Fractal Softworks Forum
Starsector => General Discussion => Topic started by: selkathguy on August 05, 2015, 09:19:27 AM
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I am going to ask the bannable question: Do we have an ETA for .7 or any major build? I am not looking for a specific date and time. I am looking for an estimated release time window. Something more specific than say 2015Q3 but not necessarily a day. Thanks
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When it's good and ready. SoonTM
Personally, I don't want any rushed features, or any half-assed gimmicks just because people WANT an update sooner. This is a game-changing update, and for anything to not be working right could potentially be game-breaking.
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When it's good and ready. SoonTM
You misunderstand me. I'm not rushing anything. I'm simply asking so that I know when to expect it. So that I'm not checking the Starsector page twice a day every day for a release that wont happen for another 10 months.
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by the end of this month for sure. Guess*
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Yea im a little concerned too, Alex was normally every Day here. Now he had 2 brakes over 7 Day's where he did not Post anything.
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We were all thinking and wondering, you just had the guts to ask, bravo!
But yeah it would be nice to have a bit more of an idea than "sometime this (or next for all we know) year." We don't mind if the deadline isn't necessarily reached (well I wouldn't at least). If there was a "I'm hoping within X months, give or take a month or so, at least we wouldn't need to check every day having our hopes up and then dashed. Anyone catch my drift? No? Okay *hides in corner*
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It's the summer. He may well be taking time off.
In any case I'm sure he's hard at work and this is just one of the regular lulls in the forum. Sometimes there's just not much activity from him or anyone else.
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Yeah, forum's just been fairly dead lately. If you check Alex's profile I guaruntee he's been on either today or yesterday. I often see him listed as online down at the bottom of the main index.
I usually check in several times a day, myself. This is a nice forum and there's often something new to read.
In regards to the next release, I figure it will come out before the end of the year, barring another major feature announcement.
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I know Alex has another job/real life things, but we are fast approaching a year since the last release (which is very unhealthy for an alpha) and I just want to be sure the project isn't dying. This is one of my favorite games with the greatest potential.
When it's good and ready.
From personal experience, that is how projects die.
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We are fast approaching a year since the last release (which is very unhealthy for an alpha)
At this rate, it's entirely possible Starsector won't be released until 2018, assuming .8, .9, and 1.0 take the same amount of time. Starsector is a great game and all, but that is a VERY long time
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I know Alex has another job/real life things, but we are fast approaching a year since the last release (which is very unhealthy for an alpha) and I just want to be sure the project isn't dying. This is one of my favorite games with the greatest potential.
When it's good and ready.
From personal experience, that is how projects die.
Last Update for Major Release, 0.54.1a: January 04, 2013
^ 9 months V
Major Release, 0.6a: September 13, 2013
^ 4 months V
Last Update for Major Release (Plus more content), 0.6.2a: January 17, 2014
^ 10 months V
Major Release, 0.65a: October 20, 2014
^ 5 months V
Latest Update for Major Release, 0.65.2a: February 10, 2015
^ 7 months V
Present: August 5, 2015
I'm pretty sure 7 months is still a fair way off from a full year.
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Definitely around and all that, working on the 0.7a release. Did take a week off and went on vacation a little while back!
I'm simply asking so that I know when to expect it. So that I'm not checking the Starsector page twice a day every day for a release that wont happen for another 10 months.
Well, it's definitely not going to take another 10 months :) But beyond that... I get what you're asking, right. But if I gave you an answer, say, to within a month or so, there's very good chance it'd be wrong. Probably a higher chance for it to be wrong than right, actually. I don't really want to be in that position, where I feel like, "oh, I've got to make the release sooner than it's ready because I said I would". Basically, any answer is 1) likely to be wrong and 2) added pressure I'd just as soon do without. (The alternative is to not make the answer be wrong by hitting the approximate date, but then quality suffers.)
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Definitely around and all that, working on the 0.7a release. Did take a week off and went on vacation a little while back!
I'm simply asking so that I know when to expect it. So that I'm not checking the Starsector page twice a day every day for a release that wont happen for another 10 months.
Well, it's definitely not going to take another 10 months :) But beyond that... I get what you're asking, right. But if I gave you an answer, say, to within a month or so, there's very good chance it'd be wrong. Probably a higher chance for it to be wrong than right, actually. I don't really want to be in that position, where I feel like, "oh, I've got to make the release sooner than it's ready because I said I would". Basically, any answer is 1) likely to be wrong and 2) added pressure I'd just as soon do without. (The alternative is to not make the answer be wrong by hitting the approximate date, but then quality suffers.)
Let's just say Soon. And be comfortable in the knowledge that the release will be as polished and feature-full as every other release Alex has had :)
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I'm pretty sure 7 months is still a fair way off from a full year.
Major releases, not hotfixes.
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I know Alex has another job/real life things, but we are fast approaching a year since the last release (which is very unhealthy for an alpha) and I just want to be sure the project isn't dying. This is one of my favorite games with the greatest potential.
When it's good and ready.
From personal experience, that is how projects die.
Last Update for Major Release, 0.54.1a: January 04, 2013
^ 9 months V
Major Release, 0.6a: September 13, 2013
^ 4 months V
Last Update for Major Release (Plus more content), 0.6.2a: January 17, 2014
^ 10 months V
Major Release, 0.65a: October 20, 2014
^ 5 months V
Latest Update for Major Release, 0.65.2a: February 10, 2015
^ 7 months V
Present: August 5, 2015
I'm pretty sure 7 months is still a fair way off from a full year.
Holy crap i've been here for a long time.
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I too am looking forward for the next big update. And i say that not to rush either, just to show that there are people (like myself) who have grown to love this little infant stage game, and its possible bright future! So im just excited to see it grow. Im mostly looking forward to being able to do stuff with the planets we see (my own evil space empire). ;) If that ever happens. Hope you all have a great day.
grtz
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I'm pretty sure 7 months is still a fair way off from a full year.
Major releases, not hotfixes.
Then that makes it 11 months, including the month it was released.
0.54a -> 0.6a 11 months
0.6a -> 0.65a 14 months
0.65a -> Present 11 months
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As Alex said: There is no prediction of when the release will take place because the prediction will inevitably be wrong.
If you don't want to keep hitting F5 on the home page, just check every other month or somesuch, it's hardly a big deal if you find out about the release a month late (and you'll probably hear about it through other channels in fairly short order anyway).
If you really must be there on release day, use the RSS feed, that's what it's for.
When it's good and ready.
From personal experience, that is how projects die.
A project that gets released in a half-baked state is functionally almost as dead as one that never gets released.
From what I've seen, if an indie game doesn't get done it's often because:
- It was too ambitious to begin with (in our case it's a little late to be changing that now)
- It went through feature creep (see previous)
- Too many revisions were made to existing content (I don't know how likely this is, but I imagine rushing Alex when he's trying to get it right the first time isn't going to help)
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If you really must be there on release day, use the RSS feed, that's what it's for.
(Also the mailing list, though I generally send to that a day or two after the release, to give an opportunity for a hotfix if necessary.)
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Seeing major build release and Alex being the last poster made me incredibly excited. Then just depressed.
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Honestly, given what's gone into this one and what's apparently under the hood (from the sound of things, most of the major pieces to get to Beta are going in, other than Outposts / some sort of strategic-level metagame, and, of course, content) I can't say that I'm either worried about the length or concerned about it, frankly. This part was going to take a while. At least now it's relatively smooth sailing to the end, other than the last wrinkles UI-wise.
If there's anything I've learned from watching this project get done, it's that the low-level code support needed to get the high-level content done is a prime strategic task; stuff like the backend data structures, file handling, and UI framework, etc. eat a surprisingly large amount of time.
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I will point out that this question gets asked every few months in between every major release. Been that way since I picked the game up, and that would have been... I wanna say 0.52? Whatever May of 2012's version was, because that's when I dropped the cash.
Anyways, yeah, it'll get done when it gets done. It feels like there's an exponential growth with every build; I think I remember playing like the first version after the campaign mode became a thing (however utterly barebones it was), as I don't remember a missions-only selection. Then suddenly we had ship systems, and phase cloaks. Then suddenly personal skills, then MULTI-SECTOR GAMEPLAY, then TRADING AND EVENTS AND FACTION RELATIONSHIPS!?
Point is, it just keeps growing, bro. Just keep riding it out, knawmsayin'?
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I know Alex has another job ...
Is this true? I had always assumed that Alex's primary focus was this game, and in that light, the time between releases has indeed seemed more than a little slow. But if he has a separate full-time job and Starsector is something he codes on nights and weekends, then that explains the development pace a lot better. Although I would wish that the early access adopters like myself had provided him with enough income to make this his full-time pursuit, perhaps that's not been the case?
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I know Alex has another job ...
Is this true?
In short, no. Alex quit his previous job some years ago in order to focus on Sector.
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Seeing major build release and Alex being the last poster made me incredibly excited. Then just depressed.
Yeah, any info regarding updates will go in the Announcements Sub-Forum along with a news bulletin (which appears under your avatar on your screen) saying something about .7 being released.
I know Alex has another job ...
Is this true? I had always assumed that Alex's primary focus was this game, and in that light, the time between releases has indeed seemed more than a little slow. But if he has a separate full-time job and Starsector is something he codes on nights and weekends, then that explains the development pace a lot better. Although I would wish that the early access adopters like myself had provided him with enough income to make this his full-time pursuit, perhaps that's not been the case?
He DID have a job but he quit it to work on SS full time. (Use to work work with David IIRC)
Edit: Ninja'ed by Gathars...
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I am grateful for all the effort Alex and the others have put forth.
I think I've been miscommunicating my point which is to have more of a two-way process. I'm not trying to rush a full release of the game, that could take another 2 years for all that matters to me. It should be as Alex envisions it. I just wanted to be able to see the project develop over time and to be a part of it; to be able to throw my two cents in after these new features are blogged about. I haven't been posting about the blogs much since it is all speculation from our end. We just have to wait until .7 which will be (essentially) a new game with the amount of new mechanics (I'm looking forward to it!). I'm not interested in playing the full game sooner, rather I'd like to be a part of the process as it grows and be able to speak from experience with the game as it develops rather than from speculation on how I think the announced features will play out.
I am still unsure if I articulated myself well enough. I am not a wordsmith. :(
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He DID have a job but he quit it to work on SS full time. (Use to work work with David IIRC)
Naw, he used to work with Ivaylo. I did however do art for a previous game by Alex way back when.
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I am grateful for all the effort Alex and the others have put forth.
I think I've been miscommunicating my point which is to have more of a two-way process. I'm not trying to rush a full release of the game, that could take another 2 years for all that matters to me. It should be as Alex envisions it. I just wanted to be able to see the project develop over time and to be a part of it; to be able to throw my two cents in after these new features are blogged about. I haven't been posting about the blogs much since it is all speculation from our end. We just have to wait until .7 which will be (essentially) a new game with the amount of new mechanics (I'm looking forward to it!). I'm not interested in playing the full game sooner, rather I'd like to be a part of the process as it grows and be able to speak from experience with the game as it develops rather than from speculation on how I think the announced features will play out.
I am still unsure if I articulated myself well enough. I am not a wordsmith. :(
Well, I know the forums seem dead, but I assure you they are not. In fact, now more than ever is the time to go chime in on the Suggestions forum (either with your own or in favor or someone else's), or provide feedback on the Blog discussion threads. Don't know if you've noticed, but the Fractal Softworks team is definitely active in reading these discussion, and Alex actually is great about throwing in explanations for why X or Y suggestion wouldn't work because of something else he's got cooking, he personally answers bug reports, etc.
As the game grows, of course, the cozy direct interaction will likely fall by the wayside as a natural process, but for now, make your voice heard. And rest assured that this game won't be a perpetual alpha -- at the rate it's been growing, it'll just keep expanding slowly but very steadily.
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now more than ever is the time to go chime in on the Suggestions forum (either with your own or in favor or someone else's), or provide feedback on the Blog discussion threads.
As I said, feedback is almost worthless when it's not based on anything but speculation. I don't have the thing that I'm supposed to be giving feedback for, so I can't say whether a feature is well-executed or not if I cant see the feature in practice. There have been so many new feature announcements and the game has changed so much from the version I have that there's no basis for me to be valuable.
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now more than ever is the time to go chime in on the Suggestions forum (either with your own or in favor or someone else's), or provide feedback on the Blog discussion threads.
As I said, feedback is almost worthless when it's not based on anything but speculation. I don't have the thing that I'm supposed to be giving feedback for, so I can't say whether a feature is well-executed or not if I cant see the feature in practice. There have been so many new feature announcements and the game has changed so much from the version I have that there's no basis for me to be valuable.
Give feedback on current builds, or community suggestions. And if you think feedback is worthless, bear in mind that the team does watch what transpires in the months-long blog post threads.
I'm not sure exactly what you're getting at, to be quite honest. Is there something that bothers you about the current game? Find a thread about your issue, or make one if there isn't. Do you disagree with some concept Alex put out? Reply to a blog discussion thread. Plenty of that happened during the flux damage boost/ammo removals. The team explained quite clearly their rationale.
I'm not sure if you're... What, disappointed in something yet to come? Or that's in the game now? Because alpha or not, pretty much every game will have some issue for someone... And it won't be possible to implement everyone's perfect solution.
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It would be kinda fun if Starsector was open source and we could gawk at the repository commit logs and such (and download/compile intermediate versions for testing). But I presume Alex has already made his decision here, and this wouldn't be much good for people who aren't code-savvy anyway.
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It would be kinda fun if Starsector was open source and we could gawk at the repository commit logs and such[...]
I don't think a repo is necessary. It's a paid product so having an open repo leaves you more vulnerable to a leak. In addition, there is no community code contribution to the main game (to my knowledge), so it would be read only. I wouldnt want anyone playing a completely broken version of my game either, so there would be another branch for semi-stable development previews. It's these development previews that I wish were a thing, but they could just be compiled occasionally.
Another problem with people compiling off the repo (unless you have proper revision organization which I think is unnecessary for this project) is that everyone will be compiling different code at different times and speak from different experiences. With the development previews, it's a little easier to version.
There is always a balance, between frequent small updates and rare huge ones. I believe the current pattern is very much on the latter end of the spectrum. This isn't quite at "complaint" level yet, just more of a suggestion/request/assessment of whether or not I am alone in this.
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Of course everyone feel pretty much the same, but sadly every previous major update took roughly the same time, and the one after the next should be no exception either. After all, in term of core features there will be only Industry, Exploration and the Player Faction/Base left, and the latter need the formers. Maybe in a couple of years the updates might shift toward a more frequent rhythm as the development shift toward content rather than game mechanics.
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Well, after the Framework, there's a fair amount of Content that really should get built, so that there's a lot of game to play. This is one of those areas where what Alex is doing now is clearly aimed at that future-tense period, when getting the Content in will be a major priority.
Now that Missions and long-term "relationships" with NPCs (both fleet-wise and in terms of dealing with semi-static locations) will be an area that's essentially Done, it'll be interesting to see how these final puzzle pieces get in.
On the Open Source thing... I think that a bunch of people would be willing to help out or fork it to do various crazy stuff with the core engine; the problem there is largely that until the framework is done, there isn't much point in getting in the middle of Alex's vision, and he'd face more management hassles than it would be worth. I sometimes think it'd be worth it, in terms of critique and small fixes (I know I'd optimize a couple of things I've profiled, lol, because they're low-hanging fruit), but probably not even that.
As it is, modders can do an incredible amount of Stuff that has largely not happened because we're lazy or busy with RL, not because it's impossible. The only major thing that we can't mod atm that I feel like would open up a lot of things is that we can't mess with a lot of the low-level drawing code; that's made it difficult to do certain types of project without really terrible kludges.
But I think non-coders would be very surprised by what's actually possible right now, though. For example, with the AI exposed, it's possible to do stuff that doesn't look like SS at all, in terms of feel, like implement various forms of pathfinding, etc. But if you're new around here, you're probably not familiar with all of the crazy stuff that's already been done, and most of the serious coders have been pretty quiet lately, because we have been waiting for the framework to arrive at a point where we won't have to rebuild our main code from scratch (in my case, for the fourth time, lol).
I think it'd be extremely interesting to see the source released or put up for sale at a reasonable price at some future date, post-Steam, when the game's done its main run, simply because I'm guessing by the time it's Done, Alex won't really want to look at it ever again; this has been even more of an epic than EV's development was. But I can't imagine Alex letting us see / touch that stuff beforehand. He's been remarkably nice about us pushing the edges of the EULA as it is ;)
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Of course everyone feel pretty much the same, but sadly every previous major update took roughly the same time, and the one after the next should be no exception either. After all, in term of core features there will be only Industry, Exploration and the Player Faction/Base left, and the latter need the formers. Maybe in a couple of years the updates...
Oh dear please no. If by couple of years you mean two years alright, but I imagine the game being done in the next 24-28ish months. Is that really (most likely) off by years?
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I estimate 3-4 years at least before this game is done, given the rate of updates thus far. I don't have a problem with it: Alex gives us a fun major update about once a year then modders expand that a lot further, the occasional cool blog post livens things up, and Alex is always around on the forums.
Even if Alex were to ditch Starsector right now, it would still be miles ahead of most games.
The way I see it, when we finally get to Starsector 1.0 it will be all the sweeter for how long it took to get there. :)
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I shall throw in my 2 cents here as well.
As someone who has been around these parts for a VERY long time, SS isn't a game I play very often anymore, but most nights before I go to bed I click on its bookmark on my web browser, and take a look around. sometimes I may go a few days, even weeks or months between these checks, but the fact of the matter is, even though i've been here for 3+ years it's less about the game now, it's more about the community, the idea behind it all. Don't get me wrong here the game is the underlying background, the spine of the whole ordeal, but after seeing what the modders did with the game as it is already there is no doubt in my mind, that when this game does come out it will be fantastic. I choose the word fantastic because quite frankly even my considerable vocabulary doesn't possess a word adequate enough to describe the game or better, the idea of the game. When I check in I don't stay too long, I make a few posts, read the latest news and then go about my life. Because of the way I treat the forums i've never had an ill time here, nor have I ever experienced the feeling that alex is too slow, or that the community is dieing, in fact every once in awhile when I see people complain that the forum is dieing I hop over to the modding section and see nearly constant posts, new mods appearing, old modders helping out the newbies, it's amazing how an area so filled with life is just ignored when speaking of the forum as a whole. True my method isn't the most interesting way, and most of you will probably ignore me because you don't agree with the way I see it. But you have to understand there are many games out there on this little blue marble, and while you're away with them Alex won't mind, he knows how it goes, especially since he knows that when he does release an update, a blog post, or the game itself we'll all come back to him.
Over the years i've met new people here, seen old friends leave the community, seen new people rise to fame in the community, and then seen them vanish into thin air, I've seen people get banned who I had once held conversations with, never to return. And more than anything else i've seen people show up out of the blue ranting, raving, complaining about why the game never updates, why the game sucks, or how to improve the game as a thin veil for just being a right ass. ( not saying this is the OP) Let me tell you something i've observed over my time here, these people, always disappear within a month, and never return. This game does not need them, this community does not want them, and we have no mercy.
The important thing to take note of here, is that it will happen, Alex is still here, he is still working, David is still working, and making them take time out of their day to tell people they are still here is just slowing them down even more.
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I am busy enough with real-life and/or other gaming projects to not want to waste much time drooling over Starsector releases. All the more temptation for me to cheat to reach the endgame (my favorite part of the game) quickly instead of grinding for days or longer if/when the next release comes.