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Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Personal Contacts (08/13/20)

Author Topic: Empty star systems  (Read 1705 times)

_Dividebyzero_

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Empty star systems
« on: July 29, 2019, 06:15:24 PM »

I understand that from a realism point of view, not every star system can be full of goodies. There must be systems full of barren planets, and there must be systems with no planets, because real life does not generate systems just so we can explore them.

However, from a gameplay perspective, it's a little disappointing when I fly into a constellation with 2-3 star systems that have zero planets (I am talking about the systems with nothing but the star and a single fringe jump point). I never visit these systems since they have no chance of a habitable world and almost no chance of habitats, mining stations, etc.

I think it would make sense to force star systems to always generate at least 1 planet, so that there aren't systems that one skips outright due to no reward.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2019, 06:16:58 PM by _Dividebyzero_ »
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Arakasi

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2019, 01:21:45 AM »

Eh, I think it's important to have areas with nothing in them to force conflict on the would-be explorer. Sometimes you rely on finding strategic resources while you're out exploring, and finding nothing creates an interesting tension - try fly back with limited resources or keep exploring in the hopes of finding what you need to keep going?
Also it creates a nice contrast, ups and downs during exploring when you actually find a system with a bunch of stuff.

What I don't like, however, are systems with lots of stuff in them, but not much that is actually interesting loot-wise (domain systems I'm looking at you).
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Megas

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2019, 05:56:19 AM »

My least favorite systems are neutron stars.  Pulsar beams are annoying.  I will visit them just to plunder the near-guaranteed high-value target in the system then leave, never to return.  It really hurts if a pirate base spawns repeatedly in such a system, even if their guards get blown away and base is always undefended.  (I still need to E-Burn at least once to cross the pulsars.)

Very close runner-up are huge systems at least as big as Penelope's Star, especially if pirates spawn repeatedly in the system or if it is the best colony system.  Spending two in-game weeks just to go from planet to jump point one-way takes too much time.  If I had a game where the best colony system was huge, I would definitely take Navigation 3 just for Transverse Jump to avoid the one month round trip to dump loot at a colony.

At least empty star systems can be ignored, although they might have something good like a Legion (XIV) wreck that must be searched for.
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Arakasi

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2019, 05:58:42 AM »

My least favorite systems are neutron stars.  Pulsar beams are annoying.  I will visit them just to plunder the near-guaranteed high-value target in the system then leave, never to return.  It really hurts if a pirate base spawns repeatedly in such a system, even if their guards get blown away and base is always undefended.  (I still need to E-Burn at least once to cross the pulsars.)

It took me a while to realise this, so I wonder if you know, it's so much quicker to navigate those systems if you just drive right through the center of the neutron star. But yes - any AI in those sorts of systems is a recipe for disaster.
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Megas

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2019, 07:22:30 AM »

I E-Burn across the star (which is still crossing pulsars, just at their smallest width at the source).  That is still a big drain on supplies and fuel if I have a multi-capital fleet, especially if I need to do it more than once.  If I do not have Transverse Jump, I need to do it twice.  Once to reach pirate base, and once more to go back to jump point.  If I am unlucky enough to have the pulsar irradiate the jump point when I enter the system, I need to E-Burn to escape, for yet another time.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 07:25:06 AM by Megas »
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Arakasi

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2019, 07:30:23 AM »

Really? I just sustained burn across the star, far less costly on supplies. But yeah, spawning inside the beam would certainly suck.
While I do like the idea behind these systems I think they need some work to be more interesting and serve an actual gameplay function.
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Megas

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2019, 07:43:31 AM »

Neutron stars serve the purpose of a gate to a high-value target, usually a research station, but occasionally, high-value derelict instead.

Neutron stars are only a problem if a pirate base constantly respawns in there.

I tried Sustained Burn across the star, but got sucked into a beam and pulled with it, with CR lost and a long way away from my target for my trouble.  I now always E-Burn across the beams now for the least pain.
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Arakasi

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2019, 07:48:43 AM »

Neutron stars serve the purpose of a gate to a high-value target, usually a research station, but occasionally, high-value derelict instead.

In what sense do they gate this content though? At worst you have to wait a little bit while the beam passes where you need to go. NBD.

I tried Sustained Burn across the star, but got sucked into a beam and pulled with it, with CR lost and a long way away from my target for my trouble.  I now always E-Burn across the beams now for the least pain.
Yeah you have to get a run up and bisect the star so that you're not going to drift too much to either side. I don't know if there are bigger neutron stars than the ones I usually encounter, but yeah you'd have to e-burn past big ones.
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Megas

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2019, 08:15:20 AM »

In what sense do they gate this content though? At worst you have to wait a little bit while the beam passes where you need to go. NBD.
Simply put, you cannot move freely in the system like almost everywhere else.  If played carelessly, pulsars will cause a lot of pain.  You touch a moving pulsar beam and your fleet gets hurt badly if it cannot escape quickly enough.  No other hazard is a moving beam with that hurts all ships.  Only other hazards that come close are black holes (immobile) or storms (one ship, speed boost makes storms more beneficial than harmful).

Because of the potential pain, and likely unsuitable worlds to colonize, there is no reason to visit neutron stars unless there is something important, like treasure (yay!) or respawned pirate base (not again! respawn elsewhere!)

The wait can be long if there are many planets to check (for nearby high-value target, not to survey since they all have Irradiated), especially if it is a huge system.  Maybe it is faster for those who have Neutrino Detector and know how to use it.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 08:17:27 AM by Megas »
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outdated

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2019, 08:42:29 AM »

It'd be nice to have something to do in empty system, bu i don't think that having empty systems, and even constellations entirely made up from them is a problem.

As for neutron stars and black holes, there could perhaps be a quest that tasked you with researching them. Perhaps launching an asteroid into a star and scanning the debris.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 08:44:41 AM by outdated »
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Serenitis

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2019, 09:52:05 AM »

The only systems (empty or otherwise) that really bother me are the giant stars, with a single jump point inside the corona so you get a face full of stellar matter as a suprise welcome gift.
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tanith

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Re: Empty star systems
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2019, 01:45:18 PM »

In the same way that a hostile fleet in realspace on the other side of a jump point gives you a horn toot when you're about to drop out of warp on top of them, could we get a warning honk that there's some bad news on the other side, or a visual cue in the hyperspace map about where the CR-annihilation beams are pointed?
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