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Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Painting the Stars (02/07/20); Updated the Forum Rules and Guidelines (02/29/20)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.9.1a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 152687 times)

Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #150 on: February 20, 2019, 08:09:47 PM »

This thread is getting suuuuper off-topic, let's try to keep it to patch notes related stuff.

This is what really gets me.  Min-maxers seem to be dominating every aspect of balance and design in this game, which really shouldn't be happening.  Some things are meant to be better than other things, I mean there's a Buffalo Mk.II for that reason.

(Just had to chime in: as with all things, there is a balance. It's useful to think of min-maxing when you're doing design because that's what the game will naturally drive players to do. That doesn't mean all players will play that way, it just means they'll be incentivized to, and so overall will generally be more likely to. If we want a wider variety of playstyles to occur naturally, ideally they'd all be viable with a mini-maxed approach.

On the flipside, it is a single-player game, so we don't have to be as stringent about it as we would for a multi-player game. There, "viable" means "can compete vs the best". Here, "viable" can just mean "gets the job done and is fun to play". So, there's more leeway to do fun things.)
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TaLaR

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #151 on: February 20, 2019, 08:22:43 PM »

This is what really gets me.  Min-maxers seem to be dominating every aspect of balance and design in this game, which really shouldn't be happening.  Some things are meant to be better than other things, I mean there's a Buffalo Mk.II for that reason.
The Buffalo Mk.II is unironically a really good missile-boat. With EMR it can carry up to 42 harpoons, 24 in the medium slot and 3x6 in the smalls, for 4 DP. It's the most cost-effective MRM platform in the game as long as you can keep it out of the front line.
Not putting Converted Hangar Talons on it feels like loadout design crime. And Med Sabot + 3x Swarmers is much more deadly loadout than Harpoon spam (at least when controlled properly, which AI usually fails at).
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sqrt(-1)

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #152 on: February 20, 2019, 10:57:00 PM »

Its good to see that the colonies have been nerfed a bit. I am surprised however that the rare item drop rate has not been lowered for low player levels.

I have made several runs to level 15 without colonies for testing purposes because I initially thought it was a mod issue.
After leveling to level 5 by attacking some core system pirates and purchasing some combat freighters, I have ended up consistently at level 10-15 with >250k credits and tons of AI cores plus blueprints after my first expedition to one or two constellations where a bounty was posted.

Consistently, it takes less than 60 minutes to be able to build a nearly endgame winning fleet!
Like many others mentioned before, I find the early game struggle, with a small fleet the most enjoyable part of the game by far.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2019, 07:40:42 AM by sqrt(-1) »
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #153 on: February 21, 2019, 06:02:17 AM »

For me, a significant fraction of the "rare" stuff are either duplicate corrupted nanoforges or lots of pirate and pather packs.  I do find some useful rare items, but nowhere near everything I want when I need it.  Pristine nanoforge is a too rare find that I sometimes need to raid Chicomoztoc or Kazeron to get, and much of my endgame activity is raiding markets for missing blueprints.  By the time I get everything I want, my faction has been powerful enough to kill everyone many times over.  It would be nice to get the items before my faction gets that powerful.
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xor0

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #154 on: February 21, 2019, 09:30:33 AM »

I don't think drops need to be more common. I only played 2 full games, and in both of them I got a pristine nanoforge after exploring about a third of the sector. Corrupted ones are everywhere, can be sold for 400k. In one system I found 7 orbital stations, 4 of them in a single cluster. Right now it's just too easy to get overpowered in one exploration/big trade. Things need to be made harder, not easier. Or maybe it's time for difficulty levels, with drop chances one of the prime candidates for varying.
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Shad

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #155 on: February 21, 2019, 09:45:00 AM »

For me, a significant fraction of the "rare" stuff are either duplicate corrupted nanoforges
I did mention this before, but yeah, if you explore the sector (not even riding), you will end up with 30-40 corrupted nanoforges and synchrotron cores, and no real use for them. Selling them is pointless since money is not an issue once your colonies get running.
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Blothorn

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #156 on: February 21, 2019, 10:18:37 AM »

I do think that perhaps nanoforge/synchrotron prices could drop a bit--since they are never available on the market that doesn't make them too accessible, and their value to a colony is already far more than their worth (particularly for nanoforges). Decreasing their price would drive down exploration profits quite a bit, which I think is a good thing.

Similarly, even after the reduction in survey data prices, it is still very profitable for something you are likely to be doing anyway.
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WastedAlmond

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #157 on: February 22, 2019, 03:09:58 AM »

Changes as of January 31, 2019
  • Maximum number of industries limited to a value based on colony size
    • From 1 at size 3 to 4 at size 8 and above

This could actually leave some room for customizing and adding flavor to colonies.

A case where this could be extra nice would be let us to spruce up our "capital worlds". Like settling on an otherwise excellent desert world with only poor farmland, the player could go to the a faction planet and buy (at an exorbitant price) a supporting structure schematic, like advanced hydroponics, which would augment the production of farms. Now this could be used to enhance the strong sides of certain colonies as well, with far less of a positive impact, but further specialization.

Another option would be to steer clear of industry enhancements and have most factions sell some specific support structures, that either slightly mitigate the effects of hazards or otherwise improve or specialize a planet. For example: tritachyon sells habitation shielding (heat), which would drop the hazard rating of a volcanic planet, but cap its population at 4 or 5 due to practical limitations on shielding a larger settlement.

This could also eventually provide long term industry goals, like limited terraforming in the form of solar shades or investing on larger projects.

These are just random ideas as I don't really know your goals for settlements, but maybe you can get some further ideas from this ramble :P

Thanks for all the hard work btw! SC is shaping up nicely. :)
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manictiger

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #158 on: February 22, 2019, 08:20:47 AM »

The addition of custom music to mods is going to be so fun to tinker with.

I wanted to put some hardcore industrial rave music in one of my faction's starbases for a laugh.  I imagine this relaxed feeling you get cruising around space and then you land at the base and it's just the hardest bassline ever.

The lore behind that would be that the entire station is basically a giant night-club littered with gun merchants, drug dealers, mercenaries, veterans and hackers.  If primal savagery could be a starbase, this would be it.
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Serenitis

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #159 on: February 24, 2019, 09:29:18 AM »

I do think that perhaps nanoforge/synchrotron prices could drop a bit--since they are never available on the market that doesn't make them too accessible, and their value to a colony is already far more than their worth (particularly for nanoforges). Decreasing their price would drive down exploration profits quite a bit, which I think is a good thing.
I'd just like to point out that this wouldn't do anything. From all the run-throughs I've had of 0.9, I have never sold a nanoforge or synchrotron and I've not once been short of money.

Making them rarer though would help to stop them from being something that's a must-have once, and then becomes vendor trash.
And by rarer I mean low single figures of each in the entire sector, so it's never a 'given' the player will have them like it is now. (Where you can have over a dozen of each.)
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Shad

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #160 on: February 24, 2019, 09:47:32 AM »

I'd just like to point out that this wouldn't do anything. From all the run-throughs I've had of 0.9, I have never sold a nanoforge or synchrotron and I've not once been short of money.
^This.

The lore implies you have just found something amazing, a priceless piece of technology lost to the sector... and noone needs it. Your personal faction needs one of each, and that's it. Other factions don't care.

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Making them rarer though would help to stop them from being something that's a must-have once, and then becomes vendor trash.
And by rarer I mean low single figures of each in the entire sector, so it's never a 'given' the player will have them like it is now. (Where you can have over a dozen of each.)

There really coupld to be something else to use nanoforges. Turning tem in to factions for permanent monthly relation boosts, or use them in other industries, or a way to boost your ship wih them.

For example, with Sylphon, you can upgrade their ship with an AI core to lower crew requirements. How about somthing like nanoforges being used to upgrade the ships autoforges for say, cheaper fighters/missiles. Or a synchrotron core being used to vastly improve fuel efficiency of a ship?
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #161 on: February 24, 2019, 12:23:52 PM »

The only time I sell nanoforges and synchrotrons is to fuel the infinite money bug with my colony's Commerce industry.  After that gets patched, they will probably sit in storage to rot in the slim chance I need them later.

I would not mind making corrupt nanoforges rarer if that means making better items like pristine nanoforges and elite blueprints more common, which are already too rare.  I can explore and dig up half the sector (with salvaging and tech mining) and not find a pristine nanoforge.

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Making them rarer though would help to stop them from being something that's a must-have once, and then becomes vendor trash.
Too rare just makes them too annoying to find.  You still need or want them whether you find one or not.  Rather have too many than not enough.  Too few, and you simply raid core worlds for it, which is what I did for half the games for pristine nanoforge, due to it being too rare.  I rather find them early when I can make use of them after I build a colony, instead of too late after I effectively won the game.  That is big problem with colony production now, the game is practically over by the time I can build what I want.


For what it is worth, I never sold my survey data thinking that if I did that, whoever I sold it too would pop-up a colony at some class V world I want to colonize later.  For example, find a class V Terran I want to claim and sold the data to Hegemony?  About a month later, new Hegemony colony pops up at that planet.  Or if I claim it first, they send an extermination fleet to sat bomb my colony away.  Seeing that all of the data stack, I doubt they remember the location, and selling data is safe.
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intrinsic_parity

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #162 on: February 25, 2019, 04:38:10 PM »

I found 4 pristine nano-forges exploring in one campaign, so it is definitely very rng
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Histidine

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #163 on: February 27, 2019, 06:17:52 AM »

Are there any plans to bring back the old "social" market conditions (Large Refugee Population, Luddic Majority, Urbanized Polity, Organized Crime, etc.)?
Asking because they don't seem to be used in vanilla any longer, but some mods still have them, and I'm wondering if we should set an official modding guideline "these are deprecated, don't use them".
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9.1a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #164 on: February 27, 2019, 08:57:49 AM »

Are there any plans to bring back the old "social" market conditions (Large Refugee Population, Luddic Majority, Urbanized Polity, Organized Crime, etc.)?
Asking because they don't seem to be used in vanilla any longer, but some mods still have them, and I'm wondering if we should set an official modding guideline "these are deprecated, don't use them".

Nothing I would call *plans*, but it's in the back of my mind, so more than others. I don't see anything wrong in using them for flavor at the moment, though. In fact, I should probably re-enable some of these for the vanilla colonies, hmm. I'll take a look, in any case.
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