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Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Industrial.Evolution 1.7.d - Industries with non-standard effects  (Read 73684 times)

BrotherBiscuit

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Welcome to the Forums and thanks for the report. This is an error that was present in the beta, but was fixed for the release - so it should go away once you update the mod.
Regarding the high negative change - I am not sure. If you attacked an ally with rep 100, it's possible your reputation dropped by around -150 - which could lead to a massive additional drop from the Embassy, even worse if you got more than one - the system is rather robust so this is somewhat of a surprise.

I'm using v1.7b which I believe is the most recent version. Unless I'm confused?
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SirHartley

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I'm using v1.7b which I believe is the most recent version. Unless I'm confused?

Took another look at this - it is, in fact, a new problem with the same error as last time.
Fixed it in dev version, thanks for the report!

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Nick XR

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I'm really loving this mod, it adds a lot to the game without breaking balance.  Thank you!

But I think I've found an issue however.   The description from my military relays are claiming they're getting a bonus from a high command that no longer exists (downgraded it a year or so ago).  Steps:

1. Planet 1: build a high command
2. Planet 1: build a relay
3. Planet 1: Install alpha core in high command
4. Planet 2: build patrol hq
5. Planet 2: build relay
Planet 2 should be getting its bonus from planet 1 at this point
6. Planet 2: upgrade to high command
7. Planet 1: downgrade to patrol HQ
8. Planet 2 will claim it still getting its bonus from planet 1

Or maybe I'm just confused as to what the bonus % actually is.  Is it based off of planet size, alpha core, military base, or some combination of all three? So it's entirely likely it's correct, I just can't figure it out.

SirHartley

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The Military relay is the weak point of this mod at the moment, the effect is hard to understand and lacks good descriptions.

What you noticed was not a bug, but badly explained intended behaviour.
The long description of what this does:

Relay build requirement:
- One military base or high command in the star system
- Patrol HQ, military base or high command on the planet

The relay checks which planets are owned by you and get the highest fleet size of any planet with a relay - regardless of military base /HC location.

The relay always calculates fleet sizes without the current relay bonus, so it might appear that a planet has a larger fleet when that is in fact only due to the relay, which gets ignored for bonus calculation!

It then applies part of that highest fleet size to all planets with a relay, excluding the planet with the highest fleet size. (This is a flat bonus, so any multipliers you have apply to it, which in turn can make the fleet size exceed the planet that has the "original" largest fleet.)

The applied fleet size is calculated as follows, valid for all planets in a star system:
Military base: 20% of highest fleet size applied
High command: 35% of highest fleet size applied
High command with alpha core: 40% of highest fleet size applied

AI core effects work only from a high command, not from a military base.

I am having issues explaining that effect short tooltip, which led to the poor state it is currently in - sorry for that, it's being worked on as the relay gets more love with the next update.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 03:18:12 PM by SirHartley »
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BrotherBiscuit

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The Military relay is the weak point of this mod at the moment, the effect is hard to understand and lacks good descriptions.

What you noticed was not a bug, but badly explained intended behaviour.
The long description of what this does:

Relay build requirement:
- One military base or high command in the star system
- Patrol HQ, military base or high command on the planet

The relay checks which planets are owned by you and get the highest fleet size of any planet with a relay - regardless of military base /HC location.

The relay always calculates fleet sizes without the current relay bonus, so it might appear that a planet has a larger fleet when that is in fact only due to the relay, which gets ignored for bonus calculation!

It then applies part of that highest fleet size to all planets with a relay, excluding the planet with the highest fleet size. (This is a flat bonus, so any multipliers you have apply to it, which in turn can make the fleet size exceed the planet that has the "original" largest fleet.)

The applied fleet size is calculated as follows, valid for all planets in a star system:
Military base: 20% of highest fleet size applied
High command: 35% of highest fleet size applied
High command with alpha core: 40% of highest fleet size applied

AI core effects work only from a high command, not from a military base.

I am having issues explaining that effect short tooltip, which led to the poor state it is currently in - sorry for that, it's being worked on as the relay gets more love with the next update.

I actually had a question about the relays.

Does the planet with the highest fleet bonus need a militarybase/highcommand AND a military relay to grant it's bonus to a *** planet with only a patrol station and a military relay?

Or does Highest-Fleet-Bonus planet only need the militarybase/highcommand in order to grant it's bonus?
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SirHartley

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consider the relays a network - planets in the network share fleet size. They will only ever consider the fleet size of a planet if it has a relay, regardless of MB/HC location.
The highest fleet planet only needs a relay to grant its bonus to the network - no military base or command.
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TheDboys

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Just wanted to say thanks for making this mod it adds a lot of fun stuff to colony building!
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SirHartley

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Just wanted to say thanks for making this mod it adds a lot of fun stuff to colony building!

Thanks! Much appreciated :)

Update 1.7.c
Officers in Training in an academy might get moved to storage by this update, you might have to re-set them in some cases!

Added an upgrade to the military relay that extends the network to any system with an interstellar array. Yes, as if this was not complicated enough already.
There is now an FAQ for both of these (Military/Interstellar Relay), please check them out if you are confused. Also, this should help: Link to picture

Restoration Docks were fixed (Again) and no longer rip you off when you repair something like an XIV variant. They are now actually cheaper than fast restoration, and all those poor managers that stole your money should fear for their lives. They also care about AI core effects again.
There is now a cost preview for the restoration, expand the storage tooltip with F1 to see it.

Change Log

1.7.c
  • Embassy
  • Fixed - No longer crashes during invasions
  • Fixed - Corrected rep loss calculation
  • Restoration Docks
  • Adjusted - Fee now correctly scales to +/- 50% cost depending on standing
  • Fixed - AI core effects now actually apply under AI control
  • Fixed - Fixed cost calculations, again - it doesn't rip you off anymore
  • Fixed - Added cost preview to Storage tooltip - expand with F1
  • Military Relay
  • Adjusted - Reworked descriptions
  • Interstellar Relay
  • Added - Extends Military Relay effects to every star system with this structure.
  • Added - Works as Makeshift Communications Relay in a star system without taking a stable location
  • Note - There is a FAQ for this, since both military relay and this seem to cause confusion.
[close]

Edit - Hotfix 1.7.d because the updating script refuses to work and caused crashes.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2020, 04:36:15 PM by SirHartley »
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Mondaymonkey

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Quote
The relay always calculates fleet sizes without the relay bonus, so it might appear that a planet has a larger fleet when that is in fact only due to the current relay effect, which gets ignored for bonus calculations.

The huge red cockroaches living in my head, send fiery greetings to whoever lives in your! ©

Isn't better just limit a bonus, so it can not increase fleetsize more than, idk, 90% of the largest fleetsize in a network? So largest remain largest and smaller get bigger bonus, than comparable to largest?
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I dislike human beings... or I just do not know how to cook them well.

Nick XR

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Added an upgrade to the military relay that extends the network to any system with an interstellar array. Yes, as if this was not complicated enough already.
There is now an FAQ for both of these (Military/Interstellar Relay), please check them out if you are confused. Also, this should help: Link to picture



I looked at the picture and I'm not still sure I get it, maybe it's a personal problem :/ 
Just throwing it out there, maybe if the behavior was each relay in a network adds 5% to the local bonus (with some cap. So 7 planets in network would deliver a 35% fleet bonus to each planet) it would be a lot easier for people to understand what their final result will be before they build it so they can weigh if using a building slot is worth it.

SirHartley

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The huge red cockroaches living in my head, send fiery greetings to whoever lives in your! ©

Isn't better just limit a bonus, so it can not increase fleetsize more than, idk, 90% of the largest fleetsize in a network? So largest remain largest and smaller get bigger bonus, than comparable to largest?

Capping the effect to not execeed the systemwide highest fleet site is a good idea. I'll see if I can't implement that next update.


I looked at the picture and I'm not still sure I get it, maybe it's a personal problem :/ 
Just throwing it out there, maybe if the behavior was each relay in a network adds 5% to the local bonus (with some cap. So 7 planets in network would deliver a 35% fleet bonus to each planet) it would be a lot easier for people to understand what their final result will be before they build it so they can weigh if using a building slot is worth it.


I think the core of this proposal is that there is a problem judging if building this is worth it as the effects are hard to estimate. Not sure how to remedy this as you need at least two relays for an effect prediction to be possible.

I could always point the player towards the ideal configuration and base a tooltip on that, but I feel like that would patronize the player and rob them of the opportunity to think about what to do - which is two thirds of the fun to me.

Flat bonus addition via "build this, get stuff" also isn't really something I'm looking for in a structure - there are vanilla mechanics that are better for this.
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Crimson Sky Gaurdian

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Somewhat of a bug; the privateer base never says the 1/system limit.
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Reavenant

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The huge red cockroaches living in my head, send fiery greetings to whoever lives in your! ©

Isn't better just limit a bonus, so it can not increase fleetsize more than, idk, 90% of the largest fleetsize in a network? So largest remain largest and smaller get bigger bonus, than comparable to largest?

Capping the effect to not execeed the systemwide highest fleet site is a good idea. I'll see if I can't implement that next update.


I looked at the picture and I'm not still sure I get it, maybe it's a personal problem :/ 
Just throwing it out there, maybe if the behavior was each relay in a network adds 5% to the local bonus (with some cap. So 7 planets in network would deliver a 35% fleet bonus to each planet) it would be a lot easier for people to understand what their final result will be before they build it so they can weigh if using a building slot is worth it.


I think the core of this proposal is that there is a problem judging if building this is worth it as the effects are hard to estimate. Not sure how to remedy this as you need at least two relays for an effect prediction to be possible.

I could always point the player towards the ideal configuration and base a tooltip on that, but I feel like that would patronize the player and rob them of the opportunity to think about what to do - which is two thirds of the fun to me.

Flat bonus addition via "build this, get stuff" also isn't really something I'm looking for in a structure - there are vanilla mechanics that are better for this.


Hello There!

I've encountered a funny but game braking/crashing bug:
I have a system of 6 planets (3 belong to me, 3 to my faction). All of my planets have military relays with one High Command. Upgrading any of the relays to interstellar gave me a bonus of +2147483647% on every planet. If I go to the custom fleet doctrines my game hangs and CTD :<

Also, I don't know why but one of my planets, where a salvage yard exist has duplicated itself on my list of planets. It shows 0 income, has a secretary assign as overseer (can't change it as it automatically reverse) but doesn't count towards the number of owned planets. Is this normal?

No other mods affecting fleets installed.

Best regards,
Reavenant

« Last Edit: June 15, 2020, 01:01:48 PM by Reavenant »
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Crimson Sky Gaurdian

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Also, I don't know why but one of my planets, where a salvage yard exist has duplicated itself on my list of planets. It shows 0 income, has a secretary assign as overseer (can't change it as it automatically reverse) but doesn't count towards the number of owned planets. Is this normal?
That's just how it works.
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SirHartley

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Somewhat of a bug; the privateer base never says the 1/system limit.

Thanks for letting me know - added the tooltip in dev.


I've encountered a funny but game braking/crashing bug:
I have a system of 6 planets (3 belong to me, 3 to my faction). All of my planets have military relays with one High Command. Upgrading any of the relays to interstellar gave me a bonus of +2147483647% on every planet. If I go to the custom fleet doctrines my game hangs and CTD :<

That's a bug.
What do you mean with "my faction" - the Nex autonomy feature?

Thanks for letting me know, I'll try replicating this.

Also, I don't know why but one of my planets, where a salvage yard exist has duplicated itself on my list of planets. It shows 0 income, has a secretary assign as overseer (can't change it as it automatically reverse) but doesn't count towards the number of owned planets. Is this normal?

This is how the salvage yards can function alongside heavy industry. Without this, it would not register as output for production budget calculations.
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