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Author Topic: [0.8.1a] The Nomads, v1.4.11-rc2  (Read 165828 times)
Snrasha
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« Reply #480 on: May 17, 2017, 11:44:28 AM »

Old message, too big.



SEMI UPDATE 0.8a

I have just update a lighter version, so the experience with Nomads Factions is not probably go so good than that.
I have just go of the 10% of the work. But the Readme give the work to done.

I launch a test and i see that:



Lighter Version 1.0 Nomads Factions, contains anything except missions, the starsystem not finish, etc(read the spoiler just below)
You can play anyways with the Nomads without problem or crash(i think), the rest is now between your hands.

You can access to the github on the readme, the master branch is the 0.6a.


Quote
Snrasha update:
Need to be made per community:

Fighter :
- tags
- tier
- rarity
- range
- attackrunrange
- role desc
Faction :
- Troop
- Banner
- custom
- doctrine
- traits
Ship:
- 8/6/5/4%
- Others things link to supply/mo,...
Dialogues:
-Lighter Versions have not dialogue, you need to create that.
StarSystem:(very empty)
-Nebula somewhere?
-Size station?
-More planets owner per Nomads?

Need to be re-made per Snrasha/ Coders:
-Unique Oasis. (Vanilla code : https://github.com/Trylobot/ss-nom)
-Others things?

Need to be changed:
-Delete the white star nur who do not exist on reality.

Urgent:
-Reput the Unique Oasis:
Why?  Because Nomads factions is a faction who have a small station of size 3 for the moment, but not for that.
Nomads mod have a special fleet who go around the world, a big fleet who contains a Oasis than you need to destroy for have a Oasis.
-Only means for obtain big ship, for the moment, this is just scavage. Or just black Market.

The next update will do not be very soon, i need update a other thing, and i wait than you made description, banner, etc, ah ah
WE NEED A NOMADS BANNER


Well, we need a nomads banner '.'.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2017, 09:53:16 AM by Snrasha » Logged

I am pretty bad on english. So, sorry in advance.
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Trylobot
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« Reply #481 on: May 18, 2017, 09:36:21 AM »

Snrasha has a demo version up of a 0.8a-compatible version of The Nomads (untested)

« Last Edit: June 25, 2017, 11:22:32 PM by Trylobot » Logged

joebob1337
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« Reply #482 on: May 20, 2017, 06:42:29 PM »

hallelujah this has to be the best thing since ever Cheesy
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Snrasha
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« Reply #483 on: May 21, 2017, 01:12:23 AM »

hallelujah this has to be the best thing since ever Cheesy

Well, this is the community to finish the mod: Description, banner, etc, not me ^^.
I need just finish the script for unique Oasis and me, i have finish my job.
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« Reply #484 on: May 24, 2017, 08:22:49 PM »

hhnnnnnnnnngggggggg I NEED TO MAKE MY GAME WORK D:
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Takion Kasukedo
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« Reply #485 on: May 25, 2017, 03:36:53 AM »

The Nomads are a tad bit too cheap OP cost wise AND in the market compared to the lot of vanilla/mod ships...

Do what you want with them though.
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« Reply #486 on: May 25, 2017, 06:03:50 AM »

Really true relics, presumably like the old precursors that awaken from slumber in order to explore the old stars that turn anew when humanity stepped in and claimed them as their own.

I do like the classic blaster barrage feel into it, especially from the Sandstorm battleship.

Issues so far: I find the Rattlesnake's collision size a bit small though, it has a tendency to get collide its rear to anything faster than it.
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Snrasha
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« Reply #487 on: May 25, 2017, 09:38:00 AM »

The Nomads are a tad bit too cheap OP cost wise AND in the market compared to the lot of vanilla/mod ships...

Do what you want with them though.
This is because all weapons are already build-in, so you need to retire the price for buy weapon, i think.


Really true relics, presumably like the old precursors that awaken from slumber in order to explore the old stars that turn anew when humanity stepped in and claimed them as their own.






EDIT:
The version advance, I begin to remade the Oasis fleet. But I have nothing for the faction description or the banner.

I do like the classic blaster barrage feel into it, especially from the Sandstorm battleship.

Issues so far: I find the Rattlesnake's collision size a bit small though, it has a tendency to get collide its rear to anything faster than it.

The collision RattleSnake are good for me, but yes, i up to that.



So anyone for donate a description of the faction?
And donate also a banner for this faction. This is a community project, so well :p


Other thing in campaign? Or this is correct? I have not implemented the Oasis fleet for the moment, i go soon, here.


Thank for this feedback, also.

« Last Edit: May 28, 2017, 11:43:11 PM by Snrasha » Logged

I am pretty bad on english. So, sorry in advance.
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PokerChen
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« Reply #488 on: May 30, 2017, 12:10:39 AM »

Hmm. Rather than edit it into the strings of the mod, I figured I should put the faction description here.
> (to go into) nomads,FACTION,"",,, <
"Across the eons, only a small fraction of humanity have ever seriously contemplated trading an anchored life for an eternal journey. Regardless of whether the choice was between a house and the roads, or a planet and the stars, humanity has generally preferred the stability of a sedentary life over one spent wandering through the vastness of Creation. Home was a concept rooted on firm ground, and even the most adventurous of pirates would find tempting the prospect of retirement into some freeport cartel. After all, who would tell their stories if they died ignominiously in some forgotten corner of the sector?

To those bitten with wanderlust, however, hyperspace travel was the ultimate gateway drug. One group of these minorities came to be called the Nomads - simply named due to the sheer age of their distinct civilisation relative to all other nomadic splinters. The Nomads' origin stretches before even the Domain of Man, when according to legend hyperspace was pierced by bright and colorful trails - outpacing the rudimentary droneships exploring the neighborhood of fabled Earth. A fleet of ill-fitted ships departed the cradle of humanity for the unknown expanse, carrying explorers who were driven to see the galaxy for themselves and who could not endure being spoilered by blurred hypercomm images. Neither the destination of this first fleet nor the names of their crew are now knowable, and given the dangers of hyperspace to long-term health unknown to the initial explorers it is also likely that the present civilisation is mostly descended from later participants during the initial Domain epoch. Nevertheless, their indomitable spirit remains within all those who now call the Oasis fleet home.

Based on their current fleet technology, the initial Nomad fleet likely maintained sporadic contact with early Domain settlers, then broke off as the frontiers became increasingly militarized. The inexorable exploitation of both planet and people drove the Nomads away from colonized space, and were it not for the Collapse we may never hear of them again. However, it seems that the Nomads somehow become aware of the calamity - and then became curious of what had befallen humanity as each sector was left to fend for itself. At least, this is what the Oasis fleet claims after it emerged within hyperspace sensors and establishes contact with a shocked independent scavenger fleet. The fleet currently tours this sector, mining resources from unclaimed planets and conducting restricted trade with the major factions while maintaining some distance from population centers. A small outpost has even been established in a minor system, raising the suspicious eyebrows of many Hegemony and Tri-tachyon security officers.

Will they prove to be a painful reminder of ancient history, or a beacon to humanity's future?
"
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Snrasha
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« Reply #489 on: May 30, 2017, 12:54:08 AM »

Thank you, you have be put on my personal credits!


Now, I need just found a banner.

(The specificity of the faction, where you have a big nomads fleet go cross around the world work, but I need finish some things. Like the market who sell the Oasis when he is defeated)
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Takion Kasukedo
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« Reply #490 on: May 30, 2017, 05:30:21 AM »

oh wait no forget what I said I meant Interstellar Fed not Nomads, don't think Nomads are in campaign

I'l have to test it out soon though.
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PokerChen
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« Reply #491 on: May 31, 2017, 02:35:22 PM »

NB: I've git-cloned the current branch for direct modifications in the future when there is time and desire. Can git pull-request directly after testing.

== On the state of Nomad fleet balance and first steps to take them from 0.6.x towards 0.8 standards ==
 I've also had a brief look at each vessel in simulators against Lasher/Enforce/Eagle/Conquests to see how they fare against hegemony standards. Here are some notes in in terms of my proposed changes - looking for a bit of feedback on the first step.

Current status, based on ship design and thread-trawl:
  • Nomad fleets are low-tech and have a low-flux/armor-focus not dissimilar to Hegemony. Their ships emphasize logistic efficiency over combat prowess, hence no/few ballistics or non-rechargeable missile mounts. Their outdated maser systems are very flux inefficient and short-ranged compared to current mainline fleets, but their constant fusion torpedo fire available on destroyers can outlast front-shield adversaries due to heatseeker AI.
  • Lore-wise and mechanics-wise, Nomads tend to be hard-countered by high-tech equivalents (via some combination of being out-fluxed, out-ranged, and out-maneuvered in addition to a lack of Nomad kinetic power). Meaning Paragon->Gila, Medusa->Komodo, Wolf->Wurm.
  • Since almost all mounts are built-ins, combined-arms fleet composition is usually necessary in a big fight. Without specialists that provide long-range pressure and finishing blows, it should be harder for Nomad fleets to win even against standard Hegemony (severely out-teched after all).
  • Given official 0.8 stuff like REDACTED, I'm not sure how to lore-harmonize the fact that all Nomad ships have shields but not useful kinetics, and are generally stuck with masers.

Suggestions to convert to 0.8 standard:
  • If the strategic AI isn't looking at the OP stats to decide fleet power, tentatively suggest converting Nemean flux-shunts to be a built-in, and adjusting OP down accordingly. Alternatively as a lore-fluff (if it is possible), make the Nemean flux-shunt a unique D-mod presenting its age relative to Domain standards, decreasing flux-stats in return for unique hard-flux dissipation. This allows players to make the choice of making an expensive upgrade, yielding alternate Nomad loadout with improved flux but no hard-flux dissipation.
  • Adjust the speed upwards slightly for a number of ships to allow it not to be kited so easily by hegemony...? Or one of the alternatives below.
  • Improve weapon stats slightly to combat mainline power-creep, i.e. mainline updates w.r.t. ammo-free ballistics, increased projectile weapon range. Keep flux management weakness.
  • Update the strikecraft behaviour/stats for more diversity. Most fighters are fighting oddly in the same way, so Scarabs sit around to die immediately to PD, and Fang's missile isn't currently working, it seems. They die without a resulting explosion.
  • Diversify ship systems to have things other than High Energy Focus. Roadrunner seems to have lost its burn-drive?
  • If variants can be applied to built-ins, add a couple of alternative loadouts. Otherwise consider cloning.
  • I wonder where the limited universal mounts went from the old days? Synergy mounts (energy/missiles) might be a useful addition.
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isaacssv552
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« Reply #492 on: May 31, 2017, 02:46:03 PM »

NB: I've git-cloned the current branch for direct modifications in the future when there is time and desire. Can git pull-request directly after testing.

== On the state of Nomad fleet balance and first steps to take them from 0.6.x towards 0.8 standards ==
 I've also had a brief look at each vessel in simulators against Lasher/Enforce/Eagle/Conquests to see how they fare against hegemony standards. Here are some notes in in terms of my proposed changes - looking for a bit of feedback on the first step.

Current status, based on ship design and thread-trawl:
  • Nomad fleets are low-tech and have a low-flux/armor-focus not dissimilar to Hegemony. Their ships emphasize logistic efficiency over combat prowess, hence no/few ballistics or non-rechargeable missile mounts. Their outdated maser systems are very flux inefficient and short-ranged compared to current mainline fleets, but their constant fusion torpedo fire available on destroyers can outlast front-shield adversaries due to heatseeker AI.
  • Lore-wise and mechanics-wise, Nomads tend to be hard-countered by high-tech equivalents (via some combination of being out-fluxed, out-ranged, and out-maneuvered in addition to a lack of Nomad kinetic power). Meaning Paragon->Gila, Medusa->Komodo, Wolf->Wurm.
  • Since almost all mounts are built-ins, combined-arms fleet composition is usually necessary in a big fight. Without specialists that provide long-range pressure and finishing blows, it should be harder for Nomad fleets to win even against standard Hegemony (severely out-teched after all).
  • Given official 0.8 stuff like REDACTED, I'm not sure how to lore-harmonize the fact that all Nomad ships have shields but not useful kinetics, and are generally stuck with masers.

Suggestions to convert to 0.8 standard:
  • If the strategic AI isn't looking at the OP stats to decide fleet power, tentatively suggest converting Nemean flux-shunts to be a built-in, and adjusting OP down accordingly. Alternatively as a lore-fluff (if it is possible), make the Nemean flux-shunt a unique D-mod presenting its age relative to Domain standards, decreasing flux-stats in return for unique hard-flux dissipation. This allows players to make the choice of making an expensive upgrade, yielding alternate Nomad loadout with improved flux but no hard-flux dissipation.
  • Adjust the speed upwards slightly for a number of ships to allow it not to be kited so easily by hegemony...? Or one of the alternatives below.
  • Improve weapon stats slightly to combat mainline power-creep, i.e. mainline updates w.r.t. ammo-free ballistics, increased projectile weapon range. Keep flux management weakness.
  • Update the strikecraft behaviour/stats for more diversity. Most fighters are fighting oddly in the same way, so Scarabs sit around to die immediately to PD, and Fang's missile isn't currently working, it seems. They die without a resulting explosion.
  • Diversify ship systems to have things other than High Energy Focus. Roadrunner seems to have lost its burn-drive?
  • If variants can be applied to built-ins, add a couple of alternative loadouts. Otherwise consider cloning.
  • I wonder where the limited universal mounts went from the old days? Synergy mounts (energy/missiles) might be a useful addition.

I love the idea of worn but irreplaceable flux systems.

Fleet power is determined by fleet points, not OP.
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Snrasha
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« Reply #493 on: June 01, 2017, 05:46:39 AM »

Figther:
-Like I have put on the readme, the range and the attack run range  have put per default and just not made.
For you, what is the max range for each (fang,toad,iguana,scarab) where can reach?
And the attack Run range.   Normally, this is to author to made that, but I have not created their fighter, so I am not probably sure.
Fang, toad and Iguana are fighter, and the scarab is a interceptor(need to fix a tag for him, for the auto fit), need to be changed?

Weapons:
-When I look, I say correct value for me. This thing will probably take many time.
-Bugs: weapon.csv have some problem who do not inflict the game, I will go fix that on the next version

Hull ships:
-There are maybe not better than Hegemony who have high war technology. Maybe just than Nomads have a retard on technology?
-Max Burn: Seems good also.

Variant ships:
-I need to play a campaign, missions more with them, but I think wait the 0.8.1 for that. (I out on the same time, the next Nomads versions, maybe)
-Yes, they have a lack on the variant.

ShipSystem:
-My two others mods have also majority all same ship system,  have a multiple ship system have a cost, Nomads know how build the highenergyfocus and fast ammo rack, but for others?  Else, I do not see what ship system we can put on ship who look very old.

Hullmod:
-I go probably go work on that. For the next version, this is will go just on build-in.
-Put that on a D-hullmod is problematic with industry skill.
-The hullmod seems do not have be updated, sorry, I fix that when I can.

For finish, my feedback of what I think of the mod:
The Nomads faction have a star system, yes (with two stars, this is fixed, now), but this is a weak and semi-hidden faction who have just a Oasis fleet who go around the world. This is not a Interstellar imperium, or others mods where are present on the constellation.

I think we can go discuss about the stats when the 0.8.1 out and the Nomads version also.

And also, we can build skin variant without the hullmod build-in(on the next version) than you say, without problem.
The problem is than you will never go see them except than you go on a bounty mission and see the fleet, you will never fight them! (Except if you play on Nexerelin and want kill the nomads faction)



Edit: Important, yes,i have completely fail the supply deploy of each ships.
Edit2:I out a new version soon.
Edit3:I have  compare value, yes the max burn of Nomads ships are too slow.
Edit4:
-Hum, after many problems with the escort fleet, I report this, but you can found the Oasis around the external world.
-Patrol always active on the nomads star system, for keep spy steal the blueprint of the oasis ship.
-Add some carrier variant(because this is the most easy).


« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 01:21:30 AM by Snrasha » Logged

I am pretty bad on english. So, sorry in advance.
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PokerChen
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« Reply #494 on: June 03, 2017, 02:25:55 AM »

Ok, I'll stick to filling all the lore sections for the time being. Git pull request done for the frigates and some fighters.

> Fighters
The Scarab, being an interceptor, could be faster. The relative performance will need to be tested, but the Neriads from Shadowyards are one of the excellent expensive interceptors worth 8~10 OP (although it is currently too cheap @ 4OP). I think Scarabs can be a much cheaper option that still distinguishes itself from mainline factions by being the fastest and weakest.
Iguanas, I'm not sure about, but Toads are tough. Fangs need their bomb back for them to be evaluated properly.

> Variants
It is more meaningful if each Nomad ship does have a customisable mount (small energy or small kinetic). Is it possible to spawn, e.g., scout fleets from the Oasis fleet? If this is so, then having random variants will be meaningful.

> Ship systems
The main thing I'm thinking of is giving burn drive to the Roadrunner and moving its Damselflies to a fighter-bay. Their original design by Trylobot had a screenshot of ~240 su in combat (with a burn drive?), which is probably too fast, but given its really weak flux stats, I would place Roadrunners as a frigate catcher and pure flanker.

High energy focus seems to be high-tech to me, so it's odd to see most of the Nomads have them.

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