Fractal Softworks Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Painting the Stars (02/07/20); Updated the Forum Rules and Guidelines (02/29/20)

Pages: 1 ... 61 62 [63] 64 65 ... 90

Author Topic: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 469527 times)

HELMUT

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1331
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #930 on: November 21, 2015, 04:30:34 AM »

The trick with SO I think is that it's exceedingly useful early game to pick the enemy ships one by one and blast them away. But once you start facing bigger ships and fleets, the battles last longer and the Peak time reduction start to take it's toll real hard. It could certainly use a nerf, (I like the idea of decreasing effect over time as suggested above) but not a big one IMO.

I think the same. SO is extremely good early game as you can rush your battles before the CR start dropping. However, Hardened subsystems rapidly become indispensable against larger fleets, and even then it gives the Wolf less than 2 minutes before CR degradation. SO can become a death sentence when you get ganked by several fleets.

SO isn't the ultimate hullmod either. Instead on spending the available OPs for SO and HS, you can just use them on vent points and get slightly better results. Plus the ability to actually vent, longer CR timer and longer weapons range. You still lose the speed boost though.

Personally, i currently have reached a point in the campaign where i removed SO from all my ships. The battles just take too long and the CR degradation start to hurt my fleet economy.

Also, it's possible that joekungfu fully skilled the combat skill tree in his campaign. While it's not a bad thing by itself, the combat skills tends to skew the view we can have on balance. It's by far the most powerful skills in the game, even more since the "nerf" of the leadership skills. It's not surprising that a fully skilled ship can steam-roll pretty much everything immediately, thus finishing the battle in before the CR toll.

So... I'm not sure. Perhaps it needs a nerf, but really a minor nerf then. I actually like Sy's idea of increased damage taken by engines and weapons, similar to Unstable injector. The other listed penalties seems a tad too harsh.


Other than that, i have a few observations concerning the campaign.

The first one, would be to allow the player to be able to see an officer's abilities even if we reach the 10 officers limit. Currently, i have to save, dismiss an officer, open the comm link and look at the mercenary's abilities to see whether or not he seems more interesting. And if not, re-load the game to not lose the other dismissed officier. That's quite a few steps.

The second, would be to see the detection/sensor range of the ships i'd like the buy. Currently, i don't know if the ship i'll buy will be reasonably stealthy or will shine like a Christmas tree to pirate's sensors. Same thing for their detectors. I know that Civilian hulls will be easier to detect, but i'd like to know the numbers before i buy. It seems that this number is set depending on the ship class and its hullmod, but i don't know how much until i get the ship.

Spoiler
[close]

Also for some reasons, not all my ships appears on those lists.

Maybe everything what i'm asking for is actually already there, but so far the whole thing is nebulous enough for me to not find it.


The third thing, is the 25 ships limit. It's a very arbitrary number and a huge nerf to small ships. It doesn't change anything early game, but mid/late game suffer from this limit. I don't see carrier fleets being interesting in the long run, nor frigates fleets. After all, an Enforcer and a Talon take the same slot in a fleet. Yes, obviously the supply cost won't be the same and fielding 25 Paragons is probably not economically  sound. But if you take the middle road, destroyer spam plus a few cruisers seems to be the winning combination.

The previous logistic system that regulated the number of ships was unnecessary complex. Even after playing so many campaigns, it still felt quite nebulous to me. What i propose would be a middle ground and use the fleet points instead. They are still listed in the ship_data.csv as i "think" the AI still take them in account during fleet engagements.

The advantage of fleet points is that it remove the slot systems that any ships can take. With this new system, you would be able to take 10 Talons for 30 FP or a single Paragon for the same price in your fleet. It feel more balanced, even smaller crafts will have their use for late game. Like in the previous version, the maximum size of the fleet could also be increased through the leadership skills. I also liked in 0.65 when you could go over the logistic limit at the cost of a CR penalty for all your ships.

Hmm, i think i'll try to expand more on this last one in the suggestion topic and keep this one for direct 0.7 feedback.
Logged

SeinTa

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 23
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #931 on: November 21, 2015, 04:50:29 AM »

Maybe I missed it somewhere....

Will the gates play a role in the game or are they just there for the lore?

Loving the update .... pirates and ludds ganking like pros.
Logged

miljan

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 105
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #932 on: November 21, 2015, 04:51:23 AM »

Well mix feeling about the patch. Note i didnt played for some time, last time i played is when they implemented time limits in battle that i really hate, and still is a problem in this version with bigger fights (even some capitals how i understand now have CR loos in battle witch is horrible design in it self, but did not get there yet).

So first the good, like the music, sound. The new sensor things is a mixed bag. I like now that fleets search for you, and seem more smarter, but i dont like that overall the systems look a lot empty and dead. The start is a lot harder, and has problem with you finding pirate groups that you can fight. This really needs to be fixed in future, maybe in your first sector have some object that show big areas around them, so you can actually find ships to fight. On other hand simple trading is a lot more fun than it used to be, and hyperspace travel is a lot more interesting. But if you go for only pure combat its a lot mroe boring on beginning as you will go around not able to find ships you can fight until you get some $ to move to bounties

There are a lot of graphical improvements that I like, but at the same tiem a lot of graphical  downgrades. Noticed a lot of ships look worse with less detail and more bland textures than before. Eagle especially looks very bad, dominator also looks a lot worse, with several other ships that have a graphical downgrade. You should be putting more details on ships, not less.

I can not understand how many ships can I have in my fleet anymore, as there is no indication that I can find like before where you could see the supplies you need and when you go over the limit or what it was. Or in older version where you had fleet points

Generally it's better than before, but still has a lot of bad things i did not like in past version that are presented here and that I don't think add anything good
« Last Edit: November 21, 2015, 05:47:42 AM by miljan »
Logged

Aklyon

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 192
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #933 on: November 21, 2015, 06:03:01 AM »

Theres a limit on ships now? Thats going to be annoying.

The Soldier

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 3735
  • Quartermaster
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #934 on: November 21, 2015, 06:12:04 AM »

Theres a limit on ships now? Thats going to be annoying.
25 ships / fighter wings total.  Not sure if you can edit that, though.
Logged
Quote from: Trylobot
I am officially an epoch.
Quote from: Thaago
Note: please sacrifice your goats responsibly, look up the proper pronunciation of Alex's name. We wouldn't want some other project receiving mystic power.

miljan

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 105
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #935 on: November 21, 2015, 06:28:42 AM »

Theres a limit on ships now? Thats going to be annoying.
25 ships / fighter wings total.  Not sure if you can edit that, though.
So its a hard limit, and it doesn't matter do you have 25 capital ships or 25 frigates?

I think the first iteration with fleet points was the best one that we had in older versions
Logged

Aklyon

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 192
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #936 on: November 21, 2015, 06:33:30 AM »

Fleet points would be better if fighter wings are taking up entire slots, yeah.

Megas

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 7781
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #937 on: November 21, 2015, 06:53:04 AM »

Safety Override is very powerful for some ships, namely ships stuck with short-ranged weapons and have no hullmods or perks that accelerate venting.

Heavy Blaster Wolf is hurt by Safety Override.  No venting alone hurts it more than it helps.  Compound that with worse shot range (big NO NO!) and peak performance (double big NO! NO!)  It also eats too much OP (triple big NO! NO!)  Once ships get the Dedicated Conduits perk (must have!) and Resistant Flux Conduits (very useful), Safety Override is not as effective.

It is great on a Lasher that is stuck with machine guns and light assault guns.  It needs the faster dissipation and top speed.  However, peak performance is a real problem.

Safety Override is what you use if you want (or have no other choice) to use chainguns and machines guns, maybe pulse lasers and PD lasers too.

Safety Override is too situational to be useful for most ships.  It is no Augmented Engines or ITU.  SO is most helpful in early game when you lack weapons and perks.
Logged

Gothars

  • Global Moderator
  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 4158
  • Eschewing obfuscatory verbosity.
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #938 on: November 21, 2015, 06:56:46 AM »

Not found SS this exciting & enjoyable since I 1st bought it way back when.

Agreed, this is the best update so far :) The game has matured really well.


Will the gates play a role in the game or are they just there for the lore?

Nothing official, but if they don't get any role in gameplay I would be very surprised. I mean, since they are flat they basically beg for a wormhole to open up inside :D


There are a lot of graphical improvements that I like, but at the same tiem a lot of graphical  downgrades. Noticed a lot of ships look worse with less detail and more bland textures than before. Eagle especially looks very bad, dominator also looks a lot worse, with several other ships that have a graphical downgrade. You should be putting more details on ships, not less.

Wow, really? I love the new smoother curves :) Some of the old sprites are preserved in D-variants btw, were the fit much better imo. Here's an blog post of the artist, giving his reasons for the change.
Logged

Chronosfear

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 206
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #939 on: November 21, 2015, 07:04:18 AM »

Man ,
I have a feeling that ships with an officer on board tend to fly way better then without ( or the skills have much influence )

I had some pretty awsome fights already.
My Eagle and my fellow brothers in arms with a Hammerhead and an Enforcer vs. a 2 fleets containing 1 cruiser 3 destroyers and a bunch of frigates.
It was a very intense battle, and it was the first time i really saw how we covered and supported each other and got out victorious only with light to medium damage on our ships hulls.

May the brave man that gave their lives in that battle never be forgotten.

thank you devs  :)

Also noticed some special hulls ( 14th battlegroup hullmod ). Are more of these special and different "rare" hulls planned.?

edit : question added
« Last Edit: November 21, 2015, 07:11:47 AM by Chronosfear »
Logged
Be the change that you wish to see in the world.
My words are backed with nuclear weapons (Civ)
Gandhi

miljan

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 105
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #940 on: November 21, 2015, 07:16:04 AM »

There are a lot of graphical improvements that I like, but at the same tiem a lot of graphical  downgrades. Noticed a lot of ships look worse with less detail and more bland textures than before. Eagle especially looks very bad, dominator also looks a lot worse, with several other ships that have a graphical downgrade. You should be putting more details on ships, not less.

Wow, really? I love the new smoother curves :) Some of the old sprites are preserved in D-variants btw, were the fit much better imo. Here's an blog post of the artist, giving his reasons for the change.

Not happy at the thought process of thinking that less detail is better. Hope it will stop here and not continue to make other ships look more simple. Probably one of the worst graphic downgrades I saw, and hope it will not happen to other parts of the game.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2015, 07:25:00 AM by miljan »
Logged

SpacePoliticianAndaZealot

  • Captain
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • The Show Stopper
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #941 on: November 21, 2015, 07:38:39 AM »

Agreed. Condor and Tarsus look awful now :(
Logged

Sordid

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 227
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #942 on: November 21, 2015, 07:52:54 AM »

All I'm saying is, is "look where you're shooting" too much to ask? That... seems fairly basic to me.

Well yes, it is too much to ask of a human being. You have to pay attention to half a dozen ships, a dozen missiles, tons of laser blasts, explosions, and various other nasty things coming your way, the direction your shield is pointed, how much flux you have, etc. That's a lot of stuff to keep track of, and it's physically impossible for a human being to focus on more than one of those things at a time, the others have to be relegated to peripheral vision, which makes it easy to overlook things.

Is "don't maneuver your unshielded engines into the path of my shots" too much to ask of the AI? That also seems basic to me. I mean, compare that to the phase ship. That thing is so aware of my shots that it vanishes before the shots even go off, but my escort is completely oblivious and walks right into them for no reason. Maybe it is the same AI like you said, but its performance in these situations is just so inconsistent.

Quote
I'm not saying it's a good thing when the AI crosses your line of fire. In many circumstances, it's a mistake. But, the consequences aren't all that bad if you handle it well, which is far from impossible, and which you have lots of tools to assist you with. Thus, while it's definitely an issue, it's not a particularly high-priority one in my view.

Well given that my escort getting his engines shot up results in his certain death and therefore the loss of 50% of my fleet even if I manage to win, it is a hugely important issue to me that immediately forces a save game load. Speaking of which, it would be really nice if there were two or three quicksave slots the game automatically alternated between so that you could revert to an earlier one if you accidentally saved in a situation you couldn't get out of.

Quote
(Side note: I'm rather a fan of M&B. Great game! Not without a few issues, but even so.)

Eh... it's a great idea, I'll give you that, but in my opinion the game itself is pretty awful in almost every way. That still didn't prevent me from putting a good few hundred hours into it, though, mostly because it's just so unique. I always thought you were a fan, given that Starfarer is basically M&B in space, to the point where it even parallels M&B's development path. First a combat prototype, then a campaign map is added, then additional campaign features are fleshed out.

See, that's kind of the thing I was talking about. The M&B team made a basic combat prototype, then they went "right, that's good enough, on to the campaign stuff" and never fixed some really basic problems with it, such as the movement system. Yeah, they have a system where moving up a slope makes you go slower, but they never implemented any kind of sliding down steep slopes. As a result, you can stand on a nearly vertical surface just fine. While going up it is nearly impossible, there's nothing preventing you from moving across it, which results in some truly ridiculous situations with a string of troops halfway up a cliff. The AI has also always remained really crude, so that string of troops might be trying to walk up that cliff but instead ends up sort of crabbing sideways across it. While Starfarer's problems are nowhere near as severe as M&B's, they nevertheless exist, and it's really dismaying to see the same kind of "it's part of the difficulty" or "you just need to learn to play around it" excuses being made for them.

Another area where I really don't want Starfarer to follow M&B is the economy. You're going down the same path as the M&B devs, implementing a complex economy system that runs in the background with trade fleets and such zipping around carrying goods, player-owned industries (those are still coming, right?), etc. That's a neat idea, the problem is that M&B's complex economy system is a broken mess. It just doesn't work, settlements are stuck at minimum prosperity no matter what you do, villages permanently have 0 cattle, etc. In fact, I can't recall a single game that has a complex autonomous economy like that that actually works the way it's supposed to. Maybe you're smarter and your system will work, but I'm really really worried the same thing is going to happen that happened every time anyone else tried this.

Just be super careful of the pitfalls, okay?
Logged

Raion

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 5
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #943 on: November 21, 2015, 07:53:16 AM »

Not happy at the thought process of thinking that less detail is better. Hope it will stop here and not continue to make other ships look more simple. Probably one of the worst graphic downgrades I saw, and hope it will not happen to other parts of the game.

It's not really a downgrade,but a matter of taste you like ships with more details and some people like ships with smoother lines
Logged

The Soldier

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 3735
  • Quartermaster
    • View Profile
Re: Starsector 0.7a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #944 on: November 21, 2015, 07:53:52 AM »

I rather like the new Tarsus and Condor.  The Eagle and Falcon look a tad bit too dark and undetailed, though - I'd like some modification to be done there, but they're good overall.  It'll grow on you, trust me. :) I'd love to see the rest of the fleet revamped like this.
Logged
Quote from: Trylobot
I am officially an epoch.
Quote from: Thaago
Note: please sacrifice your goats responsibly, look up the proper pronunciation of Alex's name. We wouldn't want some other project receiving mystic power.
Pages: 1 ... 61 62 [63] 64 65 ... 90