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Starsector 0.95a is out! (03/26/21)

Poll

What would you like to see in Blackrock?

More ships
- 558 (24.2%)
More weapons
- 360 (15.6%)
More campaign features
- 336 (14.6%)
Space monsters
- 492 (21.3%)
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Total Members Voted: 1039


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Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released  (Read 1448160 times)

Cycerin

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2880 on: June 13, 2019, 09:50:06 AM »

Yeah, it's due to a missing tag... will do some stuff to fix that and other weapon availability factors in the upcoming hotfix. Thanks for letting me know.
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eidolad

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2881 on: June 14, 2019, 06:24:07 PM »

Being somewhat new to StarSector I can only say as calmly as I can:  SOME COOL SHIP DESIGNS HERE


And a poll that asks:  might I want space dragons or other monsters.  Well by golly sign me up.
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Cyan Leader

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2882 on: June 16, 2019, 07:58:56 PM »

The slow beam speed of the Sunjet/Sunstorm really bring those weapons down when used in capital ships, especially something like the Paragon or with Advanced Optics. By the time the beam reaches its target it will have already used over half of its effective lifetime, cutting damage by half. The Sunjet is completely worthless in such scenarios.
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2883 on: June 16, 2019, 08:38:54 PM »

Yeah, I think that's actually fine for the smaller Sunjet, but the Sunfire and Sunstorm could probably use a moderate/significant boost to duration, beam speed, or both. Nothing earth-shaking, but it seems like a good idea given how far ITU+Advanced Optics stretches the beam range on a capital. Hell, even cruisers can struggle a bit with them.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2019, 08:41:08 PM by Soren »
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Sy

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2884 on: June 17, 2019, 03:34:46 AM »

would it be possible for the beam speed to scale with range? so that mounting a Sunfire on a Dragonfly would still have noticeable delay between firing and the beam hitting a target at max range, but the same Sunfire wouldn't lose so much more effectiveness on a Paragon with AO firing at a target at max range.
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vorpal+5

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2885 on: June 17, 2019, 12:20:46 PM »

I don't see any redeeming quality to the Micro Argus PD. Please explain? :)
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Ishman

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2886 on: June 17, 2019, 12:21:40 PM »

Sunfires are the original balanced implementation of HE beams, but with alex adding stuff like the 500dps 1000 range 1 flux efficiency HIL and more high quality factions with relatively vanilla balanced HE energy weapons, it could probably use a few tweaks to be brought up to standard.

Still my favorite beam weapon <3

Edit: Vorpal the short answer is balance. If everything a mod adds is more powerful than vanilla and other vanilla balanced mods, it's just a god/cheat mod. Factions need to have clear weaknesses and strengths. And the Argus PD is very good at swatting away light pressure from fighters and missiles, but is overwhelmed by weight of mass of incoming fire. It's intentional that you need to sacrifice OP and some small weapon slots to fit integrated PDAI to defend against heavy missile pressure, as many BRDY ships can dodge the overwhelming majority of things like torpedoes with their mobility systems.

You should note that many of the weapons were designed and created for the state of the game 6+ years ago.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2019, 01:02:01 PM by Ishman »
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Cycerin

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2887 on: June 17, 2019, 12:55:21 PM »

I had the same feeling for a while about PDEs, realized that most of the time some other weapon is more worth the slot/OP investment.

I did some tweaking on the build and decided to rebalance all stats around longer burst duration and beamspeed for all three - should be far better in their intended role comboing with kinetic fire. The bigger weapons have longer range and duration and thus are better overall, but are a bigger slot investment. Gonna playtest and work on some other stuff alongside it to arrive at something that feels just right.

I don't see any redeeming quality to the Micro Argus PD. Please explain? :)

It's a burst-operated PD beam for 4 OP.

But it does have one unique strength, it costs no flux to fire and thus can be left firing without taking away your 0-flux boost. It's niche but it can be more relevant than you think.
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Sy

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2888 on: June 17, 2019, 03:31:59 PM »

after trying the Antaeus for a bit, i think that thing needs a nerf. ^^

overall i love that cruiser. beefy, decent firepower, good PD coverage, fun mobility system, and a cool sprite. i just think it's overtuned atm. the combination of (by BRDY standards) great armor, good shield effiency, great shield coverage, good flux stats, high OP, better maneuverability than i'd expect from such a brick, a unique built-in hullmod that gives weapon durability and flat range increase, and also not really expensive (for a heavy cruiser) on top of that.. i think it's too much.

letting it duel a Dominator in simulator (with my custom loadout, but all weapons and hullmods are either vanilla or BRDY), it absolutely wipes the floor with the balanced Dominator loadout. if i put my lvl 17 officer on it, it will happily facetank the simulator Onslaught and win a duel against it with only minor damage to armor/hull.

i'd prefer if it didn't entirely lose any of the things that make it good though. it's nice having a BRDY cruiser with good armor and decent shields, and still firepower and OP to match the heavy cruiser designation. so i'd suggest just giving it minor-ish nerfs more or less across the board, rather than big nerfs in any specific respects. something like so:
- OP 170 -> 160
- flux cap 10k -> 9k
- flux dissipation 550 -> 450
- shield efficiency 0.8 -> 0.9
- shield arc 180° -> 150° (so it can still get a bubble shield with Shield Conversion + Extended Shields)
- deployment cost 26 -> 30
- and maybe some nerfs to maneuverability, especially turn acceleration

armor and hull i'd keep as they are, to make it stand out more vs the other BRDY cruisers as the tanky one. shield, flux, and OP nerfs should already reduce its overall staying power a bit.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2019, 03:50:38 PM by Sy »
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lethargie

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2889 on: June 17, 2019, 07:11:45 PM »

Wow, I tried it but wasn't so impressed, can you share your build?

Btw the new asura is fun to fly but absolutely cannot be used by the AI. They just flux lock themselves and never take the time to vent. And i still miss the old sprite, I remember using the phase asura even though i found it really bad just because it looked good.
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Agalyon

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2890 on: June 17, 2019, 08:54:17 PM »

Just wanted to drop in and say I've been playing with blackrock since it was first released and I'm beyond excited to have it back. I know you get harassed a lot for updates, but thank you for all the hard work. Seriously. On behalf of all the lurkers out there, its appreciated.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2019, 08:55:54 PM by HeartofDiscord »
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Sy

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2891 on: June 18, 2019, 09:11:46 AM »

Wow, I tried it but wasn't so impressed, can you share your build?
sure, though i don't think it needs a super special loadout to do it. just one that can take a lot of shield damage without getting flux-locked too quickly, and one that can punish the Onslaught for venting. the Typhoons i use actually almost never get hits on the Onslaught (almost all the actual damage is done by the Shards and Sunfire) because its PD is just too strong. but they do prevent it from just venting while the Antaeus could easily punish it with double Reapers, whereas the officer-piloted Antaeus does have enough armor durability to make some aggressive vents even while under pressure from Annihilators.

this is the loadout i use in my campaign. it has the +10% OP from player skills, but isn't actually purpose-built specifically to counter an Onslaught. just a general beefy loadout designed to go toe-to-toe with other big guys, or otherwise act as a fleet anchor in large engagements:
Spoiler
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armor state after the duel:
Spoiler
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this loadout is without the +10% OP, but more purpose-built to counter the Onslaught in a face-to-face duel, sacrificing some rear protection and weapon range that don't matter much in an engagement with only one enemy:
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armor state after the duel:
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in both cases, this is the officer i use. at lvl 20, with the +50% missile hp, the duel would likely be even more one-sided:
Spoiler
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a couple things to note here:
- the armor damage taken isn't always that minor, often armor gets breached at the nose while venting under Annihilator fire, and taking some hull damage in the process. but it does still win the duel in most cases, and usually quite handily.
- the officer is obviously a huge advantage compared to the simulator Onslaught. however, i still think it shouldn't be able to win a duel by engaging the Onslaught directly from the front, especially not so easily, with having most of its armor and hull remaining afterwards in most attempts.
- yes, this is purely under AI control. i just started the simulator and deployed the Onslaught, then enabled autopilot.
- if pure AI control is not quite enough for an Antaeus loadout to win the duel, just giving an Eliminate command at the start can make a big difference, because it makes the Antaeus more willing to vent aggressively, and engage even while at high flux -- both of which can be very helpful against the Onslaught's weapon range superiority. this could also be counted as an unfair advantage against the simulator ship, but is an advantage the player can often make use of in actual battles as well. and these screenshots were made without that additional advantage.
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Ubik

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2892 on: June 18, 2019, 12:32:34 PM »

Is there a problem with learning or applying BRDY specific hullmods?

So far I have found and learned 3 hullmods but when trying to modify my BRDY ships I fail to find those mods.

Or am I missing something?
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Cycerin

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2893 on: June 18, 2019, 01:14:55 PM »

@Sy - I appreciate the detailed feedback! Together, I think the nerfs you proposed would make the Antaeus bad. Like, actually bad. However, I agree that it's overtuned, but not to the extent that these simulator scenarios appear to indicate. A drastic nerf would make the ship useless by virtue of being a giant target that naturally puts itself at the front of the line, in a faction where almost no other ship is capable of taking the heat for it when things go bad. I'm gonna be tweaking a few things (mainly the shield) and bump the supply footprint up to 30, I think.

Or am I missing something?

hmm you probably have the "Blackrock" hullmod tag deselected by default. Under the hullmod list when picking a hullmod, check if it's selected or not.

Just wanted to drop in and say I've been playing with blackrock since it was first released and I'm beyond excited to have it back. I know you get harassed a lot for updates, but thank you for all the hard work. Seriously. On behalf of all the lurkers out there, its appreciated.

Glad to hear it! I don't really know what else to say, but I really am happy to know people are having fun with the stuff I made.
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Ubik

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Re: [0.9.1a] Blackrock Drive Yards v0.9.5a (10.06.2019) - Hotfix released
« Reply #2894 on: June 18, 2019, 01:29:46 PM »

hmm you probably have the "Blackrock" hullmod tag deselected by default. Under the hullmod list when picking a hullmod, check if it's selected or not.

Indeed, I had missed to check for the BRDY hullmod tag...  ::)

Ty for this mod with absolutely gorgeous ships btw.  :)
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