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Author Topic: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"  (Read 12437 times)

RawCode

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"Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« on: January 10, 2019, 07:03:42 AM »

Well, typical situation, player depart into fringe world by taking "quests" for systems in same direction (or ever in same system).

Before departure, player managed to waste 6 skill points on looting, got 4 salvage gantries and 10k of free cargo capacity, in order to "feed" swarm of cargo ships, he got multiple tankers and 2k of supplies.

Player is not big fan of useless time wasting related to hyperspace storms, and just got spare supplies instead.

System after system, just trash, some common metals, some useless common weapons, deathball of pirates dropped like 400 supplies (with +100% bonus to loot) then sudden planet survey provided 1500 of transplutonics, but rest of cargo is just trash.

Entire exploration mission, that burned 2k of supplies and 10k of fuel, provided just 300k of loot money, that barely cover costs related to additional ships required to carry loot around.

Conclusion:
Getting small and fast fleet for quests is MUCH MORE profitable then looting everything, and come with no penalties to rare loot.
Also faster fleet allows to move around faster and increase amount of rare loot you can find.

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Sendrien

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2019, 07:20:28 AM »

I totally agree with your conclusion here. I do believe that the salvaging playstyle should be more viable.

That said, here's how I'm fixing this situation currently.

1. All my fleets always travel at Burn 20. I always use Militarized Subsystems and Augmented Drive field on Prometheus and Atlas. I keep everything at Burn 9, and which gets boosted to 10 with my Navigation skill.
2. I try to use Solar Shielding wherever possible.
3. There are two skills which reduce supply and fuel consumption by 25% respectively. I always take those.
4. To make sure my missions are profitable, I will always take exploration missions in the same vicinity of the map I'm headed towards. If I can line up 3-6 missions in the same quadrant of the map, I can complete them all, while still having time to salvage.
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Megas

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2019, 07:49:48 AM »

For missions, it is best to bring the minimum and keep burn at 20.  The main reason to explore aside from missions (for easy money or rep building) is to 1) Find rare items like blueprints and nanoforges and 2) Good planets to colonize, whether temporary tech mines or permanent settlement with low hazard and lots of resources.

The Salvaging skill is good either for preliminary survey or extra rare loot, which is not enough to burn three points for it.  I would say the better rare loot skill is Planetary Operations so that you need fewer marines to effectively raid for valuables (and blueprints at the markets with Heavy Industry).
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RawCode

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2019, 06:25:11 PM »

without taking 2-3 missions in same area, going for salvage is not profitable.

attacking derelicts due to scaling of said derelicts, profitable only if you attack them yourself without AI support, but this become quite boring really fast.
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Thaago

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2019, 07:53:28 PM »

Could you define salvage expeditions? Is salvage different from exploration? My experience doesn't match yours.

I go out all the time with an exploration fleet and come back stuffed to the gills with survey data, rare metals, machinery, volatiles, blueprints, synch cores + corrupt nanoforges... heck I have to discard 1/2 the loot I find because I run out of cargo space. Easily a few hundred thousands in value from a successful run, not even counting any missions along the way.

This is with no skills and usually no salvage rigs, only a few Shepherds which help with both salvaging and surveys.
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ChaseBears

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2019, 11:29:30 PM »

it would be an expedition trying to profit from salvaging as a playstyle, as opposed to rares looting (blueprints, synch cores, etc.) which any fleet loots about equally.
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RawCode

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2019, 02:43:49 AM »

flying around without taking quests is not profitable, if you take in account ~100k for scanning derelict that do not need anything at all, not profitable at all.
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DatonKallandor

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2019, 02:46:51 AM »

There's a difference between not profitable and less profitable and you seem to be confusing them. Of course not taking a mission pays less - but it doesn't pay nothing.
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RawCode

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2019, 04:10:51 AM »

it "a lot less profitable" and unlikely to provide income required to expand your fleet or fuel your colonies, flying hours just to replenish supplies is not "profitable"
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Recklessimpulse

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2019, 04:19:41 AM »

I've always found it to be profitable, it the small things like weapons, blueprints,forges and planet survey data (as long as you got that to 5 supplies per use) that make your money.
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Tempest

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2019, 08:24:04 AM »

I'm actually doing a salvaging playthrough right now, and my mileage varies quite a bit.

I'm not allowed to buy or restore ships, and all three salvage skills are mandatory (Recovery Operations, Field Repairs, Salvaging). With that in mind, the real prize are the ships that I manage to salvage. Recovered drone tenders provide the Salvage Gantry and Surveying Equipment as well as cargo space.

Expecting 10k worth of expensive loot is not very sensible for the premise of a scavenger. Metals and even transplutonics is all trash that you can get in the core worlds, there's no reason to travel all the way to the sector's edge to get them. My goal in such expeditions is to loot mining stations and orbital habitats, and hopefully salvage some rare derelict or two. That expectation/reality works rather well here.

I just salvaged a pristine Heron from some random battle between hostile factions, btw. Now I'll be able to acquire ships at a much better pace.
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RawCode

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2019, 08:41:50 AM »

rare loot is "special", you can get equal amount of rare loot by visiting research or mining station by lone wolf, compared to fleet with 10 salvage gantries.

as bonuses for "normal" salvage do not apply to rare loot.
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Thaago

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2019, 10:27:04 AM »

flying around without taking quests is not profitable, if you take in account ~100k for scanning derelict that do not need anything at all, not profitable at all.

I don't know what you mean. I go out, I get valuable loot and explore the sector, I come back and cash in for a couple hundred K.

rare loot is "special", you can get equal amount of rare loot by visiting research or mining station by lone wolf, compared to fleet with 10 salvage gantries.

as bonuses for "normal" salvage do not apply to rare loot.

So what exactly do you mean by a "salvage expedition"? Just because we always get rare loot doesn't mean we.... don't get it? Like you can sell it for large profits if you want.
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Goumindong

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2019, 11:58:22 AM »

So... the reason your expedition wasnt profitable was simple

You left wih a full cargo hull.

How could you possibly expect to make money if you left with the thing you expected to make you money (free cargo space) already consumed?

A colossus with efficiency upgrades and expanded cargo holds has 1170 cargo, 7.2 supplies per month, and 2.4 fuel per l/y. A phaeton has 780 fuel, 3.4 supplies, and 1.6 consumption. So if you habe 8 of each you have around those values while consuming 32 fuel/l/y and 86 supplies/month.

So you spent 20 months of supplies(plus whatever you found out there, minus whatrver combat you broight) and 312 l/y of fuel in order to fly through hyperspace storms without solar shielding or mitigation.

Well duh you didnt make any money
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CopperCoyote

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Re: "Salvage" expeditions are not ever close to "profitable"
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2019, 05:44:42 PM »

Metals and even transplutonics is all trash that you can get in the core worlds, there's no reason to travel all the way to the sector's edge to get them.

I like to hold on to transplutonics and 10X the amount of metals so i can sprinkle comms throughout the sector. It allows me to see if there are any missions to be had near where i'm exploring.

Any metals much beyond 10X what i have of transplutonics is left to float however
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