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Starsector 0.97a is out! (02/02/24); New blog post: Simulator Enhancements (03/13/24)

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Author Topic: Starsector 0.8a (Released) Patch Notes  (Read 639251 times)

Thaago

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #525 on: March 29, 2017, 02:20:17 PM »

Re: Sabots
The problems with previous shotgun Sabot were individually weak shots.  All the ship needed to do was drop shields and the fragments would hit for insignificant damage.  The AI was aware of that and always dropped shields to eat the hits.  At that point, the only use for Sabot was to force the AI to drop shield so that high-tech ship can blast enemies with blasters.  The only ships that would take damage on the shield would be those piloted by inexperienced players.

uhhh, isn't that the point of sabots? I thought the problem with the current-build sabots is that dropping shields against sabots, even if the enemy fires nothing else, is itself a death sentence?

I think it was too extreme for a limited ammo missile - flickering the shield off meant a couple of shots got through, but really not much. At least with (hopefully hefty) EMP, it will at worst case make the ship stop pounding your own.
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Remmon

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #526 on: March 29, 2017, 02:50:55 PM »

Exactly. Sabots started out as too weak. Flicker the shield, take some minor damage from the kinetics. If the enemy is set up just right, they might be able to put some more damage through before your shields come back up, but not much. So Sabots turned into a single shot. Now dropping your shields meant taking a butt load of damage in addition to the possibility of more from well timed enemy shots.

So we're going to something in between. Sabots spread out to make them harder to dodge completely, reduce damage if you drop shields by quite a lot, but now you get the EMP effects thrown on top of that damage to make things worse. Dropping your shields will mean your frontal armament is liable to take an EMP hit and shut down for a while.
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orost

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #527 on: March 29, 2017, 03:45:20 PM »

Hopefully the skill revamp also makes EMP more relevant. I haven't played in a while but I remember disabled weapons being practically irrelevant at high skill levels because they come back online in a second or two.
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Megas

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #528 on: March 29, 2017, 03:54:37 PM »

Yes, EMP is generally useless against the strongest endgame opponents because they either have high EMP damage reduction and/or faster repair times, just like you.  My flagship could not care less about EMP because it did not do much most of the time, and if it did, stuff would be repaired in a second or two.  Endgame fleets had similarly buffed ships.
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Thaago

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #529 on: March 29, 2017, 04:36:19 PM »

Hopefully the skill revamp also makes EMP more relevant. I haven't played in a while but I remember disabled weapons being practically irrelevant at high skill levels because they come back online in a second or two.

I also agree - I hope EMP resistance becomes harder to get.
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Dri

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #530 on: March 29, 2017, 06:14:38 PM »

Well, lets all bear in mind that EMP is basically Starsectors version of CC (crowd control) found in MMOs. It's all fun and games when you're the one stunning/fearing/rooting the enemy but when it gets turned on you, and you're the one spending your time helplessly staring at your screen in a rage...it ain't fun.

Spending every other battle watching your flagship (or one of your officer's ships) spinning around in a circle due to engine flameouts and with half your weapons disabled to boot ain't fun! EMP should be something that isn't a core part of a battle, imo.
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Toxcity

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #531 on: March 29, 2017, 06:26:14 PM »

Reducing skills that resist EMP and increase subsystem repair is fine. EMP is a component of high-tech weaponry - especially of high-tech assault variants - and should be threatening.

It's not like EMP has no counter play. Shields are the most obvious, but there's also hull mods that reduce its effects such as Automated Repair Unit or Resistant Flux Conduits. You can also kill the ship that has EMP. Take the Omen for example, a Lasher outfitted with railguns can easily keep it at bay. The Claw interceptors in 0.8 also have ion cannons, but will probably be easy prey for beam frigates.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 06:31:36 PM by Toxcity »
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TheEndstoneGolem

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #532 on: March 30, 2017, 12:34:15 AM »

The way Alex has worded it doesn't make sense (no offence).
KEPs being worse at penetrating armour doesn't make sense either, but hey, it's a game. Besides creating new mechanic to achieve the same effect is pointless.

I personally disagree with this. Alex has quoted many times that it's a moot point since we can just explain it in a way that works for this game, which is perfectly fine (I think it's really interesting to hear other people's ideas!).

If ships DONT have reactive armour, but instead have solid plate armour with ceramics built in, KEPs would be bad at penetrating, as ceramics would just break them up. Remember HE can refer to anything, in this case we could assume that all HE weapons fire shaped charge rounds, which would be very good at penetrating solid plate/ceramic armour.

I think this is an interesting one to discuss, so I'll start a topic called "Starsector's armour model" in General Discussion. Join me there and we can figure out one that works with the existing weapon types. :D
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Cycerin

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #533 on: March 30, 2017, 06:25:01 AM »

The point of sabots isnt that they are kinetic missiles, the point of sabots is that they largely ignore point defense. That's what they have to be designed around. If fired correctly (eg. from max range) sabots can only be shot down by pd ai tac lasers, lr pd lasers and guardians, or the rare case of adv. optics burst lasers on a capital or cruiser.

This, coupled with their incredible kill power in their previous iteration, is why they had to change so they cannot just mow down a ship on their own. Sabots now have the excellent role of opening a ship up to fighter or missile attacks since a lot of the ship's PD will be offline after tanking some sabots. Best of all, if you really loathe sabots you can invest in anti-EMP hullmods, armored weapon mounts and stuff like that.
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Dri

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #534 on: March 30, 2017, 04:04:07 PM »

Hey, do weapons on a fighter generate flux? I seem to recall mention that they no longer would be in 0.8.
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Wyvern

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #535 on: March 30, 2017, 04:36:00 PM »

Hey, do weapons on a fighter generate flux? I seem to recall mention that they no longer would be in 0.8.
There was a mention of a built-in hull mod that was used to make weapons on shielded fighters no longer generate flux.  There was also mention of flux stats limiting fire rate on... I think it was broadswords, making them less of a buzz-saw against shields?
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Dri

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #536 on: March 30, 2017, 05:41:49 PM »

Heh, I hope they don't cost flux! I remember when the Phase Beam became the Lance and those poor Xyphos didn't have the flux capacity to fire one all that well, lol
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Midnight Kitsune

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #537 on: March 30, 2017, 06:51:16 PM »

Heh, I hope they don't cost flux! I remember when the Phase Beam became the Lance and those poor Xyphos didn't have the flux capacity to fire one all that well, lol
Well don't forget, Alex also put Tachyon Lances on Wasps
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facc00

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #538 on: March 30, 2017, 08:47:04 PM »

Any news on a new release its been some time.  Almost six months?
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Alex

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Re: Starsector 0.8a (In Development) Patch Notes
« Reply #539 on: March 30, 2017, 08:52:21 PM »

Very soontm. Wrapping things up, basically - major features are all done. Right now about halfway through adding a proper campaign tutorial, then it's a bit more playtesting and balancing/polish, and a few modding things, and it should be good. So - however long that all takes.
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