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[agentstaple]

I've noticed this and so have others.

when in a brawler other much faster ships tend to go to attack and then retreat.

this is because the ships have an advantage over the brawler at range (and so attack) but when in range of its guns they are at a disadvantage and retreat, this can go on for hours and there is nothing you can do.

anyway here are some suggestions to fix this problem.

1.make small ships bolder against the brawler, attack (difficult)
2. make small ships less bold against the brawler, retreat (difficult)
3. give the brawler a long range weak sniping weapon (easy)
and the best solution
4. give the brawler a long/med range burst/slow firing fire emp weapon to immobilize targets so it can get close (guns should still work whilst immobilized), it should probably have a small arc on the front (30/50 degrees?) to make up for slow turn speeds, or give the rounds a slight tracking ability (for smaller ships).

4 is probably the easiest and best solution (3 may also work) this makes up for its slow speed and gives it a chance to use its guns properly

[Dreyven]

to 3 and 4
it's your ship, you are free to choose the weapons you think are apropriate...
you can equip salamanders if you want, or longer range ballistic weapons

to the issue with the hound dancing around you...
it's actually how i would want the hound to behave... it's the optimal behaviour for it's shiptype but usually you need 2 hounds to make use of it
you can ofcourse lure it into weapon range if you are smart enough ^^

but i think you should punish "wrong" weapon setups
or... let's just say that some ships counter others (bombers and destroyer)

[agentstaple]

this is whilst using the default setup, I did make a setup which was quite effective though (but you need manuverabillity)

it is at a disadvantage against pretty much every thing though (I imagine it may be useful against larger ships due to its firepower and larger ships being slower)

you think 3 of them in a squad could work well?

[Dreyven]

this is whilst using the default setup, I did make a setup which was quite effective though (but you need manuverabillity)

it is at a disadvantage against pretty much every thing though (I imagine it may be useful against larger ships due to its firepower and larger ships being slower)

And that's why it's the brawler class
it's weapon setup and it's frontal shield makes it an anti destroyer ship...
although it's kinda lacking power for that

you think 3 of them in a squad could work well?

2 of them are already able to annoy the crap out of stuff, 3 should be great...
they are really good at coming from each side and shooting you where you don't have weapons and shields

[Nanostrike]

The Brawler is a sad, sad ship.  And it really bums me out because I wanted it to be sweet.


It's absolutely useless against most Frigates and Fighters because it's incredibly slow, has all hardpoint weapons, and has front-locked shields.  All most Frigates need to do is hit it with Salamanders to cripple it's engines, then fly behind it and shoot it in the back.  It's tremendously slow speed and wide, easy-to-hit shape makes this easy.

And if you try to use it in a "Gunship" role, taking on Destroyers and such head-on like it's Frontal Shields and Hardpoints seem to suggest...it gets DESTROYED.  It simply doesn't have the firepower and armor to stand toe-to-toe with Destroyers.  And it doesn't quite have the speed to out-maneuver them.

So you basically have a ship that's near-useless against Frigates, but still can't hold it's own against larger ships.  It's pretty much a joke right now.


Ideally, I think they should boost it's speed by a lot.  Make it able to at least keep pace with Frigates.  Make it as fast as a Hyperion or something similar.  It should be that ship that can blitz you head-on and get in your face with a lot of firepower.  Make Brawlers feared ships that would have to be dealt with in their own way.

There's no other Frigate that almost exclusively front-locked shields AND firepower.  Give it at least average speed, keep it's maneuverability, and up it's flux-dissipation by a little.  The "High tech" ships have their shining stars, the Tempest and Hyperion.  The "Low Tech" should have the Brawler as theirs.  A ship with powerful frontal firepower and shields, but no rear defenses.

[Reshy]

The Brawler is a sad, sad ship.  And it really bums me out because I wanted it to be sweet.


It's absolutely useless against most Frigates and Fighters because it's incredibly slow, has all hardpoint weapons, and has front-locked shields.  All most Frigates need to do is hit it with Salamanders to cripple it's engines, then fly behind it and shoot it in the back.  It's tremendously slow speed and wide, easy-to-hit shape makes this easy.

And if you try to use it in a "Gunship" role, taking on Destroyers and such head-on like it's Frontal Shields and Hardpoints seem to suggest...it gets DESTROYED.  It simply doesn't have the firepower and armor to stand toe-to-toe with Destroyers.  And it doesn't quite have the speed to out-maneuver them.

So you basically have a ship that's near-useless against Frigates, but still can't hold it's own against larger ships.  It's pretty much a joke right now.


Ideally, I think they should boost it's speed by a lot.  Make it able to at least keep pace with Frigates.  Make it as fast as a Hyperion or something similar.  It should be that ship that can blitz you head-on and get in your face with a lot of firepower.  Make Brawlers feared ships that would have to be dealt with in their own way.

There's no other Frigate that almost exclusively front-locked shields AND firepower.  Give it at least average speed, keep it's maneuverability, and up it's flux-dissipation by a little.  The "High tech" ships have their shining stars, the Tempest and Hyperion.  The "Low Tech" should have the Brawler as theirs.  A ship with powerful frontal firepower and shields, but no rear defenses.

It should have damage REDUCTION on the shields not AMPLIFICATION which is painful.  It takes 1.2 damage to shields.

It's movement speed is 80, despite having weapons that are exclusively close range.  It should be at the very least 140, if not 160.

[agentstaple]

hmm, I think making the side turrets able to spin so that they can cover the sides and some of the rear would help a lot.

also increase the speed a little.

[Nanostrike]

It should have damage REDUCTION on the shields not AMPLIFICATION which is painful.  It takes 1.2 damage to shields.

It's movement speed is 80, despite having weapons that are exclusively close range.  It should be at the very least 140, if not 160.

Yeah.  Hence why I think it's a joke.  Forward-locked, flux-inefficient shields matched with close-ranged weapons and a speed of 80 (Which is slower than quite a few Destroyers!).

Total joke ship.  If I start with one, I immediately sell it for a Lasher or even a Hound.

[agentstaple]

a hound with 2 rail guns is surprisingly good for its size

[factotum]

Yeah.  Hence why I think it's a joke.  Forward-locked, flux-inefficient shields matched with close-ranged weapons and a speed of 80 (Which is slower than quite a few Destroyers!).

I think the Brawler is designed for a style of combat that doesn't really exist in the game--it's really a "drop as much firepower on your enemy and try to take them out in the first pass" sort of ship, with its slow speed just giving it longer on target to do damage. If Starfarer ships weren't just as capable of flying sideways or backwards at full speed the Brawler would be a good design, but as it stands, not so much!

[Nori]

The shield should be changed to 1.0 or 0.8, side guns should be turrets, and armor should be upped by 200. I think that would fix it. The slow speed would and will be fine, but only if it has greater survivability and high maneuverability. Though it could still stand to have a higher speed. Maybe 100... And just checked, the turn rate could stand to be upped a bit and OPs should be increased by 10. Maybe all that together would be too much, but something does need to be done...

[icepick37]

but something does need to be done...

Yeah it really does. It's just barely outside of usability. I've gotten some lucky wins with it though, haha.

[agentstaple]

I think the best solution would too just make the side guns pivot almost all the way around and give it more speed.