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News: New blog post: A True and Accurate History of the Persean Sector (8/16/17); Starsector 0.8.1a is out!
 
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Question: What do you desire most?
More ships - 75 (61%)
More weapons - 38 (30.9%)
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Author Topic: [0.7.2a] Tiandong Heavy Industries v1.1.2 - Updated 1/10/17  (Read 92701 times)
Dark.Revenant
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« Reply #240 on: September 17, 2016, 11:26:13 PM »

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Alex_Kill
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« Reply #241 on: September 17, 2016, 11:26:57 PM »

sorry, bad english, i meant that i can't run SS + citadel on 0.7.2 so i decided to play on 0.7.1 also now it seems that some mods are unable to download for previous versions as for this one, so if you have=) i would greatly appreciate it, sorry for inconvenience, by the way, I don't like Rum.
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MesoTroniK
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« Reply #242 on: January 10, 2017, 09:11:05 PM »

Evening folks, here is a minor maintenance type update of THI so go ahead and grab the new version from original post.

This update should be save compatible and includes updated faction relationships, added THI retrofitting support for new factions that have come out, balance / polish changes, bugfixes and a new weapon making THI ready for the tournament. Keep in mind if you use DynaSector that you must update it for the new weapon to appear in the campaign and in the end I advise using the Recommended Mods list as shown in the original post.


Ultra Autocannon
Large Ballistic
A long-range shield suppressing autocannon, useful for supplementing burst fire weaponry.

--

Anyways, feel free to leave feedback, complaints and suggestions!

Changelog
1.1.2

- Fixed Tiandong not posting bounties in random map Nexerelin games.
- Updated faction relationships.
- Metelson Industries (faction mod) ships can now be converted at the Retrofitting submarket (Acutor -> Xiakou, Custos -> Hanzhong, Vigil -> Wujun).
- Grytpype and Moriarty Defence Authority (faction mod) ships can now be converted at the Retrofitting submarket (Tarsus (GM), Tarsus (GMs) -> Tuolu, Lasher (GM), Lasher (GMs Blue), Lasher (GMs Gold), Lasher (GMs Green), Lasher (GMs Red), Lasher (GMs) -> Laohu, Gladius (GM) -> Jian).
- Raccoon's Arms Pack (ship pack mod) ships can now be converted at the Retrofitting submarket (Gemini (G) -> Tianshui, Sunder (R) -> Qianzi, Hammerhead (R) -> Hujing).
- Added a couple of new variants, adjusted some old ones.
- Added Ultra Autocannon weapon.
- Macro Cannon on hit secondary AOE frag damage / push force outer radius decreased to 75 from 200, inner radius decreased to 50 from 100, and slightly improved its explosion visuals.
- Rotary Autocannon now fires one shot at a time instead of a three round burst (same overall rate of fire), improved firing sound, and improved its animation script.
- Burst Flak Cannon and Bulwark Flares AOE frag damage / push force outer radius decreased to 75 from 150, fuze range randomization removed, now interacts properly with exotic scripted defenses such as Exi Repulsors / Teleporters and BRDY Scalar Rejector / Scalar Repulsor, can no longer deal double damage in some edge case scenarios (for real this time), no longer triggers the AOE explosion on direct hits to neutral / friendly targets, improved visuals for direct hits, and various script improvements.
- Muscle LRM max burn delay increased to 0.35 from 0.25 seconds (reduces clumping a bit), will now MIRV on flares if successfully distracted by one, and will properly interact with exotic scripted missile defense systems.
- Concussion Missile on hit secondary AOE frag damage / push force outer radius decreased to 150 from 300.
- Very subtle improvements to some sprites (I bet no one but me will ever notice them).
- Probably some things I don't recall.
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Sy
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« Reply #243 on: January 11, 2017, 11:18:39 AM »

*tries two of these on a Hanzhong*
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SpacePoliticianAndaZealot
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« Reply #244 on: January 12, 2017, 04:58:09 AM »

*sees the Ultra AC gif*

*dong expansion: succesful*

I'm curious: how much room for "improvement" is there ie. how many of the vanilla weapon designs can you amp up?
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Tartiflette
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« Reply #245 on: January 12, 2017, 07:20:56 AM »

Many, actually... But that's another story for later  Wink
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Sy
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« Reply #246 on: January 12, 2017, 10:01:41 AM »

how many of the vanilla weapon designs can you amp up?
i remember when i first started using mods, there were lots of weapons like "this is just the dual-rack version of Reapers, this is just the medium version of Ion Cannon, this is just the medium version of Antimatter Blaster", and several mod weapons that had three different versions of them for each of the 3 main damage types, without any other distinguishing characteristics. :D

at some point most of these were scrapped, because as it turns out, having every type of weapon for every type of mount is problematic both for balancing reasons and because it makes all the individual weapons and mounts a lot less interesting and unique. the great weapon and ship variety, and the large number of different stats that play together to differentiate them, is one of the things that makes Starsector stand out from so many other sci-fi games.

not saying the Ultra Autocannon falls into this trap, it's actually quite different from the small and medium Autocannons, but that comment just reminded me of those old mods. :]
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MesoTroniK
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« Reply #247 on: January 12, 2017, 02:24:09 PM »

It is becoming rather hard to think of more weapons for THI, and that is not a bad thing. For in the end it is a faction mod of limited scope meant to act as an extension of vanilla in a way. Anyways, I do have some large missile weapons planned, once they get ships that can equip them.
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Sy
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« Reply #248 on: January 12, 2017, 03:07:12 PM »

honestly, the amount of ships and weapons in mods that are all unique in some way, even without special gimmicks, is kinda crazy. Alex seems reluctant to add more of them because he feels there isn't much room left for stuff that doesn't already exist, but i think mods show how much is possible without diluting what is already there.
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Midnight Kitsune
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« Reply #249 on: February 10, 2017, 11:40:57 PM »

Any update on when the next update is gonna drop? Or any hints or teases about what is to come?
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Stop trying to balance the game around a few minmaxers...
Programming is like sex:
One mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life.

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MesoTroniK
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« Reply #250 on: February 10, 2017, 11:56:17 PM »

Unless some bug or serious balance issue pops up before 0.8... Not going to update before 0.8, and the chance of an update being required is very low as the tourney did not reveal flaws that had to be corrected.

Hm, future stuff... In no particular order:

- Couple of large missile weapons when they get ships that can use them.
- Poking a couple of ship sprites here and there.
- New cruiser refits.
- New frigate refits.
- Super frigate (every faction needs one after all).
- Some insane new fighters, because 0.8 will be a horrifying enabler.
- More IBBs.
- Fancy campaign layer stuff.

Oh god, how insane I am! Back to spriting the blue ones...
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Takion Kasukedo
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« Reply #251 on: February 11, 2017, 08:34:03 AM »

o.o a super frigate and new fighters?

Sign me up for 0.8 superfighters, just what i'd need for a carrier fleet (triple Astral anyone?)
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Phearlock
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« Reply #252 on: February 17, 2017, 06:47:31 AM »

Anyone have any good loadouts for the Qianzi? Been trying to make it work but having issues working around the triphammers flux cost. I can't fire it together with other weapons for very long, it can't do that much damage by itself, and I can't effectively strike and retreat due to the combination of short range and the Qianzi being very sluggish.

Usually supplementing with missile fire would be a great solution for bursty flux-heavy weapons but with the missile hardpoints removed that isn't an option. (What poor engineer approved that change?  Grin )
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Sy
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« Reply #253 on: February 17, 2017, 01:13:14 PM »

Anyone have any good loadouts for the Qianzi?
i think something along the lines of my tournament loadout should work well in player hands too:
2 or 3 small kinetics, a single Ion Beam or Heavy Ion Blaster, hullmods for speed and durability (if you have access to them), lots of flux vents, and some PD if you've got OP to spare. Resistant Flux Conduits would be useful as well, and if you're using Unstable Injector instead of Augmented Engines, you'll probably want to protect your engines with Extended Shields and maybe even Accelerated Shields. Maximized Ordnance is usually not a good idea in the campaign, but you'll get additional OP from skills anyway.

the idea is to rely mostly on kinetics to deal flux-efficient damage to shields, then overload and break through armor with the Triphammer, with shield-piercing ion weapons making it harder for enemies to disengage or shoot back.
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stormbringer951
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« Reply #254 on: February 17, 2017, 01:39:40 PM »

Anyone have any good loadouts for the Qianzi? Been trying to make it work but having issues working around the triphammers flux cost. I can't fire it together with other weapons for very long, it can't do that much damage by itself, and I can't effectively strike and retreat due to the combination of short range and the Qianzi being very sluggish.

Usually supplementing with missile fire would be a great solution for bursty flux-heavy weapons but with the missile hardpoints removed that isn't an option. (What poor engineer approved that change?  Grin )

The Qianzi does a ton of damage with the triphammer, a little less than a Harpoon for each shot. You want as much of that as possible to hit armour, so you want kinetics to be fluxing out their ship first so you only take shots at them when they are at high flux and you might be able to overload them, unless you outgun them significantly enough that you don't need to worry about the flux war. Fortunately, the Qianzi can mount three forward-facing ballistics. The trick to fitting ships which have very high weapons flux costs and have slightly subpar speed is to put Safety Overrides on them:


Some quick testing in the mission combat sim (this setup has no ship OP bonuses, so you have a lot of wiggle room to add stuff in campaign) says that this variant can kill three enforcers while under AI control, within its peak performance timer, so it's even fairly good as an early to midgame AI ship. With 10 caps, under player control it can solo an Eagle or other medium cruisers that don't have better kinetic damage. With auxiliary thrusters it eats frigates, and the AI misses far fewer shots from the triphammer with auxiliary thrusters fitted against frigate/destroyer sized targets. The key to this is getting them to high flux with the three needlers, using the triphammer as little as possible (trying to overload them at high flux, or maybe giving them some encouragement to raise their shields just as your needlers are about to fire at low flux). Once you have armour stripped off, you don't need to fire the triphammer if there's no need because needlers are ideal against bare-hull ships relying on their shields.

You can replace a needler with a Burchel beam repeater if you need more armour damage and PD (the Burchel is a really good weapon for getting both for the price of one). A light assault gun also works if you're regularly fighting armoured ships that don't mind shield-tanking you, and a railgun if you prefer to have some sustained kinetics (I personally think stacking burst kinetic damage is stronger, but ship fitting is largely a matter of preference).

As you get more OP, add more vents, caps, ITU, RFC, perhaps hardened/extended shields. Fit more damage weapons in the energy mediums once you feel very comfortable with the survivability of the setup. Bursty energy mediums let you kill/overload high flux targets. A heavy ion blaster or ion beam or other long/medium range ion weapons will force enemy ships to keep their shields up and not armour-tank your needlers. Heavy ion blasters in particular are effective against ships with concentrated weapon layouts and can make your ship extremely survivable and kill things faster because when you initially win the flux war, you can keep their weapons/engines disabled and not take fire while you fire your triphammer and needlers flat-out while they helplessly sit there and have to eat the punishment. Ion beams can be used as laser pointers to force enemies to shield up from far away. Graviton beams are much maligned but offer dependable kinetic pressure if you just need a tiny bit more.

EDIT: Sy ninja'd me. Funnily enough I started out from Sy's tournament loadout above. Reasoning for my changes:

Sy's loadout is a less extreme version of mine, with maximised ordnance giving more flexibility but much less pronounced strengths and weaknesses. Sy's ship is a more balanced mainline fleet ship; this ship is intended to kill many ships in a series of 1v1 duels, and when outnumbered to force enemy ships to back off with a quick needler volley to give it a bit more time to work on a chosen opponent. I heavily prefer burst needlers over sustained railguns since I think burst is better for flux trades, but worth noting that his fit applies flux and damage slightly better against ships that don't raise shields against you due to ions and not potentially wasting bursts on armour when their ship drops shields, but is less efficient in straight up shields-up flux trading.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 02:12:09 PM by stormbringer951 » Logged
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