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Author Topic: alex fix the AI please  (Read 2212 times)

Mealstrom

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alex fix the AI please
« on: June 15, 2017, 10:51:22 PM »

basicly ships NEVER follow any instructions.. they do even the opposite sometimes and it makes it impossible to win some very important fights... I tell ships to move back, they keep throwing themselves at the enemy. I make them strike ships so it balances out... and now they wanna stay away. Even if I tell them to push they wont do *** and it makes it really tedious. Ive noticed this has been an issue since 0.8. I don't know what you changed but it seems like ships lost half their AI and just become either absolutely pointless in combat  (I have another unsung in my fleet and it won't support me or stick close it will just stay all the way back... not even shooting half the time and when he does its at a tiny ship while it should be focusing on much larger ships)

Edit: is it possible this is because i haven't found officers yet? I mean do officerless ships behave less than ones with an officer?
« Last Edit: June 15, 2017, 11:00:52 PM by Mealstrom »
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Histidine

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2017, 05:26:39 AM »

Provide videos and/or test scenarios (savegames/custom missions/specific setup instructions) that demonstrate specific issues in each instance (e.g. "ship X hangs back and fails to engage"). Your post is impossible to parse as anything except raw hyperbole otherwise.
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Alex

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2017, 10:45:22 AM »

(Moved this to the modded section b/c looks like a modded game. I get being frustrated etc, but the bug reports forum really isn't the place to vent, so in the future please wait until you're in a better frame of mind before making a post here.)

But, right - to echo what Histidine said, with any potential AI issues, clarity is key. A video demonstrating the problem is great, as are (preferably vanilla-doable) instructions to reproduce the issue. For example, "deploy this ship with this loadout in the simulator, deploy this other ship with that loadout, turn on autopilot/do thing X, and watch <problem> happen about half the time", or something similar.

A very clear verbal description of the problem can do the job sometimes too, but that's more difficult because there could be a variety of reasons for any given behavior, ranging from "normal" to "bug", so unless a behavior is extremely clear-cut and distinctive, it's generally going to be difficult to convey.

For example:
(I have another unsung in my fleet and it won't support me or stick close it will just stay all the way back... not even shooting half the time and when he does its at a tiny ship while it should be focusing on much larger ships)

This could range from "expecting a battleship to stick with you while you're in a faster ship, and/or without you giving it an escort order" (which would be expecting something impossible) to "piloting a slower ship, gave the Unsung an escort order, and it's not obeying it despite being nearby when the order was issued" (which would be a bug).


Edit: is it possible this is because i haven't found officers yet? I mean do officerless ships behave less than ones with an officer?

Officers can change ship behavior, but ships without officers will behave as if they had a "steady" officer.
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Mealstrom

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2017, 12:09:12 PM »

ill post a screenshot in the starsector discord I just have a perfect example. Sadly my recording softwares wont work so i can't post a vid :/

I sent histidine a screencap of the issue, also my bad for my slight temper problem, ill make sure to avoid that next time :/ After all, the game isn't done yet so I shouldn't be suprised if stuff like this happends. Its all on me.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2017, 12:27:26 PM by Mealstrom »
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Alex

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2017, 12:47:38 PM »

Thanks! No worries :)

Would you mind posting the screenshot here? A description of what's going on, along with it, would really help, so that I have to do as little guessing/interpretation as possible.

(I think whatever is happening is probably specific either to the ships you're using, or the orders you're giving, or some combination of these. That's not to discount your experience - but in general, it seems like the AI is overall in a good place in this update, so I think this is either something that's specific to your setup, and/or something that could be avoided by adjusting what you do. Maybe. Can't really say too much w/o seeing it, of course.)
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Mealstrom

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2017, 12:53:04 PM »

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/325351556851433482/325351577026297856/unknown.png

tell me if this works. basicly this is just a general example. The ships just stay there and don't move despite no enemies... So you can imagine how it is in combat :P So yeah they were sitting there for a good minute or two. after that i just stopped waiting as they werent moving. Its been like this since 0,8 but thought you fixed it in 0.8.1. So now in order to fight i have to deploy the other unsung with me only and like mid fight i bring in the others so i can have cover for them like it should be. The AI should also send their larger ships first instead of the smaller ones it would make more sense imo. So yeah its quite problematic as you can see
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Alex

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2017, 01:02:03 PM »

Aha! So the issue is they're just not moving to the waypoints at all, right? That's... really weird. I'm not able to reproduce it at all here - tried both in a simulation and in a campaign battle, and if I give similar orders, the ships follow them immediately.

Are you using a bunch of mods? If it's only a couple, and you send me your savefile, I could take a quick look. (Going out of town for a few days fairly soon, so can't get too much done before I get back.)

Also: if you've got a vanilla save handy, can you see if the same thing happens for you there?
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Mealstrom

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2017, 01:27:58 PM »

ive got a couple of mods, not too many.
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

thats the save transfer string, i just save the latest string in a notepad and when i get back in the save i just loadsave since saving is still borked but it doesn't really matter anymore since i can use this trick to bypass the issue. It would still be nice to be able to save normally but I know this technique has 100% of success at this point and doesnt corrupt the save.

Anyway heres the mod list:
SCY
Save Transfer (duh lolz)
Arsenal expansion
Blackrock
Console Commands
Dassault
Diableavionics
GraphicsLib
Interstallar federation
Interstellar Imperium
LazyLib
Neutrino corp
Nexerelin (not using it because cheeky templars)
Omnifactory
ORA
Shadowyards
Ships/Weapon pack
Nomads
Templars
Toreup plenty
Unkown Skies
« Last Edit: June 16, 2017, 01:30:27 PM by Mealstrom »
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Alex

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2017, 09:07:05 PM »

Thanks - I'll hopefully remember to check this out when I'm back.

(In the meantime, if you have a chance, would you mind just double-checking that you don't get this issue in vanilla? It would be good to narrow it down a bit.)
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Mealstrom

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Re: alex fix the AI please
« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2017, 12:15:21 AM »

i WILL
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