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[TJJ]

There are so many good Frigates.... but the Vigilance just isn't one of them.
Either in the hands of the player, or AI, I've always found this ship thoroughly underwhelming.

Though I haven't yet thought about any specific improvements that'd help it out; anyone else agree? have any ideas?

[Linnis]

Long profile with low maneuverability + bad shield coverage and speed. Ewww

It just needs better shields so its not just "pilum spam" tier because it will be actually usable in medium range engagements. IE always getting hit in the butt then spinning out of control into a quick death.

[Toxcity]

I'm pretty sure it should be used in the same capacity as a Kite or Shepherd, i.e. supposed to be used in support of a combat ship.

[AxleMC131]

Ehhh... I'm not convinced with these replies. The Vigilance isn't desireable as a support ship in the Campaign, but in my opinion the shields, speed and agility are not the reason. It's supposed to be a fire support vessel to escort larger ships; cruisers or capitals, but even then it has issues I think should be solved.


These are the main issues I think the Vigilance has that need to be re-balanced, and why:

1) Maintenance Cost: This thing is as resource intensive as a Wolf, for arguably a much simpler hull and smaller crew complement. Yes, it's got two medium mounts, but I always think the big reason the Wolf's supply usage is as high as it is is due to the Phase Skimmer, which must be tough to maintain - the phase ships certainly are. Personally I'd drop the Vigilance's monthly supply usage down to 4 - on a par with the Lasher and the Cerberus.

2) Deployment cost in combat: For similar reasons as above. It's a support ship - why is it so expensive to deploy in combat? I found myself preferring a Hound armed with a front shield, Heavy Machine Gun and Vulcan cannon in the campaign because it only costs 3 DP.

3) Hull integrity: The Vigilance only has 1000 hull points. Why? It really needs more. Just because it's not a brawler doesn't mean it has to have a paper-thin hull. I'd bump this up to 1500, on a par with the Wolf (as the armour rating of 150 already is).

4) Peak combat performance duration: For the Vigilance, 240 seconds (4 minutes). Again, as a support ship which will ideally be assisting larger vessels, this should be bumped up as well. Had a look at Starsector's other "Support Frigate" the Monitor and noticed that it's peak performance time is 360 seconds (6 minutes)! I'd push up the Vigilance's to nearer this, maybe 300 seconds.


Also, just to clarify, I have zero gripes about the Vigilance regarding:
- Narrow shield arc
- Slow speed
- Flux handling
- Campaign cost
These all seem fair enough to me.

[Toxcity]

I agree about the Maintenance and Deployment Cost. Hull integrity is mostly irrelevant as if the Vigilance is in a bad situation it's most likely dead anyway.

Peak performance isn't much of an issue either. The Monitor is more of an outlier in terms of peak performance for frigates. The other support ships such as Omen, Kite, and Centurion all have peak times of 240 or less. The only reason the Monitor has that long of a peak time is b/c it is an extremely defensive ship.

[AxleMC131]

Peak performance isn't much of an issue either. The Monitor is more of an outlier in terms of peak performance for frigates. The other support ships such as Omen, Kite, and Centurion all have peak times of 240 or less. The only reason the Monitor has that long of a peak time is b/c it is an extremely defensive ship.

Yeah, but you have to remember that the Omen and Kite tend to be support for smaller ships which have low peak performance themselves. The Monitor is highly specialized (and, yes, defensive), and the Vigilance is designed to support larger classes of ship - by rule, it should be able to stick in combat almost as long as a destroyer or light cruiser.

[Toxcity]

The Vigilance isn't explicitely designed to protect larger ships. You can equip it for high alpha strikes, escort, or support. If it is needed for longer engagements, hardened subsystems would be more than enough.

[AxleMC131]

The Vigilance isn't explicitely designed to protect larger ships. You can equip it for high alpha strikes, escort, or support. If it is needed for longer engagements, hardened subsystems would be more than enough.

Maybe. But performance time isn't my biggest problem with it. That would have to be the maintenance cost when compared with other vessels.

[Toxcity]

I agree that the maintenance cost is to high. Would be fine at 4 supplies like the lasher or brawler.

[Linnis]

The vigilance does not lack firepower. When there are destroyers and cruisers running about ships like lashers and wolfs become just a harass role. If they go in and attack with their weapons its because the target is allready losing and they just help to kill a bit faster in a allready won match up. (But any other ship even fighters can operate in this harass role)

While the vigilance can do reliable damage and harass with its medium energy over time, and the medium missile does bring some bit more stuff to the fight. Its not a ship that will shine in small fleet combat, its meant to be used as a reliable fleet support.

While its firepower on paper is limited, but in alot of situations it will do more damage then most other frigates. Simply because it can shoot without being in too much danger.

As for the OP cost, for bringing in a medium missile, and a medium energy weapon that both can reach long ranges is quite good. I dont know about throwing hounds or lashers into large battles, they usually do not do anything before they promptly get blown up by larger ships.

Personally in late-game the only frigate I use in combat are Vigilance or maybe a phase frigate.

[Sy]

The Vigilance isn't desireable as a support ship in the Campaign

try Ion Beam + Salamander Pod. it's pretty good at being a pain in the butt of your enemies.

would be nice if it wasn't so limited to a few specific loadouts to be effective though, most other frigates aren't.

also, i hope we'll actually get a good well-rounded/assault midline frigate one day. like Vigilance, Brawler and Cerberus both have their uses, but they're also more specialized for a specific niche than something like Lasher, Wolf, Tempest, Scarab, etc.

[Wyvern]

Once upon a time, when you could get the Vigilance as your starting frigate, it came with a variant that included a pulse laser, a pilum LRM launcher, and 15 flux vents.

That variant was surprisingly functional in the early game, and I'd love to see it back.  But you really did need the 15 vents - the pulse laser is a bit of a flux hog.

[Megas]

Vigilance is a frigate-sized missile boat.  It will underperform if used as a general-purpose brawler.  General-purpose brawlers are the most powerful or versatile kind of ships in the game, and specialist ships will not be as useful in smaller fleets.  As for Vigilance, since there are nothing like Pilums for small missile mounts, it makes sense to use it as a Pilum boat, which it, as part of a group of multiple missile boats, is very good at doing.

Midline does not have any good general-purpose brawling frigates like Lasher or Wolf.  The closest it has is Brawler, which has no PD and front shields only, and very vulnerable to missiles.  Centurion is just a watered down Monitor at best or a fat and hungry civilian shuttle disguised as a warship at worst; those fire arcs need to be fixed!

[TJJ]

Vigilance is a frigate-sized missile boat.

And there in lies the problem IMO.

The Vigilance's fleet cost, maintenance cost, and deployment cost to bring a single Pilum mount to the fight is prohibitively expensive.

[ArkAngel]

I find the vigilance to be a good support frigate unless you mass them. In which case... Allll the pilums!