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Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Personal Contacts (08/13/20)

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Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a  (Read 483665 times)

Maeleth

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1200 on: June 05, 2020, 01:18:08 AM »

Hello there!

I'd like to ask a few questions regarding ship balancing&behavior.

1) Imp frigate absolutely loves hugging other ships (at around 150-200 distance), regardless of officer type/doctrine or weapon range. Is this intended (due to its built-in mod)?
2) IMO Dard is extremely overpowered for its cost in space bucks and OP. It performs slightly worse than a Spark while being mass-produced and readily available in every backwater colony. Maybe a slight nerf in mobility/number per wing/OP?
3) Chamois seems out of place when compared to Salvage Rig, at every stage of the game. This ship is too slow both in and out of combat (8 base burn without civ hull is especially painful), cannot protect itself in any reasonable way due to horrible flux and shield, has probably the absolute worst CR per deployment/CR recovery stats (30%/2% per day), a-and x2 maintenance cost/x3 skeleton crew vs Salv Rig. I cannot even imagine a reason to buy this vessel. Any thoughts?
4) Kobra mk.3 and Vesper are too strong for their relative price (again, both in spacecoins and DP). They combine high speed, decent firepower, over-the-top survivability for non-specialized vessel, huge variety of effective loadouts and low maintenance profile. How about a light touch of nerfhammer?
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1201 on: June 05, 2020, 02:45:50 PM »

1) Imp frigate absolutely loves hugging other ships (at around 150-200 distance), regardless of officer type/doctrine or weapon range. Is this intended (due to its built-in mod)?
Imps are basically suicide drones and that's not changing (I did beef up their armor, remove their shield, etc - they're meant to suck a lot), the ones you can recover are intended to be ablative wingmen early on. NPC Blade Breakers are going to get another frigate to really capitalize on the distraction potential of the Imp-swarm.

2) IMO Dard is extremely overpowered for its cost in space bucks and OP. It performs slightly worse than a Spark while being mass-produced and readily available in every backwater colony. Maybe a slight nerf in mobility/number per wing/OP?
Trimming has commenced, yeah. It's the main weapon that's the issue, so I'm working on flux-throttling it a bit to make it less effective and considering alternate armaments. I may end up just giving it a continuous beam or more reasonable, non-charge-based pulsed beam. Flux stats vs. weapon stats need to be rearranged.

3) Chamois seems out of place when compared to Salvage Rig, at every stage of the game. This ship is too slow both in and out of combat (8 base burn without civ hull is especially painful), cannot protect itself in any reasonable way due to horrible flux and shield, has probably the absolute worst CR per deployment/CR recovery stats (30%/2% per day), a-and x2 maintenance cost/x3 skeleton crew vs Salv Rig. I cannot even imagine a reason to buy this vessel. Any thoughts?
It's got substantial Nex mining power, that's about it. It's capable of some modest self-defense early-on, but yeah, if it's not included in a Nex start, etc. it shouldn't be on your shopping list.

4) Kobra mk.3 and Vesper are too strong for their relative price (again, both in spacecoins and DP). They combine high speed, decent firepower, over-the-top survivability for non-specialized vessel, huge variety of effective loadouts and low maintenance profile. How about a light touch of nerfhammer?
I've bumped up both in DP and price a bit for the next patch.
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Chikanuk

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1202 on: June 10, 2020, 10:20:28 AM »

Hello, so far i really like this mod, but right now im defeat Superdrednought and get... Nothing! I mean i got regular supplies+metals+fuel and 2 regular weapons, but this is "salvage 1 cruiser" drop. No unique items, no blueprints, not even an AI Core.
What the point in defeating him? Well, he spawn fleets like station, right? But even stations, both pirate and remnants have much, much better drop. This is not a big deal, but it seems like lost opportunity - Literally boss fight with zero gain (not even some lore text after win as prise). And in my case it not even worth it - i manage to kill him pretty easy, but system dont have any value in planets, so its better to keep him produce fleets, so i can farm them.
So its only me unlucky\have some mod conflict, or he intended to drop nothing important?


P.S. Sorry for poor english.
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1203 on: June 10, 2020, 05:46:31 PM »

Well, I've reset the weapons to drop for the next release, so those should be available.

Beyond that, yes, I'd like to do something, but of the ideas on my plate, nothing has really jumped out at me...
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FoxtrotSierra117

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1204 on: June 22, 2020, 08:15:32 PM »

Greetings!

Absolutely loving the mod, especially the Deserter Nexerelin start, and I was wondering if you wouldn't mind answering a few questions I had:

1) Is there any chance for the Deserters to get dedicated fuel ships build onto the Large and Small Supply templates, as well as a potential salvage/mining version of the Reef?

2) Are there any plans to increase the amount of SNRI Labs products?

Thanks again for making this mod! (also, your comments on the_deserter.json Nex config made my day)
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1205 on: June 22, 2020, 08:27:47 PM »

Glad you like it.

1) Is there any chance for the Deserters to get dedicated fuel ships build onto the Large and Small Supply templates, as well as a potential salvage/mining version of the Reef?
The supply ships already have substantial, integrated fuel capacity; the whole concept behind them is that instead of having separate, dedicated fuel and cargo ships, you have all-around 'logistics' ships with a hullmod that tempts you to risk them in combat for the mobility boost. So, not really in line with their design intent; I might consider it for the smaller one just to give it a bit more late-game utility, though.

A salvage Reef, hunh? I've thought about something similar (more likely a separate hull; roughly that size, a compact explorer/salvager with some combat ability), but until/unless I come up with a really compelling idea for it, unlikely. I'm trying to hold back on new ships, and I don't want to create any new ones until I have a better idea of how they might interact with new features. And I want Deserters to play a bit differently from a normal faction; not every function is replicated at each hull size, or at all, so you'll find yourself with odd fleet compositions in a strict Deserter playthrough.

I do want them to have exploration options, though. So I'll think about it - it might be a reason to redesign something to accommodate new visuals for more modularity.

2) Are there any plans to increase the amount of SNRI Labs products?
Sort of/yes. Right now in the dev version I've applied that label to a bunch of stuff that's meant to be linked to missions at some point (do this mission, get this blueprint for a unique weapon and about 2-5 of them to test out). But probably not much more actual content in the sense of new ships and weaponry.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2020, 10:33:55 AM by Harmful Mechanic »
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FoxtrotSierra117

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1206 on: June 22, 2020, 09:18:43 PM »

I simply chose the Reef due to its dimensions and for its decent fighter complement. Also, it seemed the best choice given its aesthetics and use case, sharing some similarities with Mora and the subsequent salvage variant Foundation from the mod Stop Gap Measure.

Also, thanks for the quick reply.
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EatLikeAnOuroboros

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1207 on: June 26, 2020, 05:55:36 AM »

Where do I find the blade breaker homeworld? I've blown up everything around Lenze and yet I haven't found neither their home or a single BP
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Deageon

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1208 on: June 28, 2020, 11:11:54 PM »

Where do I find the blade breaker homeworld? I've blown up everything around Lenze and yet I haven't found neither their home or a single BP
Spoiler
check the outermost ring, if i remember correctly, there should be a hidden station with two BPs in it for DESERTER-variant ships. not the true blade breaker sihps. prototypes.
[close]
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truecore

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1209 on: July 14, 2020, 12:44:10 PM »

Hello, first off just want to say I love your mod, the style of the ships is great and really gives me a Earth "space force" feel. I have a lot of faction and ship pack mods plugged in, though, and I wanted a better chance to find the capitals among hundreds of potential bps, so I went and made a custom blueprint package called "istl_dmecapital_package" with similar rarity and value as the deserter package, gave it order 224, included the 2 DME capitals and the weapons not included in the other blueprints, and tried spawning it in game. Initially, I received a "sigma matter" item. I renamed the blueprint to just "dmecapital_package" and was able to spawn it in successfully.

While testing the new bp package, I tried spawning the others and also received sigma_matter_all for several of the packages, even after renaming the new capital blueprint. Figuring I messed up the mod, I went and deleted the mod and reinstalled it. On the fresh 1.18a, I'm still only able to spawn istl_dmecore_package, istl_dmeadv_package, and istl_bladewood_package. The 6th bureau, civil, ballistic, energy, deserter, missile, and refit packages all give me sigma matter (actually, the bureau package gave me "secure data" commodity and I believe missile gave me "sigma matter 2")

The strange part is, I renamed all the blueprint packages that weren't working by removing "istl_" (except deserter package, because that package successfully spawns with the deserter start on nexerelin anyways) and I'm now able to spawn them in with console commands.

My question is...has renaming these to allow them to spawn via console broken anything else anywhere in the mod? And is there any reason for this problem in the first place?
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1210 on: July 14, 2020, 12:51:44 PM »

Hello, first off just want to say I love your mod, the style of the ships is great and really gives me a Earth "space force" feel.
Thanks. I'm working on an update, it's just a lot of backed-up balance fixes and some new/replacement content that's taking a good long time to come together.

I have a lot of faction and ship pack mods plugged in, though, and I wanted a better chance to find the capitals among hundreds of potential bps, so I went and made a custom blueprint package called "istl_dmecapital_package" with similar rarity and value as the deserter package, gave it order 224, included the 2 DME capitals and the weapons not included in the other blueprints, and tried spawning it in game. Initially, I received a "sigma matter" item. I renamed the blueprint to just "dmecapital_package" and was able to spawn it in successfully.

While testing the new bp package, I tried spawning the others and also received sigma_matter_all for several of the packages, even after renaming the new capital blueprint. Figuring I messed up the mod, I went and deleted the mod and reinstalled it. On the fresh 1.18a, I'm still only able to spawn istl_dmecore_package, istl_dmeadv_package, and istl_bladewood_package. The 6th bureau, civil, ballistic, energy, deserter, missile, and refit packages all give me sigma matter (actually, the bureau package gave me "secure data" commodity and I believe missile gave me "sigma matter 2")

The strange part is, I renamed all the blueprint packages that weren't working by removing "istl_" (except deserter package, because that package successfully spawns with the deserter start on nexerelin anyways) and I'm now able to spawn them in with console commands.
That's strange. It shouldn't matter whether the prefix is present or not in the ID, unless you did something odd with another ID somewhere.

My question is...has renaming these to allow them to spawn via console broken anything else anywhere in the mod?
It probably has, but I can't tell you offhand. I'd need access to your files to tell you what's going wrong with your implementation.

And is there any reason for this problem in the first place?
I have no idea without seeing what you did. It's really weird, from what you describe, and I can't think of a reason why it would do that from the information given.
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truecore

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1211 on: July 14, 2020, 01:38:06 PM »

Thanks. I'm working on an update, it's just a lot of backed-up balance fixes and some new/replacement content that's taking a good long time to come together.
Well, I'd just like to plug in a request for a centerline turret-focused DME battleship somewhere down the road. The Zelenograd seems a lot like an up-scaled Apogee, but better, which also makes it feel less like a warship. A missile battlecruiser, like a space Kirov, would be interesting.

Also, I'd be curious to know if it's possible to add a new Outpost "industry" for the DME outposts as an alternative to the high-tech, midline, and what not. My last Nexerelin playthrough, I was governing a DME colony and found it only slightly immersion breaking that I had to build a high-tech outpost rather than the DME one.

That's strange. It shouldn't matter whether the prefix is present or not in the ID, unless you did something odd with another ID somewhere.
No, on the fresh install I had not changed any of the fields except removing "istl_" from a couple bp packages on the special_items.xls. From my limited understanding of modding, I also can't figure why a prefix would cause problems with console commands, because other mods like vayra's aren't having similar issues for me, and its not even an issue for all of the DME bp packages. Anyways, off the bat, I can say that the faction is still spawning its ships just fine, the only thing I can think that might have broken is the items might not drop on exploration. I don't know that that is tied to the ID fields though.

Anyways, if it's not an issue on your end, then I'll consider it a personal fix for a rare issue for now and just mention that it happened in case anyone else has a similar issue~ Cheers and thanks for the great mod and being responsive!
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1212 on: July 14, 2020, 01:45:47 PM »

Thanks. I'm working on an update, it's just a lot of backed-up balance fixes and some new/replacement content that's taking a good long time to come together.
Well, I'd just like to plug in a request for a centerline turret-focused DME battleship somewhere down the road. The Zelenograd seems a lot like an up-scaled Apogee, but better, which also makes it feel less like a warship. A missile battlecruiser, like a space Kirov, would be interesting.
Without spoiling too much; something a bit like this is in the pipe as a mission reward. Whether it ends up being missile-focused is still an open question, but it's not a centerline turret design. More like an angry tuning fork.

Also, I'd be curious to know if it's possible to add a new Outpost "industry" for the DME outposts as an alternative to the high-tech, midline, and what not. My last Nexerelin playthrough, I was governing a DME colony and found it only slightly immersion breaking that I had to build a high-tech outpost rather than the DME one.
The bottleneck is that stations take a long time to design and test. I'd like to have one, and I have sketches, but it's going to take a little bit to get it together. Unless lighting strikes, probably an update all by itself, after the current one.

Cheers and thanks for the great mod and being responsive!
I do my best - lunch-ish is a good time for me to check the forum.
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Aposkus

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1213 on: July 16, 2020, 01:31:08 AM »

Hello,
This mod has been a great addition to my current mod-list, and I am grateful for the work you have put in it. The sprites look very nice, and I like the ship's aesthetics.
However I wanted to ask a question: when can we expect usefulness for the sigma matter, and use for superdreadnoughts, because as I saw before on the forum currently they posses no reward compared to any station etc.
Furthermore, I noticed that the blade breakers research, training, and mining facilities give away less resources in comparison to normal abandoned stations. Maybe add scalable stations(small medium large- the classic stuff) of those stations, thus increasing the reward for visiting high threat blade breakers systems, since currently the reward for clearing it out is sometimes smaller than from a [REDACTED] Medium level threat system.
And once again, thank you for your effort on this mod, it has been a blast.
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a
« Reply #1214 on: July 16, 2020, 10:35:06 AM »

Hello,
This mod has been a great addition to my current mod-list, and I am grateful for the work you have put in it. The sprites look very nice, and I like the ship's aesthetics.
Thanks, glad you like it.

However I wanted to ask a question: when can we expect usefulness for the sigma matter, and use for superdreadnoughts, because as I saw before on the forum currently they posses no reward compared to any station etc.
It may have to wait for missions. I pick at it periodically, though. Right now, I'm working on scripting to ensure that Breaker weaponry only drops from combat encounters, so once that's in, those fights will get a lot more lucrative for the player.

Furthermore, I noticed that the blade breakers research, training, and mining facilities give away less resources in comparison to normal abandoned stations. Maybe add scalable stations(small medium large- the classic stuff) of those stations, thus increasing the reward for visiting high threat blade breakers systems, since currently the reward for clearing it out is sometimes smaller than from a [REDACTED] Medium level threat system.
I'm working on some of that - I'm not going to add more station types, but things are getting fiddled around to make them, if not more rewarding, then make more sense.

Ultimately, the whole point of Blade Breaker stuff is to provide a more punishing endgame fight for players; so I think of the reward not so much as material gains from fighting as interesting fighting itself.
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