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Author Topic: Starsector 0.9a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 305083 times)

Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #195 on: September 01, 2018, 05:06:06 PM »

So how does the Micro Burn system work?  Can the ship (Odyssey) move anywhere like jets, or does it move the Odyssey forward only like Burn Drive?

With the new burn, it looks like Odyssey can jump on a smaller ship and kill it before its friends can surround and cut-off the Odyssey's escape.  Not very useful for backpedaling (if Micro Burn can only move forward) while sniping capitals with lances, though.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #196 on: September 01, 2018, 10:28:42 PM »

tell me cuando cuando cuando ???

Soon(tm) :)


So how does the Micro Burn system work?  Can the ship (Odyssey) move anywhere like jets, or does it move the Odyssey forward only like Burn Drive?

It's forward acceleration only, though the ship can still turn, so it's sort of like a very brief burn drive that still lets you maneuver a bit. There are also other changes to go with it.
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Embolism

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #197 on: September 02, 2018, 02:43:48 AM »

I get that it works differently but there seems to be more one-off mobility systems by the patch (though I guess Plasma Jets is also used on the TT Brawler). Couldn't Odyssey be worked around to use Plasma Jets instead?
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MesoTroniK

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #198 on: September 02, 2018, 02:53:14 AM »

I get that it works differently but there seems to be more one-off mobility systems by the patch (though I guess Plasma Jets is also used on the TT Brawler). Couldn't Odyssey be worked around to use Plasma Jets instead?

Plasma Jets on a capital ship is hideously overpowered.

Cycerin

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #199 on: September 02, 2018, 02:55:35 AM »

As long as it can't be used to reverse, it's fine. The movement is a bit too sudden for the ship's mass IMO, but it's a good take on burst jets-type systems. Although honestly I'd rather see it on a smaller ship than the Odyssey, like, if you were to make a destroyer-sized ship with the odyssey's mid-high tech level and slap it on that, that would be rad.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #200 on: September 02, 2018, 06:06:45 AM »

Currently, Odyssey has problems because it cannot duel any other capital in a fair fight (even other battlecruisers like Conquest, though that is almost a battleship now), and it has trouble killing smaller ships with short-ranged weapons without getting surrounded by other ships, thanks to AI's tendency to encircle and trap ships.  It cannot use fighters as well as Legion due to having less bays and it needs those fighters for support instead of seek-and-destroy.

With Micro Burn, Odyssey might be able to quickly catch isolated and backpedaling small ships and blast them before its friends can entrap the Odyssey.  Also, Micro Burn might let Odyssey fly past Onslaught (before killing it from behind) without getting clobbered too badly.

Currently, the only way Odyssey can compete somewhat with other capitals is to constantly backpedal and snipe with triple lances with support from Longbows or Longbow and Dagger.

Plasma Jets would probably be excessive on Odyssey, allowing it to be relatively untouchable while it snipes with lances.  It is already kind of untouchable, but it is flimsy enough that it has no choice but to do this or die against things that other capitals can withstand.

All Odyssey might need now is a bit more OP.
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #201 on: September 02, 2018, 09:22:30 AM »

I get that it works differently but there seems to be more one-off mobility systems by the patch (though I guess Plasma Jets is also used on the TT Brawler). Couldn't Odyssey be worked around to use Plasma Jets instead?

I'm not sure why more ship systems would be a bad thing, hmm. One could probably make a "more things to learn" argument but they're more on the content side of things than being new mechanics.

Plus, I think more systems that make it easier to close in but don't nearly make it as much easier to get out are good for combat gameplay in general.


Although honestly I'd rather see it on a smaller ship than the Odyssey, like, if you were to make a destroyer-sized ship with the odyssey's mid-high tech level and slap it on that, that would be rad.

Funny, I was just thinking about that yesterday, what a high-tech destroyer using that as a system would look like. Great minds? :)

(I also tried it out on the Tempest, just to see how it feels, and it was very underwhelming. Unsurprisingly, perhaps, it really drops off in usefulness on fast ships.)

Renamed the system to "Plasma Burn", btw.


Currently, the only way Odyssey can compete somewhat with other capitals is to constantly backpedal and snipe with triple lances with support from Longbows or Longbow and Dagger.

One of the other changes was removing the 3-large-turret overlap; hopefully it'll be more battlecruiser-y now, or at least it'll have to sink-or-swim based on its merits as that.
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Dri

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #202 on: September 02, 2018, 10:06:57 AM »

Oh wow, so now it can't bring more than 1 large turret to bare on a target that isn't huge? You giveth and you taketh...
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #203 on: September 02, 2018, 10:12:32 AM »

No no, the two turrets on the left side have their original arcs. The turret on the right now has a smaller arc so the triple-overlap in front is gone.
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Grievous69

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #204 on: September 02, 2018, 10:13:40 AM »

I know it's a dead meme at this point but, excuse me what the ***? The overlap is what made it special, now it's basically an oversized Aurora. I'm not saying it won't be fun to pilot but why bother getting a capital which costs so much when its firepower is even worse than before. And before it was still poo poo for a capital. Everyone agrees the ship is really OP starved and now most people will leave that right turret empty because it has no use. Broadside ships don't work in Starsector. Look how the Conquest is usually built. All assault on one side and pd and anti frigate on the other. Please don't make my favourite ship in the game an unviable abomination.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #205 on: September 02, 2018, 10:15:52 AM »

It seems Odyssey will be reduced to brawler as before, but with weakened 0.8.2 era defenses (and no extra OP to use the second bay it desperately needs), it probably would get crushed like a grape.

I can see removing the turret overlap to kill lance sniper, but with no other changes beside Plasma Burn over HEF, it is probably dead on arrival against capitals not named Onslaught or itself.  I guess Odyssey will be reduced to hunter-killer against small ships, which Legion does well enough with fighters alone.

@ Grievous69:  Actually, AI can use Conquest decently.  Because AI Onslaught is built suboptimally, AI Conquest is a match for it.  As for the Odyssey stuff, I feel your pain.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 10:21:33 AM by Megas »
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #206 on: September 02, 2018, 10:18:51 AM »

Broadside ships don't work in Starsector. Look how the Conquest is usually built. All assault on one side and pd and anti frigate on the other.

You literally just described how they work :) I mean, they're not an ideal fit for every ship and so on, so no major argument, but they *do* work. And the turret overlap was more of an implementation hiccup; I don't remember at this point if it was intentional or not, but it was certainly not meant as a primary feature of the hull. If it was meant to focus frontal firepower, it wouldn't be laid out the way it is.

Like I said, there are other changes as well, so I'm not sure anything much re: balance makes much sense to talk about without accounting for those.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 10:21:08 AM by Alex »
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Grievous69

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #207 on: September 02, 2018, 10:22:40 AM »

Oh my bad then, I didn't realise there'll be even more changes.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #208 on: September 02, 2018, 10:27:23 AM »

You literally just described how they work :) I mean, they're not an ideal fit for every ship and so on, so no major argument, but they *do* work. And the turret overlap was more of an implementation hiccup; I don't remember at this point if it was intentional or not, but it was certainly not meant as a primary feature of the hull. If it was meant to focus frontal firepower, it wouldn't be laid out the way it is.
Do you know what is funny?  Even the AI knew how to use triple lance sniper against a lone AI ship.  It would kite and perfectly line up with all three turrets and blast the enemy will all three lances perfectly.  It would even adjust its course to maintain the three turret overlap.
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SafariJohn

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #209 on: September 02, 2018, 10:29:53 AM »

leave that right turret empty because it has no use.

I'm not really disagreeing with you, but did you know the Guardian (Paladin in 0.9) PD can fire over other ships? I don't usually use Odysseys, but that seems like it could be worth the OP.
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