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Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Skills and Story Points (07/08/19)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.8.1a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 179473 times)

ANGRYABOUTELVES

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #285 on: June 01, 2017, 08:04:10 PM »

Auroras without Heavy Blasters are the best Auroras. It should only run any HBs if it's also running Safety Overrides, and I don't like Safety Overrides. The Aurora still functions best as a front-line missile boat. That's my major issue with the default Aurora variants, there are no missile boat Auroras. I get that some captains are crazy and like to overload themselves with the Heavy Blaster, but surely at least some of them realize that they'll overload more of the enemy by dropping eight Sabots and Plasma Jetting forwards to protect the first stage of the Sabot shells from PD with their shields.
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Wyvern

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #286 on: June 01, 2017, 08:14:03 PM »

I prefer -one- heavy blaster on an Aurora, in the forward hardpoint.  Front turrets go to pulse lasers.  No SO, no UI, no missiles, just death and destruction for whatever gets in front of you.  You can't just put it on autofire, but having those 500 damage shots is great for armor-breaking.  Missiles are just... Yeah, okay, you can horribly massacre three ships.  Six if you have extended racks.  I'd rather have a build with a bit more staying power.
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Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

ANGRYABOUTELVES

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #287 on: June 01, 2017, 08:22:16 PM »

When those six ships you horribly massacre are all of their cruisers, the Aurora doesn't need staying power. It can comfortably kill destroyers with 2 Pulse 3 IR Pulse. Sabots in the mediums and HE missiles, preferably Annihilators, in the smalls allow it to punch within, even slightly above, its weight class for 6 (six) ships. I can't remember the last time a bounty had six Falcons, let alone six actual cruisers.

The sim Aurora can't kill the Heron mostly because its loadout is terrible. Front Shield is necessary for the Aurora in 0.8, just so it doesn't get crippled by fighters shooting out its engines.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2017, 08:26:19 PM by ANGRYABOUTELVES »
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orost

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #288 on: June 01, 2017, 08:43:29 PM »

Aurora wants to be an aggressive hunter-killer ship and absolutely excels in this role but all the variants are strange declawed support boats.
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isaacssv552

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #289 on: June 01, 2017, 08:44:48 PM »

More likely the Odyssey will be able to hit destroyers and frigates with one or two large energies, and that's much more survivable.
Do not count on that.  Medusa is faster and it cannot catch some frigates.  Frigates will be able to kite, swarm, and kill no problem.  It is the cruisers and slow destroyers (like Enforcer and some carriers) that may have trouble, and that is fine since Odyssey is weak against other capitals.

HIL is stopped by most shields, and it is a bad flux trade for the attacker.  Tachyon Lance is good, but needs hard flux to bypass shields.  Any other large energy, Odyssey gets outranged by many ballistic users and Paragon.

Remember, Onslaught and Legion have Burn Drive for more speed.  Conquest has Maneuvering Jets for more speed.  Paragon has Advanced Targeting Core to compensate for poor mobility and fixes energy weapons' range weakness.  Astral is the master of fighters thanks to six bays and Fighter Recall, and fighters have even more range than Paragon.  Odyssey has... nothing to compensate for slow speed and shot range, except one fighter bay, which is not much better than a Converted Hangar Onslaught and Paragon can get (and those two ships have some OP to spare).  The 80 speed and two fighter bays should not make Odyssey overpowered, but to at least compete with the other capitals.  That is kind of why the shield change to 1.0 is baffling.
This is approximately what I found when I tested a 90 speed Odyssey. Capitals killed it, it killed Cruisers, did decently against destroyers, and was killed by frigates. (Odyssey lost to 40 DP Onslaught [A variant that swaps two flak cannons for kinetics], won vs. 100DP of cruisers, won vs. 50DP of Destroyers, lost vs. 50DP of frigates)
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ANGRYABOUTELVES

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #290 on: June 01, 2017, 08:53:33 PM »

Aurora wants to be an aggressive hunter-killer ship and absolutely excels in this role but all the variants are strange declawed support boats.
Some of the variants do have claws, though. The """""""Balanced""""""" variant has 2 Heavy Blasters, an Ion Pulser, and two Antimatter Blasters. It's got so much claw that it cuts itself whenever it tries to fire.
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Hiruma Kai

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #291 on: June 01, 2017, 09:27:44 PM »

Out of curiosity, with the 80 speed and 1.0 shield reduction for the Odyssey, what is its distinguishing characteristic versus the Conquest now?  Basically just 2 fighter wings?  It used to be the Odyssey was a better tank, but had less offense because of its energy weapon load out and slower average speed.

There's about a 800 effective hit points difference between a Conquest's base shield and an Odyssey's base shield with the 1.0 multiplier, and the Odyssey really doesn't have the spare OP to put more points into flux capacitors to take advantage of the shield ratio.   The Conquest's time averaged speed is 70 (manuevring jets adds +50 about half the time) versus the Odyssey's 80.   The Conquest's effective 315 OP + 40 dedicated Large Ballistics OP lets it grab just as many useful hull mods the Odyssey if it fills both sides equally with weapons, more if it doesn't.  

An Odyssey can get 3 large energy weapons in arc along a thin line, while a Conquest can get 2 Large and 2 medium ballistics in arc comfortably.
 The high energy focus can briefly make that seem like 4.5 large energy weapons, but I'd argue 2 Large and 2 medium ballistics are just as good when high energy focus is up, and better when its down.  Two large missile launchers seem to help as much as two fighters wings in the short term, at least in a 1 on 1 duel against larger ships.  Certainly I think Squall MLRS can be compared to Longbows against other cruisers or capitals.

The Odyssey's fighters wings seem to do a better job of chasing down lone frigates than the missiles.

Also while playing around, I've discovered non-officer setups of the Conquest which look to beat the standard and elite Onslaughts 100% of the time when both are AI piloted (in addition it seems to defeat every Odyssey setup run by the AI I've tried).  For example, 2x Gauss Cannons, 2x Hellbore, 2x Hypervelocity, 2x Heavy Mauler, 2x Squall, 2x Sabot SRM pod, x8 Tactical lasers, Dedicated Targeting Core, Stabilized Shields, Hardened Shields, rest in vents then capacitors, 315 OP used.  By not including short range PD, the AI is smart enough not to close with the Onslaughts, and it has enough shield to survive the burn drive and maneuvering jet out of the way.  Throwing it against carriers also works surprisingly well despite its lack of actual "PD".  The tac lasers actually kill fighters rather than trying to kill the ammunition they drop.  Up against 2 sim Herons, it seems to win.  2 sim Moras on the other hand is very close.  Once its armor is bumped to 1200, and talons are nerfed, it should win regularly against that match up I think.

I've come to a much better appreciation of the Conquest through all this testing.  I'll need to aim for it more often in play throughs.  :)
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Embercloud

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #292 on: June 02, 2017, 01:31:49 AM »

I take it the interdiction pulse nullifies transverse jumps chargeup?
Meaning you need to start transversing jumping once again if you, for example, manage to successfully withdraw from the fight?
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Death_Silence_66

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #293 on: June 02, 2017, 03:07:23 AM »

Anything resembling an ETA for this?
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #294 on: June 02, 2017, 05:40:04 AM »

Re: Aurora
If I can spare the weapons, I like two Heavy Blasters and one Ion Beam.  If not, three Pulse Lasers, two Ion Cannons, maybe Salamanders.  It has enough mounts to fire four Salamanders, which is roughly the minimum to make them reliable.

P.S.
Back to Odyssey...
Quote
and the Odyssey really doesn't have the spare OP to put more points into flux capacitors to take advantage of the shield ratio.
That is true, and will be more so if Odyssey does not get more OP to support second wing of fighters.

With more speed, a configuration I may want to try again is three Guardian PD in the heavy mounts and IR Pulse Lasers in all of the small mounts.  This configuration is ineffective in 0.8 because the range was even less, and against the things it could kill, they simply stayed away from Odyssey easily, and against capitals, some of them kite-and-sniped Odyssey while the rest simply outgunned it.  The Guardian PDs are better PD than many PD lasers, and the IR Pulse Lasers do respectable damage when about six or seven pound on the enemy.  But with short range, Odyssey almost needs to bump into enemies to kill them.  Maybe 80 speed will help in that.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 05:51:30 AM by Megas »
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #295 on: June 02, 2017, 09:04:42 AM »

I take it the interdiction pulse nullifies transverse jumps chargeup?
Meaning you need to start transversing jumping once again if you, for example, manage to successfully withdraw from the fight?

Right, yes. So does just being in a fight. But given that whoever you fought should be "standing down", you should have ample time to withdraw.

Anything resembling an ETA for this?

Well, I'm pretty deep into testing, if that's any help :)
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Snrasha

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #296 on: June 03, 2017, 06:00:53 AM »

Quote
Fixed crash on star system info screen if planet had 4 or more moons

Thank for have fixed this bug.
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Add battle options on Com Relay/ Framework for modders for add their own bounty.

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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #297 on: June 03, 2017, 10:01:55 AM »

It's out!
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c0nr4d1c4l

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #298 on: June 03, 2017, 10:06:13 AM »

YEEEEEEEEESSSSSS!!  ;D
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Deshara

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Re: Starsector 0.8.1a (Released) Patch Notes
« Reply #299 on: June 03, 2017, 10:21:46 AM »

< internet is down
< sees Alex releases new update
< does a sadface
<decides to give downloading it over the phone a shot, worried about how I'd go about doing that
< link just works

Alex really is stalking me to keep track of which IP's are me
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