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Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Updated the Forum Rules and Guidelines (02/29/20); Blog post: GIF Roundup (04/11/20)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.9a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 278775 times)

Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #90 on: June 05, 2018, 03:29:25 PM »

Since you let us go over the officers cap ( while we still cant use them until we send them into the void ( ... the science is leaking out )

Give us the ability to store officers ( eg. when we have our own outpost )
could be done ( spontaneous idea )
-a building ( cryochamber or something ) also possible with some upgrades to increase capacity ( and a monthly fee depending on the level of the building )
-just send them to have some free time ( but also at a cost .. you have to pay for their free time ) and therefore also available without another building but again only with our own outpost.

so this is not a no-brainer and the slots are reserved for the best of the best.

Hmm, this seems like a nice-to-have, really. Not particularly opposed to it! But definitely don't see making time for something like this for 0.9. Likely to be the sort of thing that'd only make it in if it helped solve another issue.



To me, the game is at its best when it immerses you in the world as a small business owner with a home port, small fleet, jobs to take and mouths to feed. The "fun" of the game, in my opinion, comes more from "how can I stay afloat with what I got" than "woohoo let's blow up another pirate fleet".

I think we're roughly on the same page here; these are all things that give context to the combat, give it stakes, and make it more fun. And that's how I try to look at them in terms of design, generally - how they contribute to the context of combat. The contribution doesn't have to be direct, but it needs to be there or a feature is at best ancillary to the core of the game.

That's all I really mean by "combat focused" and "funneling". It definitely doesn't mean "fight everything in sight all the time". Basically, my general approach is that stuff in the campaign should make the combat more fun, either directly or indirectly. Which is a pretty general statement, but it helps when thinking through campaign features and deciding which way to go about things. It doesn't mean that *nothing* non-combat-related makes it through, either. It's just a high-level approach to overall design.


Frequently, I see my fleet of something like 2 destroyers and 2 frigates being attacked by 3 (D) frigates.

Huh, really? That shouldn't happen; could be a bug that I've since fixed. Just gave it a quick test and a pair of (D) frigates runs away from my fleet of 1 frigate and 1 destroyer. Possibly mod-related?

In any case, totally agree that that's not a good thing and forcing the player to have trivial fights like that is not a good idea.



...
Hopefully that wouldn't be too difficult to implement. I feel it would add a good deal of dynamic difficulty to the game and keep funneling the player to battle without making enemies too easy and suicidal.

Hmm - this sort of thing sounds appealing at first, but I think would lead to weirdness and frustration from the player's point of view. There are many times where you'd like to fight a fleet, such as a bounty, and if the punishment for doing well was that these started running away from you... It's also tough to accurately estimate, since it could vary wildly with the player fleet's makeup, size, and currently chosen flagship. It's just too complicated to reduce to a single number effectively, and the benefit of being successful at it still seems questionable.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2018, 03:37:34 PM by Alex »
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SafariJohn

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #91 on: June 05, 2018, 04:27:30 PM »

Pirates demanding money seems like a decent stick to beat people away from the core worlds at low levels. It would also make the core worlds a lot safer for new players.

Offhand, I feel like player piracy would be self correcting to a degree, since you would lose rep with most factions and not get much money to boot. I don't think it should affect your pirate rep, either, so you'll lose more rep smuggling or whatever if you want access to the pirate military markets.
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lapersonaoval

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #92 on: June 05, 2018, 06:57:00 PM »

lots of new stuff, so i am so excited that cannot wait anymore !!!!!! it's amazing that you're making may dreams come true improving this game to "maraviglia", and so sorry for don´t be able to explain myself correctly in english, i intend but needing help to learn, my apologize and congratulations again
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Techhead

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #93 on: June 05, 2018, 08:37:42 PM »

That's a good first step to making pirates act like pirates not psychotic serial killers. Although I think this would also be a really good fit for a dialogue option after a successful pirate intercept.

The reverse should also be true though - player pirates should be able to demand cargo from their targets instead of going for straight murder (because a "pirate" that just kills everyone with no demands, or even if their demands are fulfilled is a stupid and unprofitable pirate who won't live long).

I hear what you're saying, for sure. The counter-point is that the game's focus is combat, and campaign-level activities should (generally! not always) funnel the player towards that. A high degree of unprofitable and bad-for-self-preservation behavior is essentially a design requirement.

That's not to say that the specific options you're talking about wouldn't be good. They might be! I'm just saying that stuff like that - that lets you avoid combat - should be evaluated in terms of gameplay and not assumed to be good because it makes the behaviors more believable or realistic. Some of that is good, both because it opens up player options and makes things feel more believable. Too much of it would be bad.

As a counter-counterpoint, the core gameplay loop is combat, but not every combat fits into that scenario. Getting curb-stomped by a band of out-of-your-league pirates isn't exactly fun, so offering a "let's skip to the part where you take all my stuff" option lets players move on with their game without dealing with a fleetwipe.

(And likewise with "chore" combats that PCCL mentioned like raiding civilian trade fleets.)
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #94 on: June 05, 2018, 09:13:34 PM »

Sure! I specifically made sure to not say this is a bad idea :) Just speaking to the general point that 'more "reasonable" behavior' doesn't necessarily mean 'good'. I'm not saying *all* of it is bad. I'm just saying it's not a universal, unquestioned good, which I think may have been the thrust of the post I was responding to, and it imo was worth discussing in case it was.


lots of new stuff, so i am so excited that cannot wait anymore !!!!!! it's amazing that you're making may dreams come true improving this game to "maraviglia", and so sorry for don´t be able to explain myself correctly in english, i intend but needing help to learn, my apologize and congratulations again

Haha, thank you!
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DatonKallandor

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #95 on: June 05, 2018, 11:06:08 PM »

Note that player-pirates would still need to fight for their reputation. Nobody is going to drop cargo or transfer credits to some random guy they've never heard of. Build a reputation as a fearsome pirate who kills those to refuse to give in to their demands should be just as important as not killing the ones that do.

As for the reverse case, I'm not sure giving players to the option to opt-out of combat with pirates at a (scaling probably?) credits cost is a bad idea. The core of the game is still combat - and avoiding it by paying pirates avoids both the fun and the profit of combat. I doubt people would just stop fighing pirates categorically given those costs.
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PCCL

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #96 on: June 05, 2018, 11:57:56 PM »

Note that player-pirates would still need to fight for their reputation. Nobody is going to drop cargo or transfer credits to some random guy they've never heard of. Build a reputation as a fearsome pirate who kills those to refuse to give in to their demands should be just as important as not killing the ones that do.

I don't know that "nobody" is going to drop cargo to some random guy if said random guy is pointing an onslaught at them...
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mmm.... tartiflette

Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #97 on: June 06, 2018, 05:46:44 AM »

My grim reaper murder-fleet does not care much what enemy is in the way.  If it can kill it and profit somehow (profit may be optional if my Ming-wannabe is swimming in resources), my fleet is happy.  My fleet is less of a pirate and more of an omnicidal maniac who kills for amusement, although it will not say no to free money and xp.  ("Later! I like to play with things awhile, before annihilation.  Hahaha...")  I may try a destroy-all-factions playthrough, maybe if/when Starsector gets game-ender win conditions.
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DatonKallandor

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #98 on: June 06, 2018, 07:08:21 AM »

I don't know that "nobody" is going to drop cargo to some random guy if said random guy is pointing an onslaught at them...

Sure the first time it happens they might even drop cargo (balance of forces should absolutely be a factor in addition to reputation when it comes to "will they pay"). The moment that pirate doesn't let the cargo-droppers live though he'll get a reputation and the only thing he can expect from that point on is fights to the death instead of free money, no matter how big his ship is.
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Thaago

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #99 on: June 06, 2018, 07:11:40 AM »

My grim reaper murder-fleet does not care much what enemy is in the way.  If it can kill it and profit somehow (profit may be optional if my Ming-wannabe is swimming in resources), my fleet is happy.  My fleet is less of a pirate and more of an omnicidal maniac who kills for amusement, although it will not say no to free money and xp.  ("Later! I like to play with things awhile, before annihilation.  Hahaha...")  I may try a destroy-all-factions playthrough, maybe if/when Starsector gets game-ender win conditions.

Your Admiral would make a good antagonist in a super hero movie. The name Megas fits right in too.

...

You're actually a super villain aren't you?
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #100 on: June 06, 2018, 07:40:50 AM »

@ Thaago:  When I think of Megas, I tend to think of MegasXLR, the mecha with a muscle car for its head, piloted by a heroic but sloppy fat hero.

I am tempted to name my super-villain wannabe character Dio.  Strange highways indeed.  That is, if I do not use Hegemony's space marine, in which case, his name is Doom.

I am not a super-villain in real-life.
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TheDTYP

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #101 on: June 06, 2018, 10:01:01 AM »

Are there plans to add more core worlds to this update? I could stand to have a few more, lore and gameplay-wise. There's some interesting combinations we haven't seen yet (iirc) like a system inhabited by both the Church and Tri-tachyon or the Persean League and the Hegemony. I feel like more warzones like Valhalla (?) would be an interesting place to hang out in.
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Techhead

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #102 on: June 06, 2018, 11:50:14 AM »

Quote
  • Faction hostilities: fixed various issues re: hostilities properly ending and total number/frequency
    • Last for at least 6 months, and rarely more than a full cycle
    • Hostilities between Hegemony-TriTachyon and other starting hostilities between major factions (i.e. not pirates/pathers) are no longer permanent

I have a few questions about these changes. Once hostilities end, is TT any more likely to go back to war with the Hegies compared to war with one of the other factions? Is there anything influencing weighting on who fights who or does it remain entirely random?
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #103 on: June 06, 2018, 12:30:59 PM »

Are there plans to add more core worlds to this update? I could stand to have a few more, lore and gameplay-wise. There's some interesting combinations we haven't seen yet (iirc) like a system inhabited by both the Church and Tri-tachyon or the Persean League and the Hegemony. I feel like more warzones like Valhalla (?) would be an interesting place to hang out in.

Ah - there might be a few less, actually; there's been a bit of rearranging on that front. It's something like 50-ish colonies total, and I feel that's approaching being too much; beyond a certain point, things can start to blur, and these do still have a cost in terms of performance. I do hear you re: warzones etc, though, but ideally that would happen more dynamically.

I have a few questions about these changes. Once hostilities end, is TT any more likely to go back to war with the Hegies compared to war with one of the other factions? Is there anything influencing weighting on who fights who or does it remain entirely random?

They're not more likely, no. It's about as simple as I could make it at this point; just needed to re-do it using the intel system, and it was a good opportunity to fix the issues and simplify at the same time. Will see where it needs to go later!
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Maxzhao

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Re: Starsector 0.9a (In-Dev) Patch Notes
« Reply #104 on: June 06, 2018, 03:11:50 PM »

So so excited for the update! The new player controlled station idea is awesome! Will there be some optimization done for this new release? The game's been quite laggy when travelling (not in combat or in stations) for me. I don't have a gaming rig but I would think a 2D game should run smoothly on a Macbook air? I do understand the current focus is on new content, just hoping there will be a optimisation pass sometime in the near future?
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