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Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Painting the Stars (02/07/20); Updated the Forum Rules and Guidelines (02/29/20)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.9a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 261679 times)

The Soldier

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #330 on: October 20, 2018, 08:07:35 PM »

Let's just say that it was *that* overpowered to begin with. There are still aspects where it's not much worse than before - for example, the Decoy Flares are qualitative, and having two vs three fighters launching then isn't a huge deal - but yeah, it's offensive potential needed to go down. Basically, it can do HE damage, and due to being a fighter, it can avoid the shields on many ships. This makes it very universal, so balance-wise, it's better for it to be slightly under-powered (since we see just less use of Warthogs) vs slightly overpowered (because then we see less use of *everything else*).

That said, I'll keep an eye on it. Might end up adjusting its role entirely.

Suppose it was.  But I don't think it deserved such a huge nerf - either removing one of the fighters from the wing or removing one of the Light Mortars might be better, both result in an equal reduction in firepower.  But both is too much IMO.

(The "salvage expedition" starts you off with one! Of course, its weapon loadout is lacking, to put it mildly.)
Looking forward to that! :) Exploration has been the best part of this game to me since that update came out - I get to see the whacky, interesting, and sublimely beautiful systems the generator pushes out.  And regardless of what weapons it starts with, so long it keeps it's Large Energy Mount, I can feel fairly safe in it with a few escorts.  Black Markets always have interesting things to sell that might work well in that slot...
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #331 on: October 20, 2018, 08:22:22 PM »

Suppose it was.  But I don't think it deserved such a huge nerf - either removing one of the fighters from the wing or removing one of the Light Mortars might be better, both result in an equal reduction in firepower.  But both is too much IMO.

I mean, it's entirely possible I over-nerfed it. It was an incremental process, though - first I removed a fighter, *then* one of the guns, and *then* reduced the sustained firepower through flux - since at each step it still felt too strong.

Looking forward to that! :) Exploration has been the best part of this game to me since that update came out - I get to see the whacky, interesting, and sublimely beautiful systems the generator pushes out.  And regardless of what weapons it starts with, so long it keeps it's Large Energy Mount, I can feel fairly safe in it with a few escorts.  Black Markets always have interesting things to sell that might work well in that slot...

Thank you! I don't generally see a lot of feedback on the procgen, so this was really cool to read.

(I had a good bit of fun with the Apogee on a test playthrough - picking up new weapons to equip it with was a gradual process, since it's got such relatively diverse slots with lots of opportunities for upgrades. Still not entirely sold on the medium turrets - if they don't face front, then you're probably not going to put anything other than PD or smalls in them, but, well, that's not the worst thing. Let's see how it shakes out.)
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TaLaR

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #332 on: October 20, 2018, 09:01:16 PM »

High Energy Focus for Tempest seems to give it disproportionately superior firepower compared to all other frigates. Doesn't feel quite right for it to boast more firepower than the Hyperion, which is looking increasingly gimmicky in comparison.

Hyperion (when correctly piloted by player) bypasses any shields, Tempest doesn't. Can't beat that efficiency wise (unless enemy is unshielded Hound or something alike, then it's easy pickings anyway).
Though I guess it does make Tempest better vs frigates, since aligning jump shot vs fast targets is quite hard.

Plus, Afflictor is the true king of frigate firepower (and will stay there even after losing QD, I think). But Hyperion is way safer to use, so it has it's merits.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2018, 09:05:12 PM by TaLaR »
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #333 on: October 20, 2018, 09:05:04 PM »

When a colony goes decivilized does the colony outright cease to exist and become essentially a uninhabited world with that modifier?

Yep. You can loot the ruins, too.

High Energy Focus for Tempest seems to give it disproportionately superior firepower compared to all other frigates. Doesn't feel quite right for it to boast more firepower than the Hyperion, which is looking increasingly gimmicky in comparison.

I mean, the Hyperion is all about the teleporter, really. Tempest feels like it ought to have the firepower to live up to its name, you know?

I'm not sure about using flux-locking as a balancing mechanism for fighters. It feels inconsistent because 1. not all fighters can be flux-locked and 2. shielded fighters don't generate flux with weapons. It feels like fighters not generating weapon flux should be baseline behaviour.

It's a behind the scenes mechanic, so I feel fine with it. If fighter flux stats were player-facing, then I'd share your sentiment.
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Snrasha

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #334 on: October 20, 2018, 09:50:52 PM »

Quote
Removed in-combat effect on ship speed
I loved this gameplay ;'(
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craftomega

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #335 on: October 20, 2018, 10:11:47 PM »

I don't even know how many years I have been coming on and off. But I am looking forward to the next update "Soon".
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #336 on: October 20, 2018, 10:31:10 PM »

Quote
Removed in-combat effect on ship speed
I loved this gameplay ;'(

Ah, sorry! Didn't feel right leaving it in with the campaign-level nebula change. If you really want it back, though, you can mod it in via a simple settings.json change.

I don't even know how many years I have been coming on and off. But I am looking forward to the next update "Soon".

:)
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Embolism

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #337 on: October 20, 2018, 11:55:15 PM »

The Tempest has a bit too much. The Wolf is also technically an "attack" Frigate with a mobility system and a forward profile, and yes it's meant to be the Shrike to the Tempest's Medusa but now the Tempest can achieve almost 4x its firepower while having superior defences and base speed.

For that much firepower it should be specialised like the Sunder is, as it is the Tempest is pretty much jack of all, master of all. The Hyperion sacrifices a boatload of staying power, the Scarab can't mount mediums, the Tempest... can supercharge its firepower and have turbocharged PD and has superior flux stats and is tied for the highest top speed.

If it's meant to be this superadvanced and rare prototype then sure, except that's what the Hyperion and Scarab are; the Tempest is more like a general-purpose Wolf step-up.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2018, 11:56:54 PM by Embolism »
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TaLaR

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #338 on: October 21, 2018, 12:41:51 AM »

Player piloted Hyperion can solo a Paragon (sim, both skill-less), Tempest even after all it's buffs won't come anywhere close.

If anyone threatens Hyperion's niche that would be Afflictor. But otherwise Hyperion is fine, it's just not AI-pilotable.
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HELMUT

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #339 on: October 21, 2018, 01:30:51 AM »

The Tempest has a bit too much.

On the other hand, the Tempest now cost as much as a Hammerhead to deploy. Moreover, while its overall firepower increased, it probably won't be as flexible as before. Ion Pulser Terminator drone was pretty crazy, even more so when there was several of them freely roaming the battlefield. It's still going to be one of the strongest frigate, probably the strongest to use for the AI, but not as obscene as now.

Do only my PD weapons gain a 50% damage bonus to missiles?  Or can some of my other weapons, if they somehow manage to hit a missile by some big fluke, also gain that damage bonus?  (For example: Does my Storm Needler benefit from the damage bonus so I can turn it into an improvised sabot killer?)

By "all PD weapons" for the 3rd and 4th changes, are we including the PD weapons that were converted to PD as a result of change #1?  (For example: Will my Tactical Laser also ignore decoy flares, just like my PD laser?

All weapons get the vs-missile bonus, so it'll include the storm needler. All PD weapons get the "ignores decoy flares" bonus, which does indeed include weapons granted PD status by the hullmod.

IPDAI Tac laser with the buffed Advanced Turret Gyros Is going to be reaaaaally strong now. Also, with the IPDAI Damage buff against missiles, i can already see myself doing big side swipes with a tachyon lance to delete an entire wave of missiles.
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SCC

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #340 on: October 21, 2018, 03:32:05 AM »

Quote
  • Prometheus: Reduced fuel capacity to 2500
  • High Resolution Sensors: Can now be learned and installed on other ships.
I don't really get the reason behind these changes. Prometheus was good as it was, with same fuel cap/maintenance ratio as all other tankers. HRS was a pretty great reason to find and get Apogee or Omen.
Quote
Plasma Cannon: Damage reduced to 500 and and flux/shot reduced to 550
When we said that heavy blaster is practically a medium-sized heavy weapon, we didn't mean that plasma cannon should be just a better heavy blaster... It is better, but also boring now, you can't one-salvo frigates anymore.
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Solar Shielding: reduced cost, beam damage effect changed to reduce energy damage by 20% instead
I'm going to fight REDACTED (or Sindrian Diktat): the hullmod. Cool. I think I might mount it from time to time now.
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Militarized Subsystems:
  • Removes Civilian-grade Hull's penalties
  • Adds +1 burn
  • Increased crew requirements
  • -50% supplies to deploy
  • Can only install on ships with Civilian-grade Hull
I'm not sure about this one. It feels like it makes the civilian ship penalty too insignificant, though maybe it requires a lot of OP. I'll have to see, but I don't think I'll like it, though it doesn't mean I won't use it.

Assorted:
Defective Manufactory seems to be a bit too harsh, doesn't low speed also affect survivability for fighters, since more ordnance can hit them? Kopesh is nerfed a bit, maybe Piranha (especially with fighters coordinating strikes) will become competitive to it. Light mortars getting 100 bonus range means mostly that recovered ships can be effective for cheaper. Is there any advantageous for big fleets terrain remaining? It seems like it's all better for small fleets.
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Embercloud

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #341 on: October 21, 2018, 04:46:05 AM »

High Energy Focus for Tempest seems to give it disproportionately superior firepower compared to all other frigates. Doesn't feel quite right for it to boast more firepower than the Hyperion, which is looking increasingly gimmicky in comparison.

I'm not sure about using flux-locking as a balancing mechanism for fighters. It feels inconsistent because 1. not all fighters can be flux-locked and 2. shielded fighters don't generate flux with weapons. It feels like fighters not generating weapon flux should be baseline behaviour.

High energy focus + phase lance = disco king
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Embolism

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #342 on: October 21, 2018, 05:45:39 AM »

Player piloted Hyperion can solo a Paragon (sim, both skill-less), Tempest even after all it's buffs won't come anywhere close.

If anyone threatens Hyperion's niche that would be Afflictor. But otherwise Hyperion is fine, it's just not AI-pilotable.

That's what I mean though: ships like Hyperion and Scarab need player hands to be most effective. Now you'd be much more worried about AI Tempests whereas AI Hyperions/Scarabs are more "Oooh for me? You should've have".

The "feel" is all wrong. Not necessarily balance, just... the Tempest's current armament feels like it belongs on a slow heavy frigate, not a speedy attack frigate. If you described a heavy weapons platform protected against smaller threats by state-of-the-art PD drones I would've imaged a lumbering beast, not one of the fastest ships in the Sector.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2018, 05:53:31 AM by Embolism »
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #343 on: October 21, 2018, 05:48:23 AM »

Yeah, I probably would skimp on Apogee's medium energy mounts if they cannot aim forward, although I probably skimp on them today already if I relied on plasma cannon.  Between Active Flares and tough 360 shield, it does not need weapons for anti-missile.

Does anyone think Ammo Feeder is overpowered on Lasher?  No?  Then High Energy Focus should not be overpowered on Tempest, especially since 1) it got more expensive to use (as much as killer phase frigate that can abuse decloak invulnerability frames like in a fighting game) and 2) it is stuck with inferior and inefficient energy weaponry.  Up until now, Tempest best strength is confusing the AI with its drone, otherwise, it is a variant Wolf that has omni shield but cannot skim.  If the drones cannot roam anymore, then Tempest might not be able to confuse the AI as well.

Plasma cannon, looks like it would be a more efficient, rapid-fire heavy blaster, sort of like a rapid-fire rocket launcher in a FPS.  Probably still no match for Mjolnir, but perhaps Plasma Cannon will be practical to use, unlike today.

Autopulse getting 30 charges by default will be like with free Expanded Magazines today.  Then again, the only ship that will be able to abuse multiple lasers is Paragon, since Odyssey will only focus-fire two instead of three, and Apogee cannot concentrate as many guns forward.
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Embolism

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #344 on: October 21, 2018, 05:59:00 AM »

The Lasher also sports small weapons only, has inferior flux stats, is slower and isn't defended by super PD drones. I emphasised "and, and, and" for a reason: it's the whole package of firepower, defence and speed with no real weaknesses that I take issue.

I'm well aware the Hyperion (and Scarab) remain superior in player hands, but the vast majority of the time you'd be fighting against these things (i.e. AI control), and with this change I think the feel and threat of fighting fleet Tempests and fighting the rare prototype frigate is all wrong.

Again if you described a frigate with heavy weaponry and defended against smaller threats by super PD drones I would've imagined something like the Brawler (which by the way should totally have AAF back: I have no issues with that because the Brawler has clear tradoffs, whereas the new Tempest does not).
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