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Author Topic: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?  (Read 7902 times)

Kurzak

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2013, 09:17:28 PM »

It is literally like you don't understand the concept of opportunity cost. In the crowded system environment due to well, the game not being finished enough to put any distance between these factions there is simply too much to have to deal with all at once with limited early game resources. 

Just for clarification, which mod(s) are you currently using?
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LazyWizard

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2013, 09:44:27 PM »

Spoiler
I would also like to ad that the Thule Legacy Viking support frigate and their bulwark srms are to much to handle early game as well.

I don't know if these factions would be balanced in mid to late game but early game is painful to the point I don't find it worth playing.

This is an excellent example of what I meant by learning effective strategies. The Bulwark SRM has three attributes you should note: it deals frag damage, it is tagged as point defense, and its rate-of-fire is high enough it will run dry in only 20 seconds. All three of these can be found in the Codex, so you could look at it and realize an Annihilator barrage every few seconds will distract the SRMs until their ammo runs out, or a single frigate could tank the entire battery on its shield with no problem (frag does only 25% damage to all defenses aside from hull). :)

The Viking is powerful, yes, and you shouldn't try to take it on in the very early game (much like with the Tri-Tach frigates, though not quite as bad). Unfortunately, unless you've looked at the Codex the only way to find this out is a very painful first-hand lesson.
[close]

Also you really should not assume that even if I do read the codex I will always have access to the items and ships I will need to counter any ships I read about there early game.

It is literally like you don't understand the concept of opportunity cost. In the crowded system environment due to well, the game not being finished enough to put any distance between these factions there is simply too much to have to deal with all at once with limited early game resources.

I don't think a personal attack against me was warranted there. I was only saying that there are often cheap, easily available ways available to counter enemy abilities. If I came across as rude, I apologize. :)
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PCCL

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2013, 10:38:55 PM »

to be honest I think he's the one being rude here

I read through the thread, and all I could find was him complaining about how it's too hard to start out.

It's not imba if you can't handle it, it's imba if you can't fight against it and you're invincible with it on your side. Try piloting those ships for a bit before insulting the modding community with a badly typed post that I really thought was trolling before I read more of the thread

also it seems like you're trying too many factions at once, it doesn't HAVE to be that crowded, ya know, uninstall a few factions until you learn the ropes
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Thule

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2013, 11:43:06 PM »

I would also like to ad that the Thule Legacy Viking support frigate and their bulwark srms are to much to handle early game as well.

I don't know if these factions would be balanced in mid to late game but early game is painful to the point I don't find it worth playing.

In my latest DEV build the bulwark is nerfed already, testing showed that the continous stream of rockets is to much. Even as a PD weapon with fragmentation damage as Lazy pointed out, and running out of ammo rather quickly.
Especially for frigates of the low tech tier with their quite unefficient shields.
In the latest build i changed the fire mode to a burst folley of 6 rockets each with a chargedown timer.

i also nerfed in the recent build almost every ship (not released yet but i send it just yesterday to uomoz) as balancing is a vital and ongoing part of making a mod playable and enjoyable.
So even if your tone wasn't the the best i got your message and i have to partially agree.

« Last Edit: February 27, 2013, 11:47:22 PM by Thule »
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MrDavidoff

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2013, 12:24:25 AM »

Well, somebody had a pissy mood and Starfarersector mods took the fall for this one, the way i see it.

1) Say which mods you play

2) Your input on how to balance it

3) Really no need for bad baheviour here my friend. ;)
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Sunfire

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #20 on: February 28, 2013, 05:37:58 AM »

I expect a legitimate answer. Failure to deliver one will result is steep fines.

Seriously, you should be ashamed of yourselves. Zero self control. Zero capacity for coordination or to form a standardize cost format. Just one big self gratificationfest.

 Honestly, I laughed for a minute straight. Thank-you for that :) Ya I get mad like that sometimes when I game so I totally get this post.

 But since you created this thread I want to send out a little query. How do people feel about the balance of the Neutrino in Uomoz's Corvus? With utmost respect for the creativity of the mod creator, I would just like to know how other people feel about the balance. My experience with them has always felt really unusual and quite one sided. Perhaps I need to play with them more but I feel like when I'm Neutrino I can't lose because frankly, I rarely take damage. I'll provide more specifics if other people are interested in discussing it.

Edit: If the discussion goes into too much detail I'll probably move it to the Neutrino forum thread. At this point though, I'm not entirely convinced it isn't just my problem rather than balance.

Whenever I play any faction I feel strong. Maybe you are really good, because in all honesty a number of the neutrino ships are actually very prone to taking damage. The other think I think we aren't looking at is that even thought they are strong on the battlefield, the first ship they have that has an actual amount of cargo space compared to their drone ships. Also, most ships lack hanger space, thus you have almost no fighters, and their fighters are not very good. On top of all this, some ships have an extremely low pd armament for their size. I have found them to be powerful in auto-battle, but that is because of their shield efficiency, and a problem with how auto-battles are carried out.
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Okim

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2013, 05:51:57 AM »

Akhem, play total conversions, man ;)

mostmodest

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2013, 06:08:16 AM »

tbh, I see nothing wrong with the balancing. I must extend my congratulations to the modding community for spending hours of their time crearing these wonderful mods for us to play.

Now, onto the OT; there was no problems with my end of the scale. I think Uomoz and the modding community have gone above and beyond the call of duty with this mod. There were no problems with balancing for me. The only issue is to not go after fleets with far superior ships. Really, think of it as a Hound vs. Tempest fight, but with different ships and a wider variety.
You wouldn't go against a Tempest in a Hound, and you wouldn't go after one of their frigates if it's better than yours. Just like Vanilla, this mod requires an element of practice and learning. If at first you don't succeed, don't attack an Onslaught with a Lasher.
I see no reason for the hostile attitude to these people who spend hours on these exciting and creative mods.

That said, a general standard for balancing would be kind of cool, but we have vanilla for that.
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sdmike1

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2013, 06:43:52 AM »

Thule Legacy is not imba, The Confederacy of Free Stars is imba (the DL is on the last page)

oranoron

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2013, 06:48:28 AM »

Well, somebody had a pissy mood and Starfarersector mods took the fall for this one, the way i see it.

1) Say which mods you play

2) Your input on how to balance it

3) Really no need for bad baheviour here my friend. ;)

Yeah. I was literally making the original post while on hold for technical support when my visa was charged for something I bought online, my order was confirmed and I still was not receiving the digital goods I paid for. My mind was is was my credit card info just stolen territory. It didn't get resolved until much later.

1) The compilation, cosmonaut floating bodies, shadow order and my own faction mod the Union of Terran Technocratic Commonwealths.

2) Balance it decreasing the fleet size of the recon/scout tier fleets so that early game isn't a dangerous trek across hostile space to fight the pirate factions. I have never saved enough money to buy a second ship before getting jumped by some fleet of 2 Frigates or 2 Destroyers I couldn't avoid in time or possibly beat on my way back to a friendly station to sell loot without having to do a series of save/reload. At this point I've have had over a dozen attempts.
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oranoron

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2013, 06:50:55 AM »

tbh, I see nothing wrong with the balancing. I must extend my congratulations to the modding community for spending hours of their time crearing these wonderful mods for us to play.

Now, onto the OT; there was no problems with my end of the scale. I think Uomoz and the modding community have gone above and beyond the call of duty with this mod. There were no problems with balancing for me. The only issue is to not go after fleets with far superior ships. Really, think of it as a Hound vs. Tempest fight, but with different ships and a wider variety.
You wouldn't go against a Tempest in a Hound, and you wouldn't go after one of their frigates if it's better than yours. Just like Vanilla, this mod requires an element of practice and learning. If at first you don't succeed, don't attack an Onslaught with a Lasher.
I see no reason for the hostile attitude to these people who spend hours on these exciting and creative mods.

That said, a general standard for balancing would be kind of cool, but we have vanilla for that.

I have repeatedly stated the problem is not me picking fights I can't win, its being unable to avoid them for long enough to save any money is such an over crowded system. I am going to try temporarily removing them
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Pelhamds

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2013, 07:03:10 AM »

Hiya mate,

Ok I understand what you mean, you mean that the system is too crowded and you cannot avoid conflict and grind/play to get more money to get better ships and therefore (hopefully) take down some of the harder factions ships, I also see what you mean by having smaller faction scouting fleets, but you must remember that the mods are not controlled by ulmoz but by the actual modders, they are the ones that need to be contacted with a well thought out and sensible feedback  showing why you think they need to have smaller fleets of ships.

BTW if you could post your mod (Union of Terran Technocratic Commonwealths) as I would like to see what you have done, if it is a private mod then you don't need to, I am just curious.

(Also don't pile in on each other, like a group of food deprived badgers, he said he was *** off in his orginal post so you should expect that from him, even though it was rude not very polite, be tolerant but also oranoron be clearer with what you mean when you start a topic, it helps a lot)

Regards

Pelhamds
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oranoron

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2013, 11:13:56 AM »

but you must remember that the mods are not controlled by ulmoz but by the actual modders


Which is specifically why I insulted their inability to coordinate and work together to form a standard power level guild line. For *** sakes, this is a internet message board, a thing designed to enable that very thing yet no one has from what I can gather mentioned doing so until now. It should have been the first thing that anyone with a capacity to reason would have done.

Quite frankly I am surprise people with the skill to create these mods lacked the motivation or sense to do so.
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K-64

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2013, 11:31:02 AM »

You're still not giving any constructive feedback about it, nor are you stopping personal attacks against them. People may be more inclined to listen if you used a more respectful tone
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Erick Doe

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Re: Why Can None Of You Balance Your Custom Factions To Some Kind Of Standard?
« Reply #29 on: February 28, 2013, 11:32:46 AM »

Inability huh?

Uomoz's Corvus is a collection of individual mods that do not necessarily set out to coordinate and balace mods between one another. Inability has nothing to do with it. All the mods are being balanced toward vanilla starfarer. Though I'm sure the various modders do look at the other mods and keep them in mind to an extend, while developing their own content, as not to create awfully similar content.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2013, 11:34:18 AM by Erick Doe »
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