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Author Topic: Relationship Rot  (Read 3972 times)

DeMatt

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Relationship Rot
« on: November 02, 2014, 02:54:53 AM »

I'd like to suggest that, if your relationship isn't at -100 or +100, then it should "rot" over time as factions forget over time what you've done for/against them, gradually dropping towards a resting point specific to each faction.

So Pirates would rot towards -50 (they'll rob anybody), while e.g. Independents would rot towards +10 (random trading schmoe, not part of the established factions?  Welcome!).

I imagine the entire process would take a substantial amount of time - it'd only knock off a point every month or two, so it'd take several cycles to rot from +99 down to 0.
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TJJ

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2014, 04:19:20 AM »

I'd go further and say all relationships should normalize over time, even those that have reached min/max values.
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Plasmatic

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2014, 09:33:44 AM »

I'd like to suggest that, if your relationship isn't at -100 or +100, then it should "rot" over time as factions forget over time what you've done for/against them, gradually dropping towards a resting point specific to each faction.

So Pirates would rot towards -50 (they'll rob anybody), while e.g. Independents would rot towards +10 (random trading schmoe, not part of the established factions?  Welcome!).

I imagine the entire process would take a substantial amount of time - it'd only knock off a point every month or two, so it'd take several cycles to rot from +99 down to 0.

I don't understand why it wouldn't rot if you reach 100? If it's going to rots, it's going to rot regardless of how well known you are.. short of being there everyday and reminding the faction what you've done by doing more.. the relationship should rot over a long time.
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nomadic_leader

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2014, 12:40:22 PM »

You'd get better/more replies if your thread title made sense. "Relationship rot" is rather gnomic and nobody can understand what it's about until you click and read the post.

BUT: This is a good idea, if it's personalized for each faction.

In some societies politics are fluid and administrations change a lot, and they would more quickly forget you. Look at Classical Athenian democracy and characters who were repeatedly elevated then exiled, like Alcibiades. Would also be true of the pirate dens' ever-shifting alliances.

In a dictatorship though, they'd forget almost nothing. For example, some authors whose books were banned during the Soviet Union are still banned in the successor states, long after the officials responsible have died of excess shashlik consumption.

Three values for each faction:
  • A positive value beyond which good reputation wouldn't decay*
  • A negative value beyond which bad reputation wouldn't decay*
  • And an 'equilibrium' value after which the decay would stop (ie negative for pirates, neutral for most others)
(However, as the rep decays, the game shouldn't spam the player with messages about it, since it isn't directly related to their action)
*The player's actions of course, could still raise or lower the rep beyond these values.

This is another great way to differentiate factions, in addition to the idea of having them react differently to your actions; discussed in this thread.
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c plus one

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2014, 06:04:53 PM »

DeMatt, I think that your suggestion describes a colorful new addition to the game. The rot sounds useful for preventing complacency in high-relationship-value players, as well as despair in low-relationship-value players. As long as the player's relationship with any given faction won't decay too swiftly, and relationship values will have a resting point specific to each faction, I would enjoy this. But aside from those small concerns of mine, I think this suggested gameplay dynamic is a good interpretation of the ages-old question, "What have you done for me lately?"

I agree with nomadic_leader's idea (and a really cool one, too) of having a definite maximum, minimum and "equilibrium" state for each faction's decay values; states which are separate from the full extent of high/low values that player actions can raise/reduce relationship values to.


Concerning the thread's subject line -

You'd get better/more replies if your thread title made sense. "Relationship rot" is rather gnomic and nobody can understand what it's about until you click and read the post.

"Nobody"? I'm willing to admit that I'm definitely no exemplar of Delphic perception; more a Gravedigger than a Hamlet, I fear. However, when reading this thread's subject line I had no difficulty in prognosticating the essential nature of what the first post's content was most likely going to touch upon. Rather than being obscure, I found it adequately sensible as well as concise, and in no way slow to grasp.
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SafariJohn

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2014, 08:19:56 PM »

Concerning the thread's subject line -

You'd get better/more replies if your thread title made sense. "Relationship rot" is rather gnomic and nobody can understand what it's about until you click and read the post.

"Nobody"? I'm willing to admit that I'm definitely no exemplar of Delphic perception; more a Gravedigger than a Hamlet, I fear. However, when reading this thread's subject line I had no difficulty in prognosticating the essential nature of what the first post's content was most likely going to touch upon. Rather than being obscure, I found it adequately sensible as well as concise, and in no way slow to grasp.

I think you overdid it at "prognosticating". ::) The rest is great, though!
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DeMatt

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2014, 12:58:49 PM »

I don't understand why it wouldn't rot if you reach 100? If it's going to rots, it's going to rot regardless of how well known you are.. short of being there everyday and reminding the faction what you've done by doing more.. the relationship should rot over a long time.
My idea was that, at some point, the faction "awards you a title" or somesuch.  You become a stockholder in Tri-Tachyon, Hegemony gives you a colonel's warrant, you get baptized into the Knights of Lud, etc.  Past that point, your relationship doesn't rot because you're literally a member of that faction.  You can do something that results in you being disowned, but time alone won't remove the title.

This is a good idea, if it's personalized for each faction.

In some societies politics are fluid and administrations change a lot, and they would more quickly forget you. Look at Classical Athenian democracy and characters who were repeatedly elevated then exiled, like Alcibiades. Would also be true of the pirate dens' ever-shifting alliances.

In a dictatorship though, they'd forget almost nothing. For example, some authors whose books were banned during the Soviet Union are still banned in the successor states, long after the officials responsible have died of excess shashlik consumption.

Three values for each faction:
  • A positive value beyond which good reputation wouldn't decay*
  • A negative value beyond which bad reputation wouldn't decay*
  • And an 'equilibrium' value after which the decay would stop (ie negative for pirates, neutral for most others)
(However, as the rep decays, the game shouldn't spam the player with messages about it, since it isn't directly related to their action)
*The player's actions of course, could still raise or lower the rep beyond these values.

This is another great way to differentiate factions, in addition to the idea of having them react differently to your actions; discussed in this thread.
I hadn't gotten that far in my thinking, but those are great ideas.
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Cik

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2014, 01:12:49 PM »

I don't understand why it wouldn't rot if you reach 100? If it's going to rots, it's going to rot regardless of how well known you are.. short of being there everyday and reminding the faction what you've done by doing more.. the relationship should rot over a long time.
My idea was that, at some point, the faction "awards you a title" or somesuch.  You become a stockholder in Tri-Tachyon, Hegemony gives you a colonel's warrant, you get baptized into the Knights of Lud, etc.  Past that point, your relationship doesn't rot because you're literally a member of that faction.  You can do something that results in you being disowned, but time alone won't remove the title.

This is a good idea, if it's personalized for each faction.

In some societies politics are fluid and administrations change a lot, and they would more quickly forget you. Look at Classical Athenian democracy and characters who were repeatedly elevated then exiled, like Alcibiades. Would also be true of the pirate dens' ever-shifting alliances.

In a dictatorship though, they'd forget almost nothing. For example, some authors whose books were banned during the Soviet Union are still banned in the successor states, long after the officials responsible have died of excess shashlik consumption.

Three values for each faction:
  • A positive value beyond which good reputation wouldn't decay*
  • A negative value beyond which bad reputation wouldn't decay*
  • And an 'equilibrium' value after which the decay would stop (ie negative for pirates, neutral for most others)
(However, as the rep decays, the game shouldn't spam the player with messages about it, since it isn't directly related to their action)
*The player's actions of course, could still raise or lower the rep beyond these values.

This is another great way to differentiate factions, in addition to the idea of having them react differently to your actions; discussed in this thread.
I hadn't gotten that far in my thinking, but those are great ideas.

great post. i'd actually really like to see "titles" that is, non-trivial indicators of your standing with the powers of the sector. say you cozy up to lud, do alot of trading with them, kill the bad guys they don't like, etc. you should be able to become a knight/lord/paragon whatever of their state, which allows you privileges like allowing you to act like a customs agent, ordering around some of their fleets, being able to comandeer friendly ships for a limited time, etc etc. you should get cool badges for it i think. it also of course would immediately lower say, the diktat's opinion of you because you are effectively a ludd fleet now.

it would be really cool to become a certain faction's enforcer, and it should entitle you to better deals on their markets, access to more powerful / rare ships that they produce, maybe give you the ability to tell planets what to produce (at the very high levels) stuff like that. it would be very neat.
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StarSchulz

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Re: Relationship Rot
« Reply #8 on: November 05, 2014, 01:00:30 PM »

After smuggling for a few hours and having -30 with a few factions, i got a message that said i got +15 in relations with the tri-tachyons and the independant. said wrongdoings are forgotten after a long time or something like that. so i guess a little bit of this is already there.