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Author Topic: Andromeda, oh Andromeda  (Read 3056 times)

Arcagnello

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Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« on: November 17, 2019, 05:49:01 AM »

I tried quite a number of builds to complement my 1 Paragon / 2 Astral / 2 Doom /  4 Drover  setup.

I spammed Medusas followed by a cavalcade of point defence Scarabs just to watch them getting blapped one by one by a single angry Skimmer battleship boi and lewed by naughty pirate flagships.

I opted for a MOAR DAKKA LADS build with mass dominators escorting my Paragon to just realize that they really, really like to not get their Shields up in front of Star fortresses and turning 90 degrees to point at a single blasted broadsword the moment a thousand rockets are coming their way.

I had Conquest meatybois chase a singular destroyer each into the sunset while a whole lot of Onslaughts pressed the big red *WAAAAGH* button on the command panel and initiated a non consensual penetration session with my Astrals.

But then, the asymmetrical waifu descended from the heavens and blessed me with it's thicc statlines and swift
plasma thrusters seductiveness, exacting revenge on all who dared prevent me from starting a 300FP battle, setting everything on Search&Destroy, go make coffee and come back when it's over with no losses on my side.


The Aurora is really making me wonder if I should even bother with anything that's not a Paragon, an Astral or a Spark-vomiting set of Drovers:

It's really, really fast; especially when every carrier you bring into the field has nav relay

It has half a Paragon worth of Flux reserve and dissipation rate

It gets a STOCK 0.8 damage to flux ratio, which gets to an absolutely disgusting 0.55 when you have a hardened shield modspec and reaches even more ludicrous levels of "keep your hands off me you lowly vermin" when combined with a Front Shield modspec making the damn arc 360 degrees

It has so much defensive capabilities I litterally smashed an IR laser on every single small hardpoint/front facing turret and complemented with a dual blaster/ion minigun (forgot what the medium sized short ranged spamtastic ion boi is called), punted all and every point defence option aside since it's for beta cruisers and baffly watched a single one of these Chads aggro half a dozen between pirate shrikes/Sunders, get chased into the sunset and buzzsawing each one of them one by one.


I...I honestly think it's worth 35 fleet points AT THE VERY least since two of them can actually exceed a Paragon when dealing with anything, ANYTHING that is not a remnant fortress provided you have even the minimal fighter cover. Yes, even the *omae wa mou, shindeiru* Skimmer battleships.

Just pray you can either suck off Tri-Tach hard enough to get as many of these as possible once the many moons of all the star systems in the known Galaxy align and they actually sell one of you sacrifice enough flux for the flux god to actually find its blueprints.

« Last Edit: November 17, 2019, 05:56:14 AM by Arcagnello »
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Igncom1

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2019, 06:38:44 AM »

Yeah but it has to use energy weapons, which suck.  ;)

But yeah some cost effective pulse lasers and the like can make most of the high-techs decent enough against high shield enemies, as simply no other energy weapons are good against shields that aren't a 'long term investment' beam.
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Arcagnello

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2019, 07:23:34 AM »

Energy weapon don't "suck", it's just that most of them need to be deployed en masse to actually achieve the thing they're supposed to do.

Graviton beams are quite good at grinding the enemy down but you really need at least three of them going off at once from a long enough range to really matter. The only ship in my fleet using them is the Paragon flagship

Tactical lasers are the same thing but more damage focused. My Paragon was the only one using them before I switched them all for LR PD spam to focus more on being a tank

Tachyon lances/Ion beams/autopulse lasers/high intensity lasers offer great results on unshielded targets from great distances, but need support from the former two energy weapons to bring Shields down thru attrition

IR pulse lasers are the brawling energy weapon of choice since it's a never ending stream of flux efficient DAKKA which create the base for energy weapons with a bit more "oof"

Speaking of short range "oof" blasters, heavy Blasters, plasma cannons and the ion minigun looking medium mount thingy can shred things in mere volleys but they need pressure to do the work.


The important thing with lasers I'd that you either go long range melting or close range blapping, there is no middle ground and attempting to achieve it will do nothing but have your AI controlled ships only use half of their offensive potential at a time.

Edit: Wait just saw the wink, you were being sarcastic weren't you  :P
« Last Edit: November 17, 2019, 07:29:39 AM by Arcagnello »
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Igncom1

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2019, 09:00:24 AM »

Mostly yeah. I'd personally say they are bad in the same way that any kind of generalist weapon is bad. Which is fine against poorly shielded foes as anything can kill them, even kinetics and frag damage weapons when employed in large enough numbers.

But against some of the more tenacious and heavily shielded foes, high tech ships with great flux pools really suffer in the inability to deal with shields using energy weapons, basically turning an advantage of a high techs flux and shield into a bare necessity to keeping them functional at all. What with most energy weapons being flux hogs.

Not to say that I don't like energy weapons, or high tech ships, but their ability to delete pirates isn't nearly as impressive as it often seems. The T Lance in particular is a weapon, in my opinion, that only works when you have already won. If their flux cap isn't better then yours, then you win. If it isn't then a T lance basically just bounces off a shield for soft flux that is easily disposed of by other high tech ships. The shield piercing emp only having a chance of happening when the enemy is at high flux, not low.

Many energy weapons are like this, basically placing them in the role of less effective HE for such fights. My end game paragon has 4 autopulse lasers because anything else wither has no really effect without support, or will eventually overload the very ships trying to fire them.
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Tackywheat1

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2019, 09:54:24 AM »

Energy weapon don't "suck", it's just that most of them need to be deployed en masse to actually achieve the thing they're supposed to do.

Graviton beams are quite good at grinding the enemy down but you really need at least three of them going off at once from a long enough range to really matter. The only ship in my fleet using them is the Paragon flagship

Tactical lasers are the same thing but more damage focused. My Paragon was the only one using them before I switched them all for LR PD spam to focus more on being a tank

Tachyon lances/Ion beams/autopulse lasers/high intensity lasers offer great results on unshielded targets from great distances, but need support from the former two energy weapons to bring Shields down thru attrition

IR pulse lasers are the brawling energy weapon of choice since it's a never ending stream of flux efficient DAKKA which create the base for energy weapons with a bit more "oof"

Speaking of short range "oof" blasters, heavy Blasters, plasma cannons and the ion minigun looking medium mount thingy can shred things in mere volleys but they need pressure to do the work.


The important thing with lasers I'd that you either go long range melting or close range blapping, there is no middle ground and attempting to achieve it will do nothing but have your AI controlled ships only use half of their offensive potential at a time.

Edit: Wait just saw the wink, you were being sarcastic weren't you  :P

Autopulse is terrible against armored unshielded targets. Its low base damage means it doesnt really do much armor damage per hit and requires hitting the same spot to have much effect
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Arcagnello

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2019, 10:17:36 AM »

I personally like the Tacyon Lance because of that, at least it hits the same spot for a lot of damage once the shield is down. High intensity laser is neat too
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Arcagnello

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2019, 10:54:46 AM »

Although I have to say .my favourite energy weapon are the blasters. They do absolutely brutal damage if you've got enough defences to get close and still have flux to fire them
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Arcagnello

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2019, 06:37:38 PM »

I just went back to long range laser vomit with the Auroras too. The DPS they bring to the table for their FP is low but they litterally do not generate flux with all weapons going off and the shield up making the AI fairly aggressive despite my steady commanders. They're quite good line holders that buy a lot of time for my Astrals to do the dirty work. They also make for shoddy anti missile/fighter units which is hilarious to see.

Going for hegemony bounties featuring 5-Onslaught fleets and just ending up surrounding them with flashlight cruisers looked and felt very wrong.
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Lucky33

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2019, 07:44:21 PM »

Wrong? Why? You are doing exactly what you are supposed to.

Even lore wise.

"Historically the Heron represented a movement in Domain Armada strategy from a heavy capital ship doctrine based on overwhelming firepower toward a focus on strike craft and support cruisers that enable sufficient firepower to be quickly focused on weak points, a strategic shift that would reverse itself as a natural reaction against tradition from each successive generation of Armada officers. This process was occurring once more in the years immediately preceding the fall of the gate system and, in something of a coup for the so-called "Cruiser School"

Flashlights are the only flux-friendly option for the high-tech so even that is completely OK.
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Arcagnello

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2019, 04:16:55 AM »

I forgot that text was there actually haha.

I might give small high tech ships a shot in the next campaigns trying to have them all range focused. I will definitely have a pirate campaign before that tough. I've actually tried raiding pirate/luddic path bases before destroying them and it does make some profit to be worth it, although I guess hauling 2000 Marines in your fleet all the time is definitely overkill.
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Arcagnello

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2019, 03:20:38 PM »

So... I actually realized it's called Aurora. The humiliation. It stings. Make it stop.
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Daynen

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2019, 04:40:53 AM »

Hey hey now, who's knocking my autopulsers?  You load up a paragon with four of those things, get some range mods and extended magazines and EVERYTHING DIES.  Sweep them across an incoming fighter swarm and enjoy the fireworks.  Frigates dance around in a cold sweat trying not to get hit by twenty shots at a time (spoilers: they usually fail.)  Destroyers are just lemmings.  Cruisers pray to Ludd they've wasted enough of your shots before dying to buy their fleet some time (more spoilers: they usually dont.)  Capital ships become the JUICIEST targets.  Armor melts away.  Shields?  You better be running some HARDCORE shields to tank four autopulsers.  Phase ships spend their entire LIVES trying to dance back out of range because you've always got a few shots ready.  Even other paragons start to back the hell off after I unload almost 200 shots into them over the course of about four seconds...of course you then have to wait to recharge but I can take down an ONSLAUGHT in a single volley and still have weapon slots and flux to spare.

RESPECT the autopulse laser...or pay your respects to your dearly departed fleet.
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bobucles

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #12 on: November 20, 2019, 04:59:25 AM »

Autopulsers are pretty good, but the secret sauce to making them work is Fortress Shield. When most ships run out of weapon juice, they're stuck sitting around like idiots and get ruined by other weapons with higher overall stats. The Paragon doesn't get punished, because it can turtle up while its weapons recharge. The hard flux from getting attacked gets pushed to nearly nothing, and the ship can essentially trade its entire soft flux stockpile for a very minor increase in hard flux. The fortress shield drops, and a full autopulser can do it all over again. It's a fantastic combo and would also be fantastic for phase ships, if any of them could actually fit the weapons.

intrinsic_parity

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #13 on: November 20, 2019, 09:47:15 AM »

Skills make a big difference with auto pulse as well. It really lacks armor penetration, and damage boosting skills increase the damage per shot making it much better against armor. An auto pulse sunder is actually pretty scary as well with it's damage boosting system.
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Tackywheat1

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Re: Andromeda, oh Andromeda
« Reply #14 on: November 20, 2019, 07:21:31 PM »

Autopulse is outclassed by Plasma Cannon in every way except range, flux efficiency, OP cost, and burst power. However, the decreased OP cost is negated by a need for expanded mags (unless you run more than 2 autopulse). Plasma cannon is far better sustained firing and at armor cracking. In my own game, I buffed autopulse so that it reloaded 3 shots per second rather than 2.

Autopulse is better mounted on ships that can't deal with the plasma's intense flux usage, that can mount multiple autopulse, or has missiles to deal with armor
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