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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: [0.97a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v9.0.7)  (Read 1071060 times)

Jason_Lucentio

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #900 on: October 15, 2020, 06:26:46 AM »

I think the general consensus among players who've built astropoli is that they're overpowered because they allow the player to stack huge numbers of defense fleets in a single system. They can also allow the player to stack a large number of low-hazard colonies in a system with a cryosleeper. I included the station population cap settings because enabling them fixes these balance problems in my opinion.
Defense.
Astropoli can be used to bolster the fleets of systems with a lacking number of planets, and once you build all three of them, you essentially have a planet that's four colonies in one, which is basically unconquerable even if the entire sector hates you.

Interesting, I suppose if a player's fleet wasn't strong enough to handle vengeful, expeditions, or invasions then that would be a decent alternative to branching out in multiple sectors, kind of like playing tall in a strat game.

Cryosleeper part just sounds like purposeful exploitation of game mechanics in a cheaty feel way.
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Chairman Suryasari

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #901 on: October 16, 2020, 12:23:31 AM »

Astropoli has a lot of disabled feature to make it more hard to use and maintenance, it's become credit sink for the end game, too bad it's disable by default, i wish it's enable by default some day.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2020, 07:33:43 AM by SukmaZaki »
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Retry

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #902 on: October 16, 2020, 02:56:09 PM »

Cryosleeper part just sounds like purposeful exploitation of game mechanics in a cheaty feel way.
Eh.  Throughout my numerous playthroughs of Starsector, the venn diagram of "systems with a cryosleeper" and "useful systems" has been two completely separate circles.

Next cryosleeper I find, I'm doing exactly that, and I won't feel bad about it in the slightest.

(Assuming the system I find it even has a planet...)
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Chairman Suryasari

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #903 on: October 16, 2020, 07:22:06 PM »

Having Cyrosleeper and more than 4 good planet in a system is soo rare. Sometimes having Cyrosleeper simply not worth the head ache.
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Chairman Suryasari

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #904 on: October 16, 2020, 07:36:59 PM »

Also Cyrosleeper is more of a lore device to explain certain part of the Domain lore before the collapse than actual feature for player colonies  ;)
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Serenitis

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #905 on: October 17, 2020, 02:10:22 AM »

I think the general consensus among players who've built astropoli is that they're overpowered because they allow the player to stack huge numbers of defense fleets in a single system. They can also allow the player to stack a large number of low-hazard colonies in a system with a cryosleeper. I included the station population cap settings because enabling them fixes these balance problems in my opinion.

I don't see why it would be overpowered though.
Unless you also consider having multiple colonisiable planets & moons in a single system to be overpowered. The astropoli are not allowing you to do anything you can't already do in vanilla. (Stack military bases.)
They just make it situationally more convenient.
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boggled

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #906 on: October 17, 2020, 06:03:39 AM »

I think the general consensus among players who've built astropoli is that they're overpowered because they allow the player to stack huge numbers of defense fleets in a single system. They can also allow the player to stack a large number of low-hazard colonies in a system with a cryosleeper. I included the station population cap settings because enabling them fixes these balance problems in my opinion.

I don't see why it would be overpowered though.
Unless you also consider having multiple colonisiable planets & moons in a single system to be overpowered. The astropoli are not allowing you to do anything you can't already do in vanilla. (Stack military bases.)
They just make it situationally more convenient.

I think the overlapping defenses are much stronger when the colonies are right next to each other, rather than spread out across a system. You're right though that this can be done in vanilla by colonizing a planet and it's moon(s).
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Szasz

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #907 on: October 17, 2020, 09:42:24 AM »

Please riddle me this:
One starts a terraforming project on a planet and there are some constructions that provide terraforming points either on-planet or in-system.
Now that market gets autonomy via Nexerelin (or simply conquered).
Will the planet keep its accumulated point and continue terraforming?

Also is it possible to start a project on autonomous colonies? Temporary takeover does not work with it, since terraforming is a player ability.
(Oh ye, this reminds me, pls move it to a Nexerelin like menu with planet chosing options. It feels silly that I have to be personally present commencing said stuff like I'm a glorified intergalactic babysitter.)
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boggled

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #908 on: October 17, 2020, 11:43:47 AM »

Please riddle me this:
One starts a terraforming project on a planet and there are some constructions that provide terraforming points either on-planet or in-system.
Now that market gets autonomy via Nexerelin (or simply conquered).
Will the planet keep its accumulated point and continue terraforming?

Also is it possible to start a project on autonomous colonies? Temporary takeover does not work with it, since terraforming is a player ability.

I haven't tested this personally, but the intended behavior is that autonomous planets can be terraformed normally, but if the player loses control of the planet to another faction then terraforming stops. If you can't target autonomous planets with the terraforming ability, that's unintended and I'll look into fixing it for the next update.

(Oh ye, this reminds me, pls move it to a Nexerelin like menu with planet chosing options. It feels silly that I have to be personally present commencing said stuff like I'm a glorified intergalactic babysitter.)

I considered this, but I think the ability is much better because the tooltip can be used to communicate to players the reasons why they can't terraform a given planet. Not everyone reads the mod guide before installing this mod!

Also, you have to be physically present at your colony to manage AI cores and special items, so there's a precedent for the player needing to be there in-person for certain actions.
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Bendigeidfran

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #909 on: October 17, 2020, 11:49:37 AM »

Hi there, very silly request but can someone tell me how to start a terraforming project? I know there's supposed to be a "Terraforming Control Panel" ability as stated on the OP, but I have no such ability available. Do I have to do something to gain access to it?
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boggled

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #910 on: October 17, 2020, 02:06:59 PM »

Hi there, very silly request but can someone tell me how to start a terraforming project? I know there's supposed to be a "Terraforming Control Panel" ability as stated on the OP, but I have no such ability available. Do I have to do something to gain access to it?

https://i.imgur.com/ulvepTi.gif
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Szasz

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #911 on: October 17, 2020, 02:23:31 PM »

Hi there, very silly request but can someone tell me how to start a terraforming project? I know there's supposed to be a "Terraforming Control Panel" ability as stated on the OP, but I have no such ability available. Do I have to do something to gain access to it?

No, properly installing the mod was all. Works on ongoing save for me.
See if you have access to terraforming "industries" in the building dialog on a colony.
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Szasz

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #912 on: October 17, 2020, 05:46:33 PM »

Please riddle me this:
One starts a terraforming project on a planet and there are some constructions that provide terraforming points either on-planet or in-system.
Now that market gets autonomy via Nexerelin (or simply conquered).
Will the planet keep its accumulated point and continue terraforming?

Also is it possible to start a project on autonomous colonies? Temporary takeover does not work with it, since terraforming is a player ability.

I haven't tested this personally, but the intended behavior is that autonomous planets can be terraformed normally, but if the player loses control of the planet to another faction then terraforming stops. If you can't target autonomous planets with the terraforming ability, that's unintended and I'll look into fixing it for the next update.
Oh yeah, I didn't know that you didn't know. So the ability targets whichever colony I am governing personally or via logistics officer (or whatever they are called) and skips any autonomous colonies in between no matter how close they are. I wonder what is the reason for this as I'm not proficient in Starsector modding and I would assume the terraforming ability deals with faction tags and autonomous colonies can't sneak under it.
Temporary takeover does not work, since it ends with undocking and there is no way I could use a player ability such as terraforming before that (hence the dislike).

(Oh ye, this reminds me, pls move it to a Nexerelin like menu with planet chosing options. It feels silly that I have to be personally present commencing said stuff like I'm a glorified intergalactic babysitter.)

I considered this, but I think the ability is much better because the tooltip can be used to communicate to players the reasons why they can't terraform a given planet. Not everyone reads the mod guide before installing this mod!

Also, you have to be physically present at your colony to manage AI cores and special items, so there's a precedent for the player needing to be there in-person for certain actions.
I'm not sure what you mean, but it's fine. I might still need to discover such scenario where a planet unfit for terraforming is selected by the ability. Did read the guide but wanted to try out terraforming anyway. Even pleasantly surprised by the mod, it feels so right that existing stations in asteroid belts in an ongoing game are converted into this mod's mining stations (or just recognized as such) and the player is unable to build on the top of that.
Can't agree on the latter though. Managing AI cores and nanoforges is different as they are inventory items that need to be physically carried to site on two specific events in most cases, 1. just acquired some and want to take advantage 2. newly built industry needs them. I'm pretty sure you don't keep a deep stock of alpha cores and pristine nanoforges on every and each colony you own. Terraforming structures on the other hand can be built from the other end of the sector already, even on autonomous entities but starting the terraforming project can not be done remotely. Maybe it's just illogical to me because of the UI incoherency.
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fu12

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #913 on: October 21, 2020, 04:43:18 AM »

So exactly how fiddly is placing an Astral gate exactly? Cuz sometimes it gets put down where I am......but most days it gets shunted off into the worst possible position: out beyond the oort cloud of the star and as far as possible away from a jump node. And there doesnt seem to be any rhyme or reason as to which result i actually get.
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boggled

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Re: [0.9.1a] Terraforming and Station Construction (v5.4.6)
« Reply #914 on: October 21, 2020, 06:01:11 AM »

So exactly how fiddly is placing an Astral gate exactly? Cuz sometimes it gets put down where I am......but most days it gets shunted off into the worst possible position: out beyond the oort cloud of the star and as far as possible away from a jump node. And there doesnt seem to be any rhyme or reason as to which result i actually get.

It tries to place the Astral gate at a location near to the player where a stable location could potentially exist. After playing the game for a while, you'll have a feel for where stable locations typically exist and where they don't, so you can choose a spot likely to have a valid spawn location near your fleet. If it spawns somewhere you don't like, then just reload the save.
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