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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: New music for Galatia Academy (06/12/24)

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Messages - DownTheDrain

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1
I have a question. does adding rare_bp to the Firecane Artillery will actually make it droppable?
I have tried using console commands to get the Firecane Artillery and it gives me some Interceptors instead.

Just looking at the file it seems that the firecane is a SYSTEM weapon, so built-in and not supposed to be spawned on its own.

2
Mods / Re: [0.97a] Ashes of The Domain
« on: June 30, 2024, 03:14:04 AM »
New dev diary !
https://www.ashesofthedomain.info/devlog/aotd_vok_dev_1

I like it. A lot.
All the extra commodities seem a little overwhelming at first and then don't really provide enough for such a significant change to the system once you're used to them. Some other mods also introduce special resources of their own and it quickly becomes a bit of a pain to sort where things come from and what they're needed for.
That said, the different specializations can be a fun little puzzle in a playthrough that's mostly or entirely focused on colony building.

As for special projects, will that be only used for ships and weapons or will there also be colony or global projects that improve production or diplomacy or some such?

3
Mods / Re: [0.97a] Diable Avionics-Joestar edition v2.9.1
« on: June 21, 2024, 11:52:23 PM »
And on the UNBOARDABLE thing, I spawned in a "diableavionics_virtuous_scout" and checked with TMI(Too Much Information), the ship has the unboardable tag. I went into ships.csv and removed the tag from the files, booted up the game again and checked the ship, the tag was gone. Admittedly i havent yet brought it into battle to see if it'll pop into the ether. From what i saw in the file the game is supposed to remove the UNBOARDABLE tag which is *inherent* to the "diableavionics_virtuous-" when you repair the destroyed one. So spawning in a completed one bypasses that and leaves the ship UNBOARDABLE.

I'm genuinely confused now.

I downloaded a fresh version of both Diable Avionics and TMI and started a new game. I spawned in every variant of the Virtuous with console commands and none of them show the unboardable tag with TMI. They're all just hide in codex and only the skirmisher has restricted in addition.
In the ships.csv the only entry is diableavionics_virtuous_skirmisher, which doesn't have unboardable. In fact the only place I ever see that listed is in diableavionics_virtuous_destroyed.skin as "removeHints":["UNBOARDABLE",].

There literally is nothing for me to remove in ships.csv and nothing displayed with TMI. Are you sure you're using the newest version of Diable Avionics?

4
General Discussion / Re: Grendel is my default flagship now.
« on: June 19, 2024, 12:38:25 PM »
Maybe phase ships in general are seen as harder to balance or more prone to being overpowered in player hands?

Probably this.
I don't usually bother with phase ships but I still remember the Doom going from kind of a joke to almost game-breaking OP after a round of buffs.

5
Isn't the time between action and reaction the bar, which starts at 0? In my latest run I blitzed 3 colonies down at once, with colony items as soon as their initial industries were built, and it still took months to a year for anything to happen.

I suppose if he covered every new colony in AI cores he might get a quicker reaction.
It's what I've been doing in my last run to get the Hegemony to come fight me. The others usually don't generate much heat once the PL drops out.

6
Mods / Re: [0.97a] Ashes of The Domain
« on: June 19, 2024, 08:30:45 AM »
how to fill an empty Modular Constructor into useful one?

Build a Digital Codex Consortium.
You also may want to advance your research or the reprogramming will be costly.

7
Mods / Re: [0.97a] Diable Avionics-Joestar edition v2.9.1
« on: June 19, 2024, 02:44:40 AM »
Huh, weird, you sure you’re on the latest Version? I’ll have to another look

got 2.9.1, although if there's a subpatch i miightt not have it?

Good day to you.
Any news on that front? Happend to me too. Can't recover if after the inital recovery.

i just spawned in a new one and stowed it in my colony. I you'd like to resolve not having to do that any time it get broken, you'll need to dig through the ship files to remove the "UNBOARDABLE" tag.
On the note, poking through, i see that when you restore them the game is supposed to remove that tag.

Edit: On how to do that, open the ship_data.csv in DA's data > hulls, go to line 46, and shorten
"HIDE_IN_CODEX, UNBOARDABLE"
to
"HIDE_IN_CODEX"
That should hopefully just make the virtuous always boardable

I checked the files already, there aint no unboardable tag.

Virtuous,diableavionics_virtuous_skirmisher,Wunder Wanzer,Diable Avionics,diableavionics_unlockedFlicker,14,4000,450,7500,,700,75,,85,60,50,90,120,500,FRONT,,225,0.25,0.8,,,30,30,0,0,3,,9,190000,7,21,300,0.2,25,25,HIDE_IN_CODEX,restricted,,0.75,2,2,,17

The only thing standing out is "restricted". I'll remove that and see what happens.

That tag doesnt affect whetever or not its recoverable, if the unboardable tag is already removed, it should be recoverable, you may need to start a new save for it to take affect

I did use a new save. I found some guy on discord that has the same problem.
Quote:"I removed the UNBOARDABLE tag from virtuous, saved, loaded the game, checked the files and the tag still was erased, went into combat and virtuous is STILL unrecoverable. Is there any other settings that influence the recovery? It has "restricted" as a faction tag, can it be the case? It feels like I'm losing my mind with this crap."
I did ask him if he knows more - no answer so far.

Did you restart the game?
In my experience any ship (or weapon) modifications don't apply on just reloading, you have to close the game and launch it again.

That said, I just did a fresh download and the Virtuous doesn't seem to have the unboardable tag to begin with, so I'm not sure what that guy was removing.

8
Heh, at least you got some coding experience out of it.
But yeah, first thing I do whenever I return to Starsector is googling for mods that I enjoyed in the past and that don't seem to be around anymore.

9
phenir, don't you think proposing a solution to not engage with one of the largest most complex and defining systems within the game to avoid ONE particular feature is kinda counter productive?

i honestly dont get why some people so vigorously defend it rather than engage in a debate of how it could be improved. you have to admit its a very divisive feature that some folks really don't like.

i tend to agree with killer of fate, but ill put my own spin on it. if you choose to engage with all the game has to offer, the crisis system utterly dominates how that game will progress. and its largely the same every time. it feels so contrived and arbitrary.

I'd argue that the academy questline dominates playthroughs a lot more. That one takes quite a bit of time and effort on every run, no matter which direction you go, cause gate travel is always a necessity. It always plays out exactly the same too. In contrast, the crisis system only takes some preparation and an occassional intervention once you know what you're doing.

As for improvements, for those of us that enjoy the feature toning it down wouldn't improve anything. The only possibility I see is an option to turn it off, either in the base game or through an overhaul mod. Maybe you could add a quest to delay it indefinitely if you're not sure if you want to engage with it at the beginning of a playthrough.

10
There already is at least one unofficial updated version for DME, which I've been running without any notable issues for some time now.
Obviously I wouldn't link to it here but you can just google it. Unless this is a passion project or you're in it for the learning experience, in which case I haven't got a clue what to do.

11
im not convinced.
the concept sounds cool but every game feels the same. first its pirates, then its the path. the design poorly communicates what the player needs to do. resolution isnt always possible. and when it snowballs its WAY over the top. this single feature dominates the game and not in a good way.
Resolution is always possible. Maybe not if you mod your game but that's not the dev's fault.
The game straight up tells you how you can get the other side to stop being a pain. You can pay tribute to the local pirate boss, same for the path. PL and heg are both resolved in the same way, joining the league. Diktat is stealing their core. For tri-tach, you can raid them to death. For church you just talk to their leader and tell them to stop. And all of these (except tri-tach) are not including the major crisis solution which is combat.
a veteran of the game explaining a new player how to enjoy it is the antithesis of good game design tbh. If an individual like this, which there are many of, say the crisis system in its current form is too dominating, they are probably right. We are the ones with a bias. And we should probably try to understand their perspective more than enforcing our own.

I don't think that's an elitist thing, I'm far from a veteran and I didn't have any issues with the crisis system. So far anyway.

Most of the problems mentioned by OP seem to be largely self-inflicted.
You don't need colonies to "fund exploration", especially if you're running Nex and/or some exploration-focused mods. I'd argue that early colonies are more of a drain on resources and later on there's not much to spend that surplus on except more colony stuff. If you're focused on exploring you can just find most of the things you'd have to spend money on if you stayed home.
The various fleets roaming your system are usually only an issue if you do stay home. Otherwise pirates might put a bit of a dent on your profit margins but it doesn't stop you from progressing. As for the actual crisis attacks, they can certainly be a problem the first time you run into them but on subsequent playthroughs you know what to expect and can prepare. Or you simply delay colonies until your fleet can handle whatever is thrown at you.

That said, I agree that crisis fleets not being tied to the actual strength of each faction can feel pretty silly. I also wouldn't be opposed to an option to simply turn the whole mechanic off for players that want their colonies to stay perfectly safe and pristine at all times while they're out in the far reaches of space.
tbh, i just don't like the turn the game is taking. Too many scripted sequences can take away from the player's experience by forcing them onto the same path over and over. The best thing about Starsector was building up your empire. And the vague nature of NPCs made it so that every experience could have been interpreted differently. With the lore of factions being so ominous that everyone could think about them a totally different thing based on stuff like their patrol dialogue, planet descriptions and music. Music being the most important and one of the more beautiful parts of Starsector. Even if it's so short. And the crisis as well as recently added missions are kinda the antithesis of that. Why? Well, I need to explain if I already started. The academy quest is great, but it's also really optional. The way to encounter the academy is to interact with a specific event in a bar, talk with a fleet going somewhere, finding a thing on a planet and then bringing it to the academy, and then choosing to interact with whoever is in there. Also being able not to. Whereas the missions added recently work kinda differently. The Sindrian Diktat mission straight up attacks you in a bar. The LC's mission sneaks onto your selection menu by putting the option to go to a shrine where the bar should be... This feels like something Jehovah's witnesses would do. And the crisis system literally forces you into a series of missions. These things might feel entertaining at first for the first time playing the game and encountering them. But Starsector is a lot about replay value, climbing up, making a specific build to a specific fleet, winning... Gambling your savings. And going forward... Scripted sequences may ruin that experience. Therefore it was good that the Academy quest was so... To some extent hidden. Like in Dark Souls. And this is why imo it's bad for the Crisis to work the way it does now.

On the other hand, new players' frustrations are kinda different to mine. The thing about crisis is that it definitely feels like a threat worthy of an experienced player. But the game does not prepare you enough to said threat. Therefore it should be entirely optional of when that threat appears. And the player should have the option of encountering it the moment they feel comfortable with it. Otherwise it will just squash them, because the game's mechanics are exceptionally convoluted. And on top of that the game isn't like Dark Souls. If you die, you reload the save. But it's not like you can git gud. Most of the things in the game are about just completely shifting how your fleet is and what kind of skills you picked. So, it feels less like a skill check and more like a knowledge test. Therefore the appearance of sudden challenges isn't as interesting. And the game feels way more enjoyable when it just gives you... Options.

I feel like the crisis should be averted. And the old system of expeditions should be brought back, but toned down significantly. So that raids and expedition fleets are far more rare. And the crisis events should be reworked into their own missions. And they along the current Sindrian Diktat and LC one should be made as hidden as the academy quest. And the player should only be interacting with said quests if they choose to. Not because someone beat them up in a bar. And then teleported to Volturn the next day.

The only exception to this should be the Hegemony crisis. If the player actively chooses to use AI, it's their own fault they got the attention of the Hegemony. LC, Sindrian, PL, TT crisis however feel kinda forced... And I wish these factions were restored to their old state in which they seemed too busy doing their own shady business to notice you. With the exception of an occasional rogue political cell coming all the way to your world to make you feel miserable for no particular reason.

Yeah, we seem to have very different preferences when it comes to content and how it is delivered.
I only return to this game every few versions because after a few playthroughs I feel I've done everything there is to do and it gets stale. I certainly wouldn't be interested in yet another exploration run where I just leisurely travel around, or yet another round of colony building without any pressure, while I grow to be the dominant power of the whole sector. I've done all that in previous versions.
From a lore perspective I also don't really see how all factions except the Hegemony should just leave you be. Considering the state of the sector you quickly grow into a comparative powerhouse once you start building colonies, so I'd expect them to be very worried and try to do something about it.

As I said, I wouldn't mind the option to turn crisis or other scripted interactions off, but your description of an ideal state sounds like the gameplay from several versions ago and if it was returned to that as the default I'd probably stop playing altogether.

12
Add option for player faction to automatically resist the police colony crisis

Could you elaborate on that please?
I'd rather not update mid-run to figure it out myself unless absolutely necessary.
It's a bit like the Hegemony inspection:
Normally (and previously always) the player faction will cooperate with the police raid, unless the player personally fights one of the raid fleets, or the player was already hostile to independents. Now there's a toggle to make them automatically resist the raid if they can (can't be turned off if the raid fleets have already reached the target system). Unlike the Hegemony inspection, resisting won't make the independent faction hostile.

Sounds great, thanks for the reply.
Would love to see that option for vanilla fleets without having to start a war each time, but that's probably outside the scope of the mod.

13
im not convinced.
the concept sounds cool but every game feels the same. first its pirates, then its the path. the design poorly communicates what the player needs to do. resolution isnt always possible. and when it snowballs its WAY over the top. this single feature dominates the game and not in a good way.
Resolution is always possible. Maybe not if you mod your game but that's not the dev's fault.
The game straight up tells you how you can get the other side to stop being a pain. You can pay tribute to the local pirate boss, same for the path. PL and heg are both resolved in the same way, joining the league. Diktat is stealing their core. For tri-tach, you can raid them to death. For church you just talk to their leader and tell them to stop. And all of these (except tri-tach) are not including the major crisis solution which is combat.
a veteran of the game explaining a new player how to enjoy it is the antithesis of good game design tbh. If an individual like this, which there are many of, say the crisis system in its current form is too dominating, they are probably right. We are the ones with a bias. And we should probably try to understand their perspective more than enforcing our own.

I don't think that's an elitist thing, I'm far from a veteran and I didn't have any issues with the crisis system. So far anyway.

Most of the problems mentioned by OP seem to be largely self-inflicted.
You don't need colonies to "fund exploration", especially if you're running Nex and/or some exploration-focused mods. I'd argue that early colonies are more of a drain on resources and later on there's not much to spend that surplus on except more colony stuff. If you're focused on exploring you can just find most of the things you'd have to spend money on if you stayed home.
The various fleets roaming your system are usually only an issue if you do stay home. Otherwise pirates might put a bit of a dent on your profit margins but it doesn't stop you from progressing. As for the actual crisis attacks, they can certainly be a problem the first time you run into them but on subsequent playthroughs you know what to expect and can prepare. Or you simply delay colonies until your fleet can handle whatever is thrown at you.

That said, I agree that crisis fleets not being tied to the actual strength of each faction can feel pretty silly. I also wouldn't be opposed to an option to simply turn the whole mechanic off for players that want their colonies to stay perfectly safe and pristine at all times while they're out in the far reaches of space.

14
Add option for player faction to automatically resist the police colony crisis

Could you elaborate on that please?
I'd rather not update mid-run to figure it out myself unless absolutely necessary.

15
General Discussion / Re: unnecessary weapon tier list
« on: June 12, 2024, 12:31:02 AM »
Don't play enough vanilla to judge, but I like that we got a one man's trash is another man's treasure situation going on in the comments.
That really speaks for the design and balance.

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