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Author Topic: 6th Fleet Building Tournament  (Read 16993 times)

Thaago

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2019, 04:16:01 PM »

I'm mainly annoyed by how often combat carriers overextend for no reason, but dedicated carriers sometimes were caught too close to the enemy as well. This tournament is going to be interesting, what with fighters being strong, but carriers being weak.

Fighters being strong and carriers being weak is imo good design, as it lets combat ships that do catch carriers do real damage. I just wish the carriers didn't make it so easy :D.
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pairedeciseaux

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #16 on: February 04, 2019, 11:16:51 AM »

Watching round 1 was a lot of fun. Have you guys scheduled round 2 yet?
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SCC

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2019, 12:41:26 PM »

9 PM/21:00 UTC on 5th for Prime League, same time and 6th for Underdog League.

From a Faster Time

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #18 on: February 05, 2019, 02:24:05 AM »

9 PM/21:00 UTC on 5th for Prime League, same time and 6th for Underdog League.
I await!
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Astraltor

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #19 on: February 05, 2019, 10:06:51 AM »

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Tartiflette

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #21 on: February 06, 2019, 01:20:20 AM »

Due to technical issues, the Underdog Second Round will be Streamed Today 6 PM UTC on Fantastic Chimney's channel
https://www.twitch.tv/fantasticchimni
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Hrothgar

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2019, 04:19:26 AM »

When will be round 3?
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MajorTheRed

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2019, 12:21:11 PM »

A big thank you to those who participate and prepare this tournament. This is great fun to watch, and I can only guess that it represents a great deal of work from the organization!
It was a great surprise to see the big vanilla fleet go the farthest, I was expecting some uber-mod fleets crush everything and performing very well.

On a sad note, the different battles reflect some common problems with the AI which have been reported elsewhere: ships getting in the line of sight of ennemy and/or friendly ships, carrier wanting to hit enemy at point-blank range...
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SCC

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2019, 12:51:31 PM »

It was a great surprise to see the big vanilla fleet go the farthest, I was expecting some uber-mod fleets crush everything and performing very well.

On a sad note, the different battles reflect some common problems with the AI which have been reported elsewhere: ships getting in the line of sight of ennemy and/or friendly ships, carrier wanting to hit enemy at point-blank range...
You must remember that vanilla content is literally a whole game's worth of content. Mods typically have some weaknesses they have to cover, but base content has no overall weakness.
As for my low-tech getting far this time... It just so happened to be chock full of bombers in a round full of giant, slow targets. And that Buffalos mk 2 are really effective for their price.

Tartiflette

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2019, 09:54:01 AM »

The third round of the Tournament will be streamed TUESDAY February 12th at 9pm UTC for the Prime League (on Nemo's channel: https://www.twitch.tv/nemo_naemo) and WEDNESDAY February 13th for the Underdog League (on Fantastic Chimney's channel: https://www.twitch.tv/fantasticchimni).

Sorry for the late notice, some submissions have been entered really late.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 09:58:14 AM by Tartiflette »
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Shad

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2019, 11:07:53 AM »

I fully expect more items on the bingo card. And more reverse spinning green Clades.
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Tartiflette

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #27 on: February 13, 2019, 01:09:02 AM »

Due to schedule constraints, tonight's Underdog League stream is moved to 6pm UTC on MaverickRaven's channel: https://www.twitch.tv/maverickraven_
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Philder

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2019, 12:26:19 AM »

Why not make the fleet slots a random draw so everyone who wants to join has a chance, not just the same few lucky individuals?

Set a deadline and give everyone 3 or 4 choices for slots that they can submit before that date, putting them into a random draw pool for that slot. After the deadline, just go through the slots and randomly pick someone from that slot's pool.

Part of the problem with carriers is that they tend to be slow and weak. They might not even suicide any more than other ships, they're just less suited to surviving the mistake and more likely to be noticed by players due to the circumstance (players assume they should always be in the backline) and confirmation bias.

Another part of the problem is that there is a lack of player control in the AI Tournament, which isn't an expected scenario in the base game, and the turn resets mess up the approach order of the ships, which in the base game it is assumed that the slow carriers will reach the battle slower and therefor tend to be in the backlines.

AI Tournament is a unique scenario not expected in the base game. Although AI could use some work, a large portion of the problems in the AI Tournament would be solved by compensating for the lack of player control and the messiness of turn resets.
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From a Faster Time

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Re: 6th Fleet Building Tournament
« Reply #29 on: February 14, 2019, 12:48:50 AM »

Why not make the fleet slots a random draw so everyone who wants to join has a chance, not just the same few lucky individuals?
Certainly more unique approaches/compositions that tackel the same problem differently is interesting.
Part of the problem with carriers is that they tend to be slow and weak. They might not even suicide any more than other ships, they're just less suited to surviving the mistake and more likely to be noticed by players due to the circumstance (players assume they should always be in the backline) and confirmation bias.

Another part of the problem is that there is a lack of player control in the AI Tournament, which isn't an expected scenario in the base game, and the turn resets mess up the approach order of the ships, which in the base game it is assumed that the slow carriers will reach the battle slower and therefor tend to be in the backlines.

AI Tournament is a unique scenario not expected in the base game. Although AI could use some work, a large portion of the problems in the AI Tournament would be solved by compensating for the lack of player control and the messiness of turn resets.
While you are correct that the tournament setting brings it out more and the base game "masks it" better by arranging the fleet in a smarter way, this is however still a downside of the AI as prearanging fleets into a smarter position, rather than AI knowing what a smarter position is, is a "hack".
Ideally AI with fighters know to hide behind allied forces and support them from the back. If the game had even as something as "choose AI for this ship, will it be a battleship or a carrier" so you could always either add or remove fighters from any ship, but still have them be in the correct formation based on what the player thinks is best. For instance putting condors always in the back by selecting carrier AI, or not messing up a capital ship by giving it 1 fighter wing and making the AI be too defensive because of it.
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