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Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Skills and Story Points (07/08/19)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 51370 times)

Gothars

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2014, 01:18:52 PM »

I take it that this will break saves?

It does not :)


I'm already excited for the first blogpost after 0.65.2a^^
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NikolaiLev

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #16 on: November 03, 2014, 01:20:54 PM »

Complaining of a crash concerning a modded up game? Sheesh... take it up with the mod authors.

Remember that mod I sent you?  Tried to deploy a Kitty Hawk carrier and an ASF-4 Fighter Wing.  Instant crash upon hitting the Deploy button.  I was using the ISS Black Star from the first vanilla mission.  This happens with any other ship I try, and doesn't require the Kitty Hawk to crash; seems to be linked to the mod's fighters.

Now that I think about it, it might be linked to the Afterburner AI mod.

EDIT: Tried removing Afterburner ship system on the ASF-4.  Still instant crash.
A note to yourself, and for that matter, a lot of end-users interested in installing mods for Starsector:

Unless the author him/her/themselves explicitly declare otherwise, presume that all mods that haven't been updated since October 20th of this year, to NOT work with v0.65a or newer.

Too many things were changed around in the core code to expect anything more than successfully loading the game, and little more than that.

The mod that you are trying to run, the Patrian Principate, hasn't been updated once since it's initial release in late October/early November of 2013.

So... odds are, random crashes are almost guaranteed, even if only trying to load the non-campaign missions.

I am the mod author.

I'm developing the update for the latest version but unfortunately I'm encountering very odd crashes with fighter wings.  And [un]fortunately I can't seem to reproduce the issue with vanilla ships so I'm trying to figure out why my fighters would cause such a crash.

I should probably put the mod in my sig or something...
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2014, 01:28:54 PM »

I take it that this will break saves?

It shouldn't.


@NikolaiLev: The stack trace seems to indicate it could be something to do with ship engines, but I'm not entirely sure. If your mod is reasonably self-contained and you can send it to me w/ instructions on how to reproduce, I can take a quick look.
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bills6693

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #18 on: November 03, 2014, 01:42:11 PM »

Wow that is a long bugfix list. Alex you should really consider giving community somewhat raw pre-update so we can go in bug hunt for you. Look how fast all that bugs floated up to surface after 0.65 release. You spend less time looking for bugs and more time in fixing them and all other not-bug related stuff. Just a thought :P

I have been thinking about it. Just not sure about the logistics of it and whether it's really fair to ask someone to do that. I've been more thinking about it in terms of asking modders to take a look to see if the stuff they want to do works...

May I add my humble input?

Why not have an 'experimental' release. It is marked as such, and you clearly state, that this release verison is buggy and is for bug-hunting enthusiasts only, or those that don't mind having to deal with the bugs.

When you have a 'stable' version ready, i.e. of the quality you normally release patches, you release that as a 'stable' version. That way those that enjoy just playing the bug-free game can play when its ready, as they always have done.

In this way you are:

1) getting hopefully much faster bug hunting, allowing you to spend more time fixing the bugs. It would also provide community-sourced opinions on balance, how the gameplay feels etc

2) only having people who WANT to do this, do this. You are not inconveniencing those that want to just play the stable versions at all. But those that want to help you, get the oppotunity

I think personally, and in my uninformed position, that this could help speed up the process a lot in the later stages of releasing a new patch. You add the features etc, then have the community members who want to help hunt bugs hunt those bugs and provide bug reports and feedback, in addition to your own play.

I just don't see how this would offend, or give disservice, to those that have bought the game. If they want the stable releases like you have been doing they still get that, possibly even faster than before as an added bonus. And you are basically outsourcing for free a lot of long, tedious bug hunting work to those that want to give you a helping hand however we can (beyond the small financial support we've all made). Its not lumping work on your supporters - its allowing them to help with the bug hunt and get their hands on new features to test and evaluate sooner. Many people buy into prerelease games to help them get along, and you may as well utilize that resource if its there :)
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TimeDiver

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #19 on: November 03, 2014, 01:47:43 PM »

I am the mod author.

I'm developing the update for the latest version but unfortunately I'm encountering very odd crashes with fighter wings.  And [un]fortunately I can't seem to reproduce the issue with vanilla ships so I'm trying to figure out why my fighters would cause such a crash.

I should probably put the mod in my sig or something...
...

*head-desk(s) repeadtedly*

Yeah, I somehow managed to completely miss that particular detail.

*continues to bang head against desk*
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TartarusMkII

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #20 on: November 03, 2014, 03:21:12 PM »

Hello Alex,

I adore your game, and I've spread the news about it for a couple of weeks now, always so impressed with it all, especially the modding community!

I just wanted to try my hand at making one request: I have been involved in game development before, and I just want to make one suggestion to you, as I really care about your game and want it to be succesful! I have read in many places that some people often think the development of the game is dead because of the long period between updates.

Now, I am not suggesting that you "work faster", but that you break up releases to be more often, as to remind people that the game is still moving. I know that this can be a problem for modders if it occurs too often, but I have read that some updates were almost an entire year apart. That's all I mean to talk about.

Thanks again, and thanks AGAIN!
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Debido

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #21 on: November 03, 2014, 03:43:36 PM »

Or...maybe Alex has exceptional business acumen in ensuring he doesn't over promise and under-deliver, or release garbage alpha dev builds on a monthly basis that end up alienating his customer base and creating a cesspool of toxic screaming 13 year olds on the forums calling the game a scam and leading ultimately to a massive loss in revenue or even potentially finishing the project. (I really should use commas).

Some of us are already concerned of the negative impact that Steam may have once the hordes of credit card equipped 13 year olds, start diving bombing the place with "This game sucks, it's not 3D" or "ShaderLib should be part of the game" yada yada


Anyway that is fairly off topic, back on topic I'm fairly glad to see this released. Some of the mod fixes will go to good use.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #22 on: November 03, 2014, 03:59:19 PM »

Hello Alex,

I adore your game, and I've spread the news about it for a couple of weeks now, always so impressed with it all, especially the modding community!

I just wanted to try my hand at making one request: I have been involved in game development before, and I just want to make one suggestion to you, as I really care about your game and want it to be succesful! I have read in many places that some people often think the development of the game is dead because of the long period between updates.

Now, I am not suggesting that you "work faster", but that you break up releases to be more often, as to remind people that the game is still moving. I know that this can be a problem for modders if it occurs too often, but I have read that some updates were almost an entire year apart. That's all I mean to talk about.

Thanks again, and thanks AGAIN!

Thank you, I appreciate the support, and am happy to hear you're enjoying the game! I do think that part of being able to enjoy the game comes from making sure updates are... coherent, I guess, is the word I'm looking for. I'm always aiming to put an update out as quickly as possible, but oftentimes features need other features to lean on, and just wouldn't work well without them. Just one example from this update is trade and faction relationships - they really, dare I say it, synergize well, while releasing either feature on its own just wouldn't be that good.


May I add my humble input?

But of course :)

... You add the features etc, then have the community members who want to help hunt bugs hunt those bugs and provide bug reports and feedback, in addition to your own play.

I see what you're saying, and it might work. The trouble, as I'm seeing it now, is that a lot of the tuning and making things fun/into an actual game takes place during the playtesting phase, which is also where I find a lot of the bugs. So, if this "experimental" release came out before then, it might just make things more chaotic, the game isn't really long-term playable at that point, and feedback on a half-baked version (aside from actual bug reports) isn't actually very valuable, because it's on something that's not in good enough shape to begin with. After the playtesting phase? It's pretty much time to release the game. If you think about it, I suppose, then 0.65a *is* in a way the experimental release.

Plus, it feels wrong to ask people that are the most enthusiastic about the game to burn themselves out on a sub-par version, even if they might be so inclined. That's part of why I've been thinking about this in the context of modders, where that isn't so much of an issue since the innards of the game probably matter more than the final coats of paint.

Still, something to think about, for sure.

Edit: adjusted for clarity.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2014, 04:36:38 PM by Alex »
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bills6693

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #23 on: November 03, 2014, 06:24:27 PM »

May I add my humble input?
But of course :)
Not that I waited for your permission anyway! But why thank you  ;D

... You add the features etc, then have the community members who want to help hunt bugs hunt those bugs and provide bug reports and feedback, in addition to your own play.

I see what you're saying, and it might work. The trouble, as I'm seeing it now, is that a lot of the tuning and making things fun/into an actual game takes place during the playtesting phase, which is also where I find a lot of the bugs. So, if this "experimental" release came out before then, it might just make things more chaotic, the game isn't really long-term playable at that point, and feedback on a half-baked version (aside from actual bug reports) isn't actually very valuable, because it's on something that's not in good enough shape to begin with. After the playtesting phase? It's pretty much time to release the game. If you think about it, I suppose, then 0.65a *is* in a way the experimental release.

Just wondering, do you think it'd be valuable if there was playtesting feedback from the community as well as your own insights playtesting? e.g. if, in the un-tuned version the general opinion of players is 'make x do more y' and you are thinking the same, it confirms your decision. If all the players are saying 'make x do more y' and you are thinking 'x should do less y', then its an alarm bell for you. At the end of the day you have a longer term vision for the project and if x doing less y fits in better with that, you should do that since the community has a different perspective and vision. But just wonder if you think community feedback in this area would be useful or not?

Plus, it feels wrong to ask people that are the most enthusiastic about the game to burn themselves out on a sub-par version, even if they might be so inclined. That's part of why I've been thinking about this in the context of modders, where that isn't so much of an issue since the innards of the game probably matter more than the final coats of paint.
I get what you're saying here, good point. Maybe there is the  risk that players will burn out after all, on the unfinished versions. I honestly couldn't say I think this would happen or not, I guess it's hard to judge. So yes, it makes sense too having the innards inspected by those that would do so anyway.

Do you playtest the game by yourself, or have a group of people do it (the others working on the game in various ways, or a larger group of people?). I wonder if you think a larger group of playtesters would be useful who are 'recruited' into it as volunteers for that purpose, probably invited from those active and giving input on the forums. (thats not me saying I want in, I just meant in general. I'd be rubbish at this myself!)
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Nanao-kun

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #24 on: November 04, 2014, 12:18:13 AM »

Now that I think about it, are there any videos of "Alex plays Starsector", rather than what he's doing now, which is "Alex makes Starsector"?
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XpanD

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #25 on: November 04, 2014, 02:19:38 AM »

Woo! Been looking forward to this one, good to see it released so quickly.


Wow that is a long bugfix list. Alex you should really consider giving community somewhat raw pre-update so we can go in bug hunt for you. Look how fast all that bugs floated up to surface after 0.65 release. You spend less time looking for bugs and more time in fixing them and all other not-bug related stuff. Just a thought :P

I have been thinking about it. Just not sure about the logistics of it and whether it's really fair to ask someone to do that. I've been more thinking about it in terms of asking modders to take a look to see if the stuff they want to do works...

Maybe you could take an SMF-specific angle with this? Make a new member group, allow people to set themselves to that group (not entirely sure if this works under SMF 1.1.x) and then allow that group access to an otherwise hidden "testing releases" board complete with a separate bug reports section and a board-wide disclaimer? That way, people could sign themselves up for it if they would be interested, knowing the risks associated. I know I would! :P
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Ronald Klein

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2014, 02:43:03 AM »


 It broke my savegame...

Spoiler
30532 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 6
30533 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Error loading
30534 [Thread-5] ERROR com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - com.fs.starfarer.util.H cannot be cast to java.util.zip.ZipInputStream
java.lang.ClassCastException: com.fs.starfarer.util.H cannot be cast to java.util.zip.ZipInputStream
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.title.B.super(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.title.O0OO.actionPerformed(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.thisnew.super(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.null.processInput(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.ui.O0Oo.o00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.B.void.class$super(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.A.oOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.?00000(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.combat.O0OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.super(Unknown Source)
   at com.fs.starfarer.StarfarerLauncher$2.run(Unknown Source)
   at java.lang.Thread.run(Unknown Source)
30536 [Thread-12] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading progress: 0.99216527
30537 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 11
30537 [Thread-12] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Releasing context
30537 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 12
30538 [Thread-12] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Released context
30538 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 13
30538 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 14
30538 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 15
30538 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 16
30545 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 17
30545 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 18
30546 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 19
30546 [Thread-5] INFO  com.fs.starfarer.campaign.save.CampaignGameManager  - Loading stage 20
[close]
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OOZ662

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2014, 04:57:23 AM »

I'm really surprised the "AI always has green crew" thing was left in.

Now that I think about it, are there any videos of "Alex plays Starsector", rather than what he's doing now, which is "Alex makes Starsector"?

I hear many developers tend to be sick of playing their game due to doing so constantly in debugging and development.
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It is law that any specific ship you want will not be available. If it is available, it will be gone by the time you're capable of buying it.

silentstormpt

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2014, 05:54:38 AM »

Not a problem! *points to the mod section*
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bills6693

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Re: Starsector 0.65.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2014, 06:58:32 AM »

I'm really surprised the "AI always has green crew" thing was left in.

Huh? What this one?

  • Fixed bug where all fleets had green crew, now defaults to regular

I haven't actually played the new version so maybe its not actually changed. Though I suspect maybe its just that existing fleets are as they were (green crew) but any fleets that now spawn in the new version will be regular.
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