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Author Topic: idea for a new character skill in the leadership line  (Read 1425 times)

arwan

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idea for a new character skill in the leadership line
« on: April 12, 2018, 06:57:31 AM »

i have a new idea for a player skill to be implemented within the refit screen of a ship. possibly on the same screen as weapon grouping, or similar screen. that would change the way the combat AI is handled on a per player ship basis. it would be able to make one of your capital ships for example largely ignore a frigate that may be harassing it except to defend itself and instead proceed across the battlefield, even at great distances, to engage say another capital or even cruiser sized target where its weapon load out would do more good on the battle field. at the same time it could be used to make a frigate an anti missile or anti fighter/bomber platform and try to keep that frigate from getting to close to other ships where its load out may not perform well.

you might be able "depending on coding" to specialize or generalize a role for a load out quite a bit. depending on your proficiency with this character skill. my idea for the 3 skill levels would be that each level of the skill would unlock a few more options. that a commander could apply to each ship in their fleet to refine their general role in their fleet. up to and possibly including a ships personality, the ships targeting preferences, and the likelihood a particular ship will follow an order given while in combat. (attack, defend, escort etc.) though my "vision" for this skill would only let you choose one item from each skill rank you unlock. so up to 3 "roles" but only 1 within each rank.

if a ship in your fleet does not have a role selected from this list than the default AI would handle your ship as it does now. and they would do what ever they feel like doing each captain having largely free will to do what ever, regardless of what ever they may be better at doing. like they do now.

first rank ship -  general role
escort - will follow escort orders before other ships are assigned to them.
hunter - will prioritize trying to stay on the front lines and target "stragglers" that separate from the line
defender - will prioritize holding points and following defend and attack orders
scout - will try to get around to the back side of the enemies lines to harass from the back sides.
support - will try to stay in your back lines but still within weapons range to give support with long range missiles or long range weapons.

second rank - target priority - does what is on the tin. will prioritize these ships over others if they are a "viable" target dependent also on a ships personality if any. and self preservation when assessing going for the target.
capital
cruiser
destroyer
frigate
fighter

third rank ship personality - just as with ship captains you can hire, give a general personality to the ship so it will more or less aggressively follow its orders, favoring self preservation, or "get the job done at all costs"
cowardly
passive
neutral
aggressive
reckless

i dont believe this would remove the usefulness of orders while in combat and in some cases can enhance your orders as you will have a general idea of who is the most likely ship to follow your commands dictated by their roles within
your fleet. also the ship captains you can hire will still have a role as well since they will bring their skills to the ship they are on. and also a hired captains personality would override any personality given by this skill.

i believe this skill would also be a useful addition to the combat space within the game by giving a little more control of a battle indirectly, and may also help in removing some situations that happen where ships will run away
from combat that we would rather them engage the target aggressively. and vise versa, it could also be used to give more focused roles to ship variants as i mentioned. instead of just listing them as combat or elite. we would now also be able to have
that mean something in battle by assigning ships whit these load outs a role that fits them.

this may all be a pipe dream that cant be coded at all. but regardless i thought it would be a good addition to the game if possible and if Alex were willing to add it.

if not i wouldn't think less of the game for sure, i think its one of the best space games i have played in over a decade. i just want it to be the best it can be. Alex if you end up reading this to the end, let me say Thank You, your dedication to this project has not gone un-appreciated by me and very good work so far. keep it up.  :)
« Last Edit: April 12, 2018, 07:11:28 AM by arwan »
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Alex
You won't be able to refit fighters and bombers at all. They're designed/balanced around having a particular set of weapons and would be very broken if you could change it. Which ones you pick for your fleet -out of quite a few that are available- is the choice here, not how they're outfitted.

Sutopia

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Re: idea for a new character skill in the leadership line
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2018, 06:20:19 PM »

Afflictor + Buffalo + Atlas + Onslaught

Okay, which is going to be top target if you're making targeting priority by ship class?

Some of the ships are jack of all trades, most of ships are good at more than one thing, posting such priority might be restricting their potential, not enhancing.
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arwan

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Re: idea for a new character skill in the leadership line
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2018, 05:48:05 AM »

In those cases just as now you would use an order instead. Still in most cases it could enhance the ships in your fleet. The point in my idea is that you build  YOUR ships with a role in mind. Maybe a fleet of fast destroyers with both kinnetic and hi ex. you want to race around to the back lines and pick off the slower ships, or those trying to retreat. Or maybe use those ships to instead prioritize slower capital sized ships where they can wittle them down instead of them just spreading out in your fleet and getting picked off them selves as they get separated. Instead of trying to micro in the middle of a battle with your limited commands you would give general roles to your ships to carry out once in battle. As I (think) I said this would not make them say useless to do anything else during combat as they would still do all the things they do now. Just help prioritize a ships load out to do the things it would be better at handling. Than all ships being treated as Jack's of all trades. Like they are now.

 likely there will never be a perfect solution to anything ai related. Just look at the holes we can poke in the ai as it works now. Where you can have a capital ship straight up decide to run from combat even when it's supported by other ships. Or you can end up with two ships of opposing sides that it seems neither want to engage because they both seem it too risky.

But what I guess I'm suggesting in other words is another layer of macro control of your fleet. Something you set up before combat. So that you can potentially use your orders for more micro control in combat. It would, I believe, give you more options in how a player could approch combat. Players could also choose to not take any part in the skill if they wished and combat would stay exactly as it is now. (And/or will be with the future updates to the ai)
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Alex
You won't be able to refit fighters and bombers at all. They're designed/balanced around having a particular set of weapons and would be very broken if you could change it. Which ones you pick for your fleet -out of quite a few that are available- is the choice here, not how they're outfitted.

Sutopia

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Re: idea for a new character skill in the leadership line
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2018, 11:26:20 AM »

If I remember it correctly, the combat AI uses state machine and bunch of scores to determine what’s “best” action it should take at the moment.
You’re basically asking changing the score modifier so they can “prioritize” some task.
The problem is, how much should it be?
Too little would make it too little of effect to notice, too large can cause some more irrational decisions such as ignoring extremely heavy fire to chase down it’s prioritized target.

At my POV the AI is doing jobs good enough with existing commands available. With command center hull mod it’s already more than sufficient to do both macro and micro commands unless you want to just play RTS.
Anyways, since targeting specific enemy don’t even “force” your ships to fully engage it, I highly suspect such skill can have any usefulness.
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