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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: .8 feedback thread  (Read 103683 times)

dk1332

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #300 on: May 13, 2017, 01:45:07 PM »

@SCC I haven't really noticed the warning beacons doing several pings for different threat levels. If they do tell which is which already and I did failed to notice, then I apologize.

As for the fleet log, I don't think they stay longer than a month or so. So far, I have been following some bread crumb trails to look for research stations to plunder so I usually find some location data of something but they don't last that long for at least a month or so. At least a list of log that shouldn't actually go away or at least until you found it yourself to keep things in order. That way, you can track your scavenging expeditions so far.

Though maybe separating stuff on which stays, from important ones like derelicts and stations and not so important ones like debris field, distress calls and probably planetary data?
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SCC

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #301 on: May 13, 2017, 01:57:54 PM »

Fleet logs... Okay, this one depends on whether distress calls stay longer than other stuff. If so, then I stand by my words that fleet logs stay around 1 cycle, perhaps longer. If they aren't treated any special, though, I'm forced to correct myself and say that fleet logs actually stay for 2 cycles.

I'm all for separating important and unimportant logs, though.

Drokkath

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #302 on: May 13, 2017, 03:25:02 PM »

@Drokkath there's also a map filter which shows if you've surveyed completely given system or planet, depending on whether map is in sector or system mode.

Thanks, though I actually already had that switched on since day one of .8, I don't remember if it was on by default or not, must've hit a numerical key by accident if it's not on by default plus I also skipped the tutorial until days later when I made my second character and began noticing subtle and useful new user interface tabs, keys, areas and whatnot. All somethings that should be either more noticeable or added to the tutorial those rather blended areas of extra functions in UI as I didn't even know yesterday that surveyed planets have a tab menu of their own in Intel section, found out about it by pure accidental key press.
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A.Winge

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #303 on: May 14, 2017, 02:55:55 PM »

@A.Winge Uhh, methinks there is something like that already in the game, its rather hidden in under Intel section where there's a tab Planets [2] and I can confirm because I'm looking currently straight at it, the new tab section I mean. Since I've explored and surveyed many planets in star systems I've been to which is about 5-15% of the entire medium/normal sized game's star map already, which surprisingly feels like I've explored more than that and in a good way, doesn't really bother me as much if I start running into similar planets but fortunately with the way SS is built up it's probably a more easy thing to "fix"/add down the line by making or altering a few existing 2d planet art (which seems to be a case already) with slight different craters and landscape areas and atmosphere effects and size if it has any to making a few unique planets like bombarded and blown in half types of planets or massive objects and thus implementing more variety along with text.

*Snip*

That's not quite what I meant, Drokkath, but I should probably clarify it better.  I am aware of Planet Exploration/Surveying filters; those are actually very good.

What I cannot find is a way to store log entries after the fact.  As others have mentioned, this includes things like Research Stations, Derelict Ships, or (please leave this one for as long as I need it) Domain Motherships.  I think that all of these are seeded during map generation, and only despawn once the player interacts with them (like the stable debris fields in some systems).  Distress calls that expire or objects that are interacted with could be removed from the list or put in an archive; whatever works best or is doable in the current implementation.

And I should also clarify that I do understand the different warning level pings (although Red and Orange could be slightly more distinct colors).  What I want is that as soon as I discover a warning beacon (when I get the XP), I would like it to permanently show up on the system map/intel map differently without having to enter or explore the system.  Think of it as a way to explore the system later, or avoid bounties/sensor missions in that system if unprepared.
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AxleMC131

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #304 on: May 14, 2017, 03:09:58 PM »

What I cannot find is a way to store log entries after the fact.  As others have mentioned, this includes things like Research Stations, Derelict Ships, or (please leave this one for as long as I need it) Domain Motherships.  I think that all of these are seeded during map generation, and only despawn once the player interacts with them (like the stable debris fields in some systems).  Distress calls that expire or objects that are interacted with could be removed from the list or put in an archive; whatever works best or is doable in the current implementation.

I had the same complaint on a YouTube comment the other day, and someone informed me that you can change the "Show messages from..." checkboxes in the Intel screen. Options are "week", "month" and "cycle", and are set to show messages up to a month old by default, if I remember correctly. HOWEVER apparently you can deselect them or something so that the fleet log items never disappear. Have yet to try this myself, but it's worth knowing.

And I should also clarify that I do understand the different warning level pings (although Red and Orange could be slightly more distinct colors).  What I want is that as soon as I discover a warning beacon (when I get the XP), I would like it to permanently show up on the system map/intel map differently without having to enter or explore the system.  Think of it as a way to explore the system later, or avoid bounties/sensor missions in that system if unprepared.

Umm... Wat? ??? Systems with warning beacons do show up on your sector map as you see them, permanently. You don't have to go into them. You just have to discover the beacon from hyperspace.
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SCC

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #305 on: May 14, 2017, 10:53:12 PM »

Fleet log stores logs for as long as 2 cycles, but I don't know if that's the limit.
Warning beacons show up on map, but NOT when starscape is enabled.

A.Winge

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #306 on: May 15, 2017, 10:20:46 AM »

And I should also clarify that I do understand the different warning level pings (although Red and Orange could be slightly more distinct colors).  What I want is that as soon as I discover a warning beacon (when I get the XP), I would like it to permanently show up on the system map/intel map differently without having to enter or explore the system.  Think of it as a way to explore the system later, or avoid bounties/sensor missions in that system if unprepared.

Umm... Wat? ??? Systems with warning beacons do show up on your sector map as you see them, permanently. You don't have to go into them. You just have to discover the beacon from hyperspace.

[Finally gets the chance to try this out.]
Ah, I see now.  One of the filter options (I think Starscape) hides them by default.  Thank you!

I would still like them to be color-coded; right now, they all show up as orange.  I don't want to spend 2,000 Fuel only to find that a warning beacon I wanted to farm was only threat level yellow.  Additional filter options to highlight those systems would be nice as well (though not required).
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AxleMC131

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #307 on: May 15, 2017, 04:16:04 PM »

[Finally gets the chance to try this out.]
Ah, I see now.  One of the filter options (I think Starscape) hides them by default.  Thank you!

I would still like them to be color-coded; right now, they all show up as orange.  I don't want to spend 2,000 Fuel only to find that a warning beacon I wanted to farm was only threat level yellow.  Additional filter options to highlight those systems would be nice as well (though not required).

Yah, they don't show up in Starscape mode.

I agree the map icons need to match the colour of the beacon itself, but although I haven't seen it yet, I'm fairly certain someone has already mentioned this to the Devs.
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2_Wycked

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #308 on: May 15, 2017, 07:33:37 PM »

Maybe I'm not reading the bounty descriptions right, but right now it seems that no matter what the bounty amount is the description is always a kind of vague "sizeable fleet"? I'm guessing this is on the docket for future tweaking but a bit more detail of the bounty fleet would go a long way to encouraging bounty hunting since you kind of just have to learn what size fleets tend to correspond to certain bounty amount thresholds. I've only gone up to 80k~ bounties so I could be missing something.
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AxleMC131

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #309 on: May 15, 2017, 08:40:42 PM »

Maybe I'm not reading the bounty descriptions right, but right now it seems that no matter what the bounty amount is the description is always a kind of vague "sizeable fleet"? I'm guessing this is on the docket for future tweaking but a bit more detail of the bounty fleet would go a long way to encouraging bounty hunting since you kind of just have to learn what size fleets tend to correspond to certain bounty amount thresholds. I've only gone up to 80k~ bounties so I could be missing something.

No, I think it basically always says "sizeable fleet". If I'm honest I agree that there needs to be some more information: maybe what the bounty's flagship is or something.

Nevertheless, the bounty reward is actually roughly based (I think) on the size of the fleet, so that's usually a good estimation of the size of your target.
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Deshara

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #310 on: May 16, 2017, 01:22:38 PM »

I think... maybe the design of the survey skill doesn't mesh with the intended design of the survey system. You talked in your blog post about not wanting the system to encourage players ever having to come back to re-survey a planet, but the current system with having tiered planets locked behind the 3 levels of the survey skill does just that; you go to a planet, out on the rim no less expending fuel and supplies in huge quantities to get there, just to find that even if you came fully equipped & crewed out, you can't survey this planet. And thus while you may not have to re-survey a planet after you've scanned it, you do have to resurvey systems.
Which has actually caused me to never get surveying after my first play of .8. I get it's a good source of income, but the fact that I would need to sink 6 points into surveying (and industry) in order to be even capable of fully surveying a system means I never even get started leveling up surveying cause I've got 2 things I'd rather do with 6 points than that 1. And then there's the problem that even if I do level up to get full survey capability, the current system (with accidents only happening sometimes, and only taking a little machinery (and also crew)) encourages me to try to purchase & bring along as little machinery as I thing I can get away with, since derelicts & salvaging means I'm probably gonna wind up maxed out on cargo capacity (darn scrap metal, if level 2 of salvaging enabled scrap metal salvage & 3 boosted the quanity up to full, current numbers I'd be happy to never level salvage past 1 lol) no matter what I do even without surveying.

I think, if the system was that surveying a planet more hazardous than your survey skill allows is guaranteed to have accidents, so a player that's only willing to sink two points into getting survey level one would be able attempt to fully survey an entire system at the expense of guaranteed accidents on planets their surveying isn't up to snuff on, it would encourage players to conduct surveying runs by metering out a decent quantity of supplies, stocking up on crew and filling their hold out with machinery and going out and surveying systems until they run out of machinery to lose, and maybe trying to salvage machinery from derelicts they find after they've run out. I think maybe that'd fit better with the "you aren't supposed to have to return to re-survey something" design doctrine, and would allow players to reasonably interact with the mechanic without having to spend 6 skill points on it. And, guessing a planet might be valuable & surveying it with guaranteed losses on a hunch and coming away with a valueable survey chart worth way more than the machinery you lost getting it would be cool and make me feel like a badass frontier prospector. And also would probably work better for players to pick cool planets they wanna do stuff with once the industry update drops & enables outposts, without needing to be gatelocked behind an arbitrary amount of the survey skill
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Megas

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #311 on: May 16, 2017, 02:09:46 PM »

Quote
No, I think it basically always says "sizeable fleet". If I'm honest I agree that there needs to be some more information: maybe what the bounty's flagship is or something.
That would be nice.  I would hate to drive all the way out somewhere only to find out my fleet is not strong enough to kill the fleet because one of the ships is too powerful.
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tinsoldier

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #312 on: May 16, 2017, 02:17:40 PM »

Quote
No, I think it basically always says "sizeable fleet". If I'm honest I agree that there needs to be some more information: maybe what the bounty's flagship is or something.
That would be nice.  I would hate to drive all the way out somewhere only to find out my fleet is not strong enough to kill the fleet because one of the ships is too powerful.

The bounty fleets start off pretty anemic and they only increase in size as you complete bounties.  If you haven't been doing bounties for most of the game then your late-game fleet will severely over power any and all bounties until you complete a dozen or so (possibly at a loss in terms of time and fuel).  It'd be nice if there was always a mix of bounties (big and small).  However, that would necessitate the player having clarity into what they're going after or else the issue you've raised would plague players.


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Megas

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #313 on: May 16, 2017, 03:51:46 PM »

I know.  Knowing what the flagship is would be nice for something like midgame when I can handle cruisers, then the next bounty features the first capital, and that is a big spike in difficulty (if it is something like Astral, Paragon, or Onslaught) if I do not have a capital of my own.
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2_Wycked

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Re: .8 feedback thread
« Reply #314 on: May 16, 2017, 04:00:20 PM »

Quote
No, I think it basically always says "sizeable fleet". If I'm honest I agree that there needs to be some more information: maybe what the bounty's flagship is or something.
That would be nice.  I would hate to drive all the way out somewhere only to find out my fleet is not strong enough to kill the fleet because one of the ships is too powerful.

The bounty fleets start off pretty anemic and they only increase in size as you complete bounties.  If you haven't been doing bounties for most of the game then your late-game fleet will severely over power any and all bounties until you complete a dozen or so (possibly at a loss in terms of time and fuel).  It'd be nice if there was always a mix of bounties (big and small).  However, that would necessitate the player having clarity into what they're going after or else the issue you've raised would plague players.

Hmm, did not know that. Thanks!
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