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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: Blog Posts  (Read 337528 times)

Thaago

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #390 on: April 23, 2012, 08:42:04 AM »

...
Thoughtful post.
...

I would like something like this, but may I suggest that the bonus is not a 'bam you are better!' type thing?

Instead of becoming a better crew trainer all of a sudden when your 100th green becomes elite, why not just have it be that every time your crew levels up you get a very small bonus to that? A 'get better by doing' approach. By fielding large fleets (and winning) you get slightly better at logistics (FP bonus) or by buying and selling you get slightly better at trading.

I am thinking a more Elder Scrolls system (although I have issues with their implementation as well) as I find it to be better for immersion as opposed to large static bonuses.
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Hyph_K31

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #391 on: April 23, 2012, 08:59:15 AM »

*positive grunting noises*

Yes, i think that would be a nice way of doing it...

Though i think some "bam you are better!" perks would also be nice, like if you hired a marine/crew trainer and such, maybe even computer cores that improve various stats of the fleet.
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K-64

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #392 on: April 23, 2012, 09:00:26 AM »

Then once that ship turns to dust you're back at square one :P
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Hyph_K31

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #393 on: April 23, 2012, 09:27:38 AM »

Then once that ship turns to dust you're back at square one :P

Ehh... what?
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K-64

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #394 on: April 23, 2012, 09:29:32 AM »

If it's a computer core thing, that means it is installed on the ship. Ship goes boom, you won't have time to grab it while you make a mad dash to your escape pod/shuttle/thing. Therefore, you lose that nifty bonus.

I was joking and being slightly nitpicky
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WK

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #395 on: April 23, 2012, 10:27:02 AM »

Like people have noted, there are so many ways of accomplishing the effects in a game like this that the whole concept needs to be carefully considered.

The elder scrolls type learning thing is something I'm very fond of as well, but it behaves in slightly different way and is closer to normal leveling. Therefore it does not give that "notification screen" type of sense of accomplishment that some people seem to be very addicted to.  As a compromise multilevel achievements might work where you got a small bonus every so often.

Another way to accomplish the effect is through the crew or ship components. This is again all very fine, but is part of the normal game and probably not satisfactory for people who like achievements. Separate achievements reward you for playing in certain way while you are struggling towards domination of the entire galaxy and can in that sense add another layer, a meta game if you wish. In that sense achievements can be a good thing, again, if done right.

I really have to say that I like how Alex is involving the community.

He has plenty of options to accomplish progression in the game:
-"wealth" (better ship(s), money, weapons, stations?)
-player character
-crew
-reputation/rank among factions
-story missions (if there is a story)
-achievements

The more I think of it, the more I like some form of accomplishment-system for this game. This game has the potential of being one hell of a time sink with the "just a wee bit more"-feeling. On the other hand I really hope that the pace of progression will be slow enough that we will have the joy of getting a new gun for the first ship and eventually being able to upgrade the ship and much later to be able to buy (or loot) another ship etc. Having achievements would allow the pacing to be slow and still give players sense of progression and accomplishment to give the game even more of that "I'll play just to level up/to get that new gun/that new ship/that 'win a fight against 3 enemies with just one ship'-achievement"-kind if feeling.

Sorry for another lengthy post :)
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Vandala

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #396 on: April 23, 2012, 10:31:51 AM »

WK, you don't need achievements for that "just a wee bit more-feeling". You just need a good game.

K-64

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #397 on: April 23, 2012, 10:35:35 AM »

You don't need developer created goals and popups to give you a gold star. Whatever happened to good-old self-imposed challenges and targets? If want to brag about it to others, print screen it! Show off screenshots of your epic fleets or have a video showing your surmounting of impossible odds for the fun of it. Having an achievement system depersonalises the whole process of challenging oneself, since they're not the one laying down the challenge, and the game isn't truly completed until they have grabbed those achievements, whether they feel it's necessary or not. Might seem petty that last point, but for people with OCD levels of completionism, myself included, it gets rather daunting, annoying and even frustrating.
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BillyRueben

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #398 on: April 23, 2012, 10:37:14 AM »

I figure I'll add in my two cents.

I'm not a fan of achievements. Granted, the achievements on the Xbox 360 might have had a large influence on my opinion.

My biggest complaint is being "railroaded" in to a very specific playstyle. For example, the suggestion WK had: "win a fight against 3 enemies with just one ship". It would force me to either use a larger or much more advanced ship than what the enemy is using, when I like to use the small, low-tech ships. Or, it would force me to take a large risk, when in the early game when I have only one ship, I'm trying my best to play it safe. I just don't see the appeal or game play addition that achievements bring. If I destroyed an enemy fleet that was twice the size of mine, I don't need the game to tell me that I kickass. I already know. I was there.
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Vandala

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #399 on: April 23, 2012, 10:43:48 AM »

Plus having achievements takes away for the actual achievement. You don't know if it's possible to get throe a game with some sort of handicap, thats the challenge, until it's a standard achievement then you know its possible and becomes work. It takes a way the fun and mystery, the feeling your on new ground, trying something nobody else ever has.

Hyph_K31

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #400 on: April 23, 2012, 11:29:04 AM »

Something else, have any of you guys player gracious space battles? (I suppose some of you must have done...)

But one thing i really liked about that game were those "reports", that you got as a battle progressed and ships got damaged and defeated/damaged other ships... needless to say i think that a system like this would be "most excellent".

It would also help give you a rough idea of whats going on in a fight without having to check the map all the time.

But i not sure that such a thing would really fit the way command points work...
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Vandala

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #401 on: April 23, 2012, 11:41:50 AM »

Something else, have any of you guys player gracious space battles? (I suppose some of you must have done...)

But one thing i really liked about that game were those "reports", that you got as a battle progressed and ships got damaged and defeated/damaged other ships... needless to say i think that a system like this would be "most excellent".

It would also help give you a rough idea of whats going on in a fight without having to check the map all the time.

But i not sure that such a thing would really fit the way command points work...
I've played it, those reports got repetitive and meaningless.

Upgradecap

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #402 on: April 23, 2012, 11:47:57 AM »

Something else, have any of you guys player gracious space battles? (I suppose some of you must have done...)

But one thing i really liked about that game were those "reports", that you got as a battle progressed and ships got damaged and defeated/damaged other ships... needless to say i think that a system like this would be "most excellent".

It would also help give you a rough idea of whats going on in a fight without having to check the map all the time.

But i not sure that such a thing would really fit the way command points work...
I've played it, those reports got repetitive and meaningless.

Yeah, i have to agree with vandala here.
Though you did get to see which ship was most effective/which layout/design etc.
But they did get repetetive overtime.
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WK

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #403 on: April 23, 2012, 12:07:27 PM »

You don't need developer created goals and popups to give you a gold star.

I agree completely. As I said in my previous post, I don't see the current standard system (i.e. the golden stars) working in this game (or in any game). But if the achievements are well thought of and have actual rewards that make sense for the game play, they might add to the game. Like BillyRueben pointed out, the last suggestion was not a good one (1v3). But I'm just throwing them from the top of my head and not really giving them the consideration that they require if those are done well.

It is not something that is necessary as there are other ways to accomplish similar effects, but if used properly they might be something really worth considering.
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Hyph_K31

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Re: Blog Posts
« Reply #404 on: April 23, 2012, 12:16:44 PM »

Something else, have any of you guys player gracious space battles? (I suppose some of you must have done...)

But one thing i really liked about that game were those "reports", that you got as a battle progressed and ships got damaged and defeated/damaged other ships... needless to say i think that a system like this would be "most excellent".

It would also help give you a rough idea of whats going on in a fight without having to check the map all the time.

But i not sure that such a thing would really fit the way command points work...
I've played it, those reports got repetitive and meaningless.

I agree on that.

that is why i think that if such a system was ever to be included in starfarer, i think it should be purely informative E.g.:

The Onslaught - >ship name< - is under fire by the Aurora - >ship name< - .

Obviously it could be reworded, but its just a simple example of the sort of thing i would like to see.
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