's mine(left side identical):

Spoiler

[close]

Yes, it rams enemies, good! That's machine gun + mining blaster range. But die every battle? How? Feels like I couldn't get this thing killed if I tried.

You forgot to mention that it's 50 DP, has horrendous flux, no shields make it ultra vulnerable to some weapons and has less OP than a normal Onslaught, let alone XIV one. Yes Adjucitators are nuts, but they better be for the price increase.

50DP is nothing for a ship you can alpha core for free. It doesn't have horrendous flux. If it overfluxes frequently, you've built it wrong(Show me?). It's not "ultra vulnerable" to any weapon either, except mayyyybe omega with cryoblasters. HIL, hephaestus or hellbores aren't a big deal because it's a hull tank, not an armor tank, and due to the vambraces. Tach lance, ion pulser, any other EMP don't matter either. S-Repair unit + armored weapon mounds + impact mitigation + elite damage control means it doesn't care about emp or any other weapon damage. It's got less OP, but it also doesn't need nearly as many hullmods (or weapons) as an ordinary onslaught.

And as far as unique ships go, Zigg still blows it out of the water even considering the DP diff.

Player piloted zigg with skills (and omega weapons?) vs alpha oldslaught? Sure, of course.
AI zigg with no skills vs alpha oldslaught? Not a chance, not even with omega weapons.

Latter is how they should be compared, because coring it is free.

13

General Discussion / [!!SPOILERS!!] New academy quest line ship [!!SPOILERS!!]

« on: March 30, 2025, 06:48:48 AM »

The onslaught mk 1.

Is anyone else a bit let down by this ship? I got spoilered to it existing (my own fault) but I can't lie that seeing the name onslaught mk.1 got me kinda hyped. I love the contrast between "Likely AI-created tech that violates the laws of physics. Nobody knows how it actually works and it looks like literal magic." and "This 200 000 -year old machine gun still works just fine. I've yet to meet one who can outsmart bullet.", which the game has as one of its main themes. So, what I was hoping for was something between the invictus and normal onslaught, something that would say "old, but functional". Something that I would have lots of fun with in the refit screen, simulator and actual battle.

Instead what it feels like is a cheat code. It's simply way too good. The vambraces give it an insane amount of durability, something that normally should be a weakness/problem to solve for shieldless ships. The combat burn is just a straight up upgrade over burn drive, solving another problem a ship like this might have with being kited. You can't pilot it yourself (boring) without using a neural link, but this comes with a massive opportunity cost because you can also put an alpha core in it for free (no automated ships needed) for officer-free 8 elite skills.

But worst, or best depending on the definition, of all: The heavy adjudicators. Holy moly are these the most broken strong weapons I've ever seen. Feels like one-upping modders in terms of power level. Let's compare it to the cryoblaster, widely considered to be one of if not the best weapons in the game: Longer range, better flux efficiency, slightly lower but still very high hit strength, benefits from ballistic skills instead of energy, you get two of them, insane burst, benefits from S-magazines,exploding AoE!!! Seriously, there is nothing in the game that the heavy adjudicators won't just erase from existence.

To me the onslaught mk1 doesn't feel like what it claims to be. It's supposed to be something really old, but this doesn't translate into gameplay. It comes with its weaknesses pre-solved. It's fast, accurate and durable with extreme firepower. It seamlessly integrates into any present day fleet, while outperforming in its weight class. I'll have to view it in a similar manner to the ziggurat and those sentinel XIV capitals - something so strong I'll have to make my own rules for them or simply choose not to use them in order to keep the game fun. This, I think, is the worst "crime". The idea behind it is so cool, but the implementation so boring!

Suggestions:

• Make it a normal, human crew piloted ship. I know its story implications, so this might not be possible, but personally I'd love this. As I see it, this would both solve the problem with the ships power level, and allow more fun in terms of a more balanced experience. It would likely lead to increased build variety, experimentation and roles in different fleets. Also removes it being an auto-include everywhere due to officer free alpha core.
• Reduce the vambraces hull points. 20k each on a ship with 30k base hull is too much. This ship is more durable than an invictus.
• Change the ship system. The ancient version of the onslaught having a strictly superior ship system doesn't feel right, and hitting this would address that. Maybe it could even have the damper field system? or both, similar to the vanguard? This might make it too durable without any other changes, though.
• Make the adjudicators feel "older" - less projectile speed, more spread, but bigger explosion? I love both the idea of a "zone of death" and having a pair of gigantic flak cannons as main armaments, but the current iteration is just too strong. Maybe it's too flexible? What about increasing the sustained DPS, but making them unable to store ammo (and as such use S-mags)

14

General Discussion / Re: Anything desperately in need of Balance Pass next version (Add yours here)

« on: January 09, 2025, 11:42:04 AM »

I think it's best both squall and especially harpoons stay untouched. Neither of them is a problem on their own, but especially in nerfing harpoons range there is a significant amount of collateral damage to be done. Too little range with that missile speed and they simply won't connect anymore, especially when equipped on ships like Mora or escort package Manticore, both of which prefer to stay at long range. If their range gets reduced, they absolutely need a projectile speed boost, which in turn might necessitate a projectile health reduction so pd can have a chance against them and so on.

15

General Discussion / Re: Anything desperately in need of Balance Pass next version (Add yours here)

« on: January 09, 2025, 10:05:38 AM »

If there is something that *desperately* needs balancing, it has to be the gryphon. Missile spam gryphon is still pretty ridiculous. This may be a problem inherent to harpoons and squalls, but it doesn't seem to present a serious balance issue when they are used anywhere else. I haven't seen anyone go out of their way to demonstrate such a problem, at least.

How would one re-balance the gryphon without ruining it? It seems fair as a support ship in mixed fleet compositions, but presents an issue when you spam mostly gryphons. Well, how about giving it a built-in escort package, and reducing its OP by 15? Basically forcing it to pay for a hullmod that missile-spam doesn't want, while it could get value out of it in a more normal fleet composition.

I view this ship in the same way as I've come to view safety overrides in general: A way to make the game easier but much more boring (Though I have to say having an option like this in a game isn't necessarily bad). Linking squall and harpoons to force it to fire harpoons whenever feels like I'm cheating, as does using more than three gryphons in a single fleet to reach critical mass. Using both I might as well set everything on autopilot and go get groceries.

Without spamming them and without linking harpoons to whichever large missile I'm using the ship feels quite alright. Not too strong, not too weak, and with clear weaknesses and strengths. I'm not sure if it should be balanced around monofleets/abusing linked harpoons, as it would most likely make it weak when used "ethically".