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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 351466 times)

Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #630 on: May 22, 2019, 11:31:10 AM »

Thank you - made a note, will check this out.
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SCC

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #631 on: May 22, 2019, 01:22:20 PM »

Is, generally speaking, quality of systems (number of planets, quality of those planets, cryosleepers) influenced by distance from the core? One of the more annoying thing about colonies so far is how out of the way good places to colonise tend to be. I'm trading one kind of convenience (being close to everything) for another (no rent) and it's not especially engaging. I tend to get Safety Procedures 3 just so that I can alt-tab out during the journey. I preferred that way of travelling in 0.9 in all the cases, but thankfully trying to avoid hyperspace storms isn't a fool's errand anymore.

Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #632 on: May 22, 2019, 01:44:55 PM »

Is, generally speaking, quality of systems (number of planets, quality of those planets, cryosleepers) influenced by distance from the core?

Could be forgetting something, but I don't believe so.
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Zhentar

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #633 on: May 22, 2019, 06:49:28 PM »

Re: travelling to distant colonies - I think simulation speed in Hyperspace could stand to be increased at least 50% or so; right now we have two speeds: always too slow and usually too slow.

Re: distant colonies in general - last game I made a colony in a far corner of the map. It was... disappointing. It had none of the upsides I had hoped for (Pirates & Pathers don't consider 30+ LY travel to harass your colonies a bother at all), and the severe downside of unpleasant travel times was compounded by very nearly every Bar cargo mission encounter wanting to ship out to your remote colony.
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Zhentar

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #634 on: May 22, 2019, 07:13:12 PM »

I picked up intel from salvaging a ship (in hyperspace near a core world) about a derelict in the Naraka system... I shouldn't have, right? Those derelicts don't persist, do they?
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Shoat

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #635 on: May 22, 2019, 08:57:42 PM »

Is, generally speaking, quality of systems (number of planets, quality of those planets, cryosleepers) influenced by distance from the core?

Could be forgetting something, but I don't believe so.

Well it does seem that "rare things"* are more often than not further away from core systems and they often contain high-quality worlds with good modifiers (or create valuable colonizable systems through means other than direct planet modifiers). Though of course my sample size is just a dozen or so campaigns, so a pattern I notice does not necessarily indicate the sector generation having any specific weights of that nature.



*referring to the uncommon system types (supergiants, nebulae, neutron stars, black holes) and rare finds ([REDACTED], [OTHER REDACTEDs], and systems with non-generic names that are filled to the brim with extensive ruins and abandoned space-stations)
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #636 on: May 22, 2019, 09:07:30 PM »

I picked up intel from salvaging a ship (in hyperspace near a core world) about a derelict in the Naraka system... I shouldn't have, right? Those derelicts don't persist, do they?

In theory it shouldn't do that - that is, that type of intel should not point to things that expire - but maybe there was a permanent derelict in that system for some reason?

Edit: made a note to double-check all temporary derelicts get the "expires" tag which prevents missions from targeting them. Ohh, wait, I was thinking missions for some reason, not the breadcrumb intel. Yep, checked and that was indeed not looking for that tag. Fixed!

Well it does seem that "rare things"* are more often than not further away from core systems and they often contain high-quality worlds with good modifiers (or create valuable colonizable systems through means other than direct planet modifiers). Though of course my sample size is just a dozen or so campaigns, so a pattern I notice does not necessarily indicate the sector generation having any specific weights of that nature.



*referring to the uncommon system types (supergiants, nebulae, neutron stars, black holes) and rare finds ([REDACTED], [OTHER REDACTEDs], and systems with non-generic names that are filled to the brim with extensive ruins and abandoned space-stations)

Some points of interest are indeed more likely to be farther out, but this doesn't apply to planet types etc. Also, something to consider: in any given Sector, more stars are going to be farther from core than not due to area increasing as the square of distance.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2019, 09:10:38 PM by Alex »
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #637 on: May 23, 2019, 05:30:35 AM »

Just noticed that some colony demand, namely Refinery and Fuel Production, is higher than what they used to be, even more than when taking changed Industrial Planning into account.  In 0.9a, Sparse ore and trace volatiles (-1) were enough to meat demand with Industrial Planning.  Now, player with Industrial Planning needs higher-than-moderate (abundant or rich) ores and volatiles (+1) to meet demand.  Even with changed Industrial Planning, I originally expected moderate (0) to be enough, but not anymore.

Curiously, player still only needs poor farmland and trace organics (-1) to meet demand if player has Industrial Planning.

This means mining on a low hazard, five resource planet is insufficient for meeting demand.  (Can be mined for income and organics, though.)

It seems I need at least three planets:
* Gas giant or cryovolcanic with +1 or +2 volatiles.
* Hostile rock or high-gravity habitable with both ores at +1 or more.
* Low hazard habitable with some farmland and organics, and a place to put an expensive industry that is also worth six Pather interest points.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2019, 05:52:07 AM by Megas »
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Zhentar

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #638 on: May 23, 2019, 09:23:27 AM »

Watching a friend stream first Starsector adventures, I've noticed one thing that's a minor annoyance to me being a bit more of a usability issue for someone who doesn't know what's going on - right clicking stars on the map sets autopilot for the actual star. Setting autopilot to go to the inner system jump point instead of the star itself would be a much more useful behavior
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Awe

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #639 on: May 23, 2019, 01:06:22 PM »

Welcoming committee at high alert system with only one jump point. Almost 20 remnant battleships. -_-

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Recklessimpulse

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #640 on: May 23, 2019, 01:38:25 PM »

Agreed that would be a great change.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #641 on: May 23, 2019, 03:51:58 PM »

(Made a note re: where course is set.)
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Baqar79

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #642 on: May 23, 2019, 06:17:36 PM »

Just noticed that some colony demand, namely Refinery and Fuel Production, is higher than what they used to be, even more than when taking changed Industrial Planning into account.  In 0.9a, Sparse ore and trace volatiles (-1) were enough to meat demand with Industrial Planning.  Now, player with Industrial Planning needs higher-than-moderate (abundant or rich) ores and volatiles (+1) to meet demand.  Even with changed Industrial Planning, I originally expected moderate (0) to be enough, but not anymore.

Curiously, player still only needs poor farmland and trace organics (-1) to meet demand if player has Industrial Planning.

This means mining on a low hazard, five resource planet is insufficient for meeting demand.  (Can be mined for income and organics, though.)

It seems I need at least three planets:
* Gas giant or cryovolcanic with +1 or +2 volatiles.
* Hostile rock or high-gravity habitable with both ores at +1 or more.
* Low hazard habitable with some farmland and organics, and a place to put an expensive industry that is also worth six Pather interest points.

I noticed that there was a difference between the base output of Ore and Transplutonic Ore given the same Moderate rarity:
Mining Ore Units = Population
Mining Transplutonic Ore Units = Population-2

But it does seem pretty strange that Refining requires more than you can produce given the same population:
Refinery required Ore Units = Population+2
Refinery required Transplutonic Ore Units = Population

Seems Transplutonic Ore would run into the same problem as well since it's base output is lower given Moderate rarity.

*Goes to Eventide to check out Volatile base mining extraction*
Mining Volatile Units (at base rarity) = Population-2
Fuel Production Units = Population

Hmmm, so to make ends meet it does look like you need Industrial Planning 2 & at least a Gamma core for Fuel and Refining, with Moderate deposits of Volatiles/Ore/Transplutonic Ore
« Last Edit: May 23, 2019, 06:21:03 PM by Baqar79 »
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Awe

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #643 on: May 23, 2019, 06:56:52 PM »

"Finished" another run. Mostly focused on colonies. Imho this part in a good shape. Colonies is useful - profitable, give you good resupply spot and ship building ability later. Also dont requires babysitting if you settle good system(4-5 planets). Cores is fully optional - just 1 skill in industry for 3 administrators is enough - with 5 planets you can build redundant facilities
 on different planets with just 5 size(3 industry slots) and dont pay attention to incoming raids.

Also, about exploration. Game lack of capital sized exploration vessel(or at least non civilian capital cargo ship). Atlas/prometheus cant support 250 scanner strenght while keeping 9 speed, because you must choose between militarised systems+drive field for speed, or militarised systems+high resolution scanners for maximum possible scanning range. 5 proper capitals is just too expensive for this role.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #644 on: May 24, 2019, 05:33:00 AM »

Also, about exploration. Game lack of capital sized exploration vessel(or at least non civilian capital cargo ship). Atlas/prometheus cant support 250 scanner strenght while keeping 9 speed, because you must choose between militarised systems+drive field for speed, or militarised systems+high resolution scanners for maximum possible scanning range. 5 proper capitals is just too expensive for this role.
This is when Navigation 3 and/or tugs becomes useful.  No navigation and four tugs for 20 speed is a big drain on fuel, even during 0.9a.  I am seriously considering Navigation for my character, but that means I am one or two skill points shy of grabbing another skill I equally covet, like Planetary Operations to raise defenses enough to eliminate some babysitting, or more combat perks.  (Of course, if fleets will tac bomb defenses in a later version, that means I would need to babysit anyway to prevent them from inflicting "Pollution" on some of my colonies.)

Hmmm, so to make ends meet it does look like you need Industrial Planning 2 & at least a Gamma core for Fuel and Refining, with Moderate deposits of Volatiles/Ore/Transplutonic Ore
Yes.  That is why the planet needs Abundant or greater now, with Industrial Planning.

I guess for a player who wants to avoid colony skills, he probably wants at least Industry/Colony Management 1 for three administrators.  I personally would like 3/3/3 like lore NPCs, who probably were max level officers in their battlefield glory days, but so far, I am stuck with max Colony Management and Industrial Planning (and Fleet Logistics, the complete no-brainer skill).  Would like max Planetary Operations too, but cannot fit that in, not without sacrificing either Ordnance Expert, Fighter Doctrine, or Navigation.  (Currently, either Navigation or Planetary Operations is on the chopping block.)
« Last Edit: May 24, 2019, 05:47:19 AM by Megas »
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