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Author Topic: Campaign Missions  (Read 25447 times)

xenoargh

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2015, 08:39:34 PM »

Yay!

All that's missing after that is Dynamic Stuff... and enough content to form the game around and perhaps define its stories and give it an arc, and it's a true successor to EV in many ways.  I am really excited to see the final bits of the puzzle emerging here :)
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Pushover

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2015, 08:44:07 PM »

Happy to see this idea get in the game for trading!

I'd like to see the ability to store commodities on planets gone or reworked, considering how much abuse there is around it though...
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CopperCoyote

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2015, 08:46:09 PM »

Are the rewards able to look at how well the issuing planet (or station) is doing?
For example if you're doing a mission for Jangala and their stability is maxed out they'll give you credits, but if their stability has taken a huge hit recently then they may only be able to pay in supplies.
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Alex

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2015, 09:10:19 PM »

HYPE DRIVE ENGAGED

Looks really good, this is the exact kind of thing that Starsector badly needs!

:)

It occurs to me that the bounty system we presently have isn't much different from an "open" mission (i.e. one which doesn't need to be accepted and which is on offer to anyone who can complete it). Will the bounty system be rolled into the mission system (and perhaps expanded upon), or will it remain a separate thing?

I think system bounties work well as they are, and don't see the need to roll them into missions, although there's potential for other sorts of "missions" that do similar things (say, the equivalent of a letter of marque).

Person bounties, I'm not too happy with, and could see reworking with missions in mind... or just re-working. Missions aren't necessarily the right hammer for every job, they're just one more tool in the toolbox, albeit (I think) a much-needed one.

Will missions allow you to get around faction-level port lockouts? E.g. the dock master at Baetis has a soft spot for Volturnian lobster, and if you bring him some he'll turn a blind eye to the fact that you're parking an Atlas in his backyard when you're not supposed to be allowed docking space even for a personal shuttle due to past smuggling convictions, piracy, whatever.

Right now, you can open the comm directory even if you can't dock due to reputation issues, and can complete and get new missions.

I think what you're really asking, though, is does reputation with a person holding an important post at a market override the faction's overall feelings towards you. The answer is (currently) no, except for the part where if someone likes you, they'll still offer you missions where you wouldn't be able to accept them if they didn't. I.E. if you're hostile with the Hegemony, you can browse the mission board at Jangala, but you won't be able to accept any missions from Hegemony contacts, unless they personally like you.


I am really excited to see the final bits of the puzzle emerging here :)

Me too :)


I'd like to see the ability to store commodities on planets gone or reworked, considering how much abuse there is around it though...

Yeah, I'm thinking about adding a monthly fee based on how much you've got stored. Some kind of upkeep system is going to be necessary at some point, so I'll need to build that with a bit of an eye on flexibility.

Are the rewards able to look at how well the issuing planet (or station) is doing?
For example if you're doing a mission for Jangala and their stability is maxed out they'll give you credits, but if their stability has taken a huge hit recently then they may only be able to pay in supplies.

Well, there's two questions there. Can the rewards be based on that? Sure, they can be. A custom mission can do whatever it wants there.

For the "procurement contract" mission, the rewards are based on several factors, one of which is the current market price of the commodity, so that does factor in the stability, but not in a qualitative way - i.e. it's a different amount of money, but not an entirely different reward. The other factors are the timeframe (tighter deadline means more money) and whether it's legal (illegal means more money).

Some of the contracts also have a built-in bonus for delivering ahead of schedule. To avoid players first procuring the goods and then arriving at the market and accepting the contract right before fulfilling it, procurement missions 1) have a good chance of being taken down (presumably, either fulfilled by someone else or cancelled) and the timer ticks down while a mission is on offer, even before it's accepted. The reward is based on the initial deadline, though.

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Cycerin

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2015, 10:17:54 PM »

Person bounties really should be differentiated based on what type of bounty or hit it is; bounties on pirate lords or from factions that are at war should come from offices on planets or stations headed by factions, while assassinations or hit lists or grudge bounties could be handed out by individual NPCs encountered by chance, in space or on backwaters. I dunno, just an idea for how to add more feel to it.
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Psycho Society

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2015, 12:18:06 AM »

This sounds pretty rad! I'm not 100% clear on the difference in gameplay between mission trading and event based trading, but I'm sure It'll be clearer once I start playing. Getting to talk to an NPC on a planet will add a good bit of flavor.

If all planet events end up generating missions, will we still be able to affect things there by acting independently, or will we need to sign up for one of the missions?
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Gothars

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2015, 04:18:04 AM »

Looking good :) Mh, can you talk about how complex the missions can get? Will they be more or less pointers to events and changes in the gameworld that are dynamically generated? Or will they have pre-written scripts that tie them into the history or major politics of the Sector, or into personal drama?

My guess for the next blog post is officers, since it fits with the character persistence :)

Sweaty greetings from Thailand!  ;D

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Protonus

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #22 on: March 27, 2015, 04:42:55 AM »

I'm also curious if the AI's themselves, not the NPC's giving out quests, will be able to take quests as they please as well.

Realistically speaking, if a tendency that both an AI and the player managed to grab hold to a single mission, the first one could finish it first to get the reward.
Spoiler
Oh, before exaggerating that the AI will almost always completes the mission, I have this kicker.

If ever the AI gets the mission completed first, the player CAN just destroy the AI's ship before they reach the quest giver, grab its intel and alter to the player's favor and return to their employer for the reward instead.
[close]

To have a little more of a dynamic feel that someone actually took your job first instead of actually taking so many jobs that nobody, in a literal way, actually wants.
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Thaago

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #23 on: March 27, 2015, 09:15:57 AM »

Oooh, new star system! And I guess the missions look ok ;)

Exciting news though. Persistent people opens up a huge range of options for making stories personal.

For the new feature I'm going to guess... ship procurement! Because it seems very easy to fit in with the mission system. Talk with one of your contacts, get in touch with the shipmaster, and take on a "mission" where they get the ship after a while for credits. Or maybe you need to do them a favor first? (Please run across Hyrule *cough* I mean the sector and bring me the tears of a Tri-Tach executive! Then I'll order a Conquest at the factory for you.)
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Megas

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #24 on: March 27, 2015, 10:41:26 AM »

I see five more star systems than we have, for eleven.  I like to see more markets aside from Tibicena that can sell high-tech stuff.
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Alex

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #25 on: March 27, 2015, 11:14:03 AM »

This sounds pretty rad! I'm not 100% clear on the difference in gameplay between mission trading and event based trading, but I'm sure It'll be clearer once I start playing. Getting to talk to an NPC on a planet will add a good bit of flavor.

It's similar - I mean, you get credits for goods, after all - but mission-based trading is just more well defined. You know exactly what you're signing up for.

I actually like how it plays with the existing support for trade. For example, the "prices" intel category can be quite useful when trying to figure out how to best fill a procurement contract.

If all planet events end up generating missions, will we still be able to affect things there by acting independently, or will we need to sign up for one of the missions?

That's a good question. I'd imagine it's going to depend on the event and what makes more sense on a case-by-case basis.


Looking good :) Mh, can you talk about how complex the missions can get? Will they be more or less pointers to events and changes in the gameworld that are dynamically generated? Or will they have pre-written scripts that tie them into the history or major politics of the Sector, or into personal drama?

Probably a bit of both. They could easily support either, so this is more of a content question, and I'm not prepared to give a definitive answer. A lot of that is up to David, as well.


Sweaty greetings from Thailand!  ;D

Hope the hiking is going well! Man, I don't think I could take the heat/humidity.


I'm also curious if the AI's themselves, not the NPC's giving out quests, will be able to take quests as they please as well.

Realistically speaking, if a tendency that both an AI and the player managed to grab hold to a single mission, the first one could finish it first to get the reward.
Spoiler
Oh, before exaggerating that the AI will almost always completes the mission, I have this kicker.

If ever the AI gets the mission completed first, the player CAN just destroy the AI's ship before they reach the quest giver, grab its intel and alter to the player's favor and return to their employer for the reward instead.
[close]

To have a little more of a dynamic feel that someone actually took your job first instead of actually taking so many jobs that nobody, in a literal way, actually wants.

I think this is one of those things that sounds better on paper than it would work out in practice. There could be cases where it's interesting, but if it was across the board, and missions you took on were routinely stolen out from under you by forces essentially beyond your control, that doesn't seem like it'd be good. (I don't think the "kicker" is practical - how are you going to intercept an AI ship that's halfway across the Sector, finishing a mission you thought you had 2 months left to do?)
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SafariJohn

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #26 on: March 27, 2015, 01:48:59 PM »

There's not really anything about penalties in the blog post for failing to complete missions, but I think rep loss with the NPC is an obvious penalty. However, there could be many other penalties too.

A simple, major penalty might be a bounty being placed on your head for "misplacing" some sensitive documents.

On the *potentially* less harsh end, NPCs or factions might fine you. You caused them losses by not completing the contract they gave you, and by Hegemony (or what/whoever, even say Kanta's) law you have to pay reparations to the injured party.

I'm sure even more creative and varied penalties could be thought of.

I think this is one of those things that sounds better on paper than it would work out in practice. There could be cases where it's interesting, but if it was across the board, and missions you took on were routinely stolen out from under you by forces essentially beyond your control, that doesn't seem like it'd be good. (I don't think the "kicker" is practical - how are you going to intercept an AI ship that's halfway across the Sector, finishing a mission you thought you had 2 months left to do?)

I agree, I think missions should normally be specific to whoever takes them on (in this case, the player). Some rarer ones might involve other fleets trying to complete the mission too, but usually if you get a mission you are the only one who has been tasked to complete it.
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Pushover

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #27 on: March 27, 2015, 01:59:36 PM »

There's not really anything about penalties in the blog post for failing to complete missions, but I think rep loss with the NPC is an obvious penalty. However, there could be many other penalties too.

A simple, major penalty might be a bounty being placed on your head for "misplacing" some sensitive documents.

On the *potentially* less harsh end, NPCs or factions might fine you. You caused them losses by not completing the contract they gave you, and by Hegemony (or what/whoever, even say Kanta's) law you have to pay reparations to the injured party.

I'm sure even more creative and varied penalties could be thought of.

I think this is one of those things that sounds better on paper than it would work out in practice. There could be cases where it's interesting, but if it was across the board, and missions you took on were routinely stolen out from under you by forces essentially beyond your control, that doesn't seem like it'd be good. (I don't think the "kicker" is practical - how are you going to intercept an AI ship that's halfway across the Sector, finishing a mission you thought you had 2 months left to do?)

I agree, I think missions should normally be specific to whoever takes them on (in this case, the player). Some rarer ones might involve other fleets trying to complete the mission too, but usually if you get a mission you are the only one who has been tasked to complete it.

I think it depends on the mission. Plenty of these could just be market based, or military based, something like 'We are planning to produce 2 more Onslaughts by this date for our defense fleet, we need 5000 units of metal and 500 units of Machinery. We don't care who gets these materials to us, but we will pay whoever does.' If you fail to complete this mission, no big deal.' On the other hand, if it's something like 'We need someone to pick up these documents and send them to Jangala by this date' and you pick up the documents but don't deliver, a penalty makes sense.
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TheDTYP

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #28 on: March 27, 2015, 05:39:14 PM »

Ahh, Blog Posts are always a great way to get me excited for this game.
YUSSS MISSIONS! God I've been waiting for these, this is gonna be a nice release, I bet. Will there be more for the release besides "Procurement Contracts" or no?
I'm really looking forward to the next Blog Posts, glad to see you have some on deck.. Have you ever considered doing a Youtube devblog like the guys at LeafyGames, who work on Pulsar?

EDIT: How awesome would it be if NPC's had individual relationships with you based off of the timeliness, efficiency, and degree of screwing over/betrayal of your actions during the missions that could be even more temperamental than factions? I understand that would surely be very complicated, just a thought. Something to do if you have time on your hands or run out of ideas I guess :)
« Last Edit: March 27, 2015, 05:49:10 PM by TheDTYP »
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orost

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Re: Campaign Missions
« Reply #29 on: March 27, 2015, 05:52:27 PM »

I just had an idea: If there are going to be financial penalties for failing a mission or anything else, I wouldn't want them to be deducted from my account immediately. That's rude. Instead, they'd increase your debt with the faction. Having debt would impose a reputation penalty with the faction in question that stays there until you pay it off (while accruing interest), scaled with the amount of money involved as a ratio of player's total worth. Customs tolls should allow you to do the same, unless they don't trust you in which case they'd demand payment immediately. I think it would be a very fun mechanic that puts more control in player's hands.
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