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Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.1.18a  (Read 542318 times)

pairedeciseaux

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #630 on: February 12, 2019, 02:52:26 PM »

Against the annoying Wolf:
- a Star Sylph with an effective loadout and its "jumps" ready to use when the Wolf tries to retreat
- as suggest by solardawning: fighters! also lookup Tereskova as carrier / general purpose destroyer, easy to find last I remember

Loadout and flux war discussion:
- maybe post full loadout of some of your ship so people here can review them  :)
- beware beams on your small ships : in flux-challenging situations, beam can be ineffective or even counter-productive, they are OK on dedicated long range support ship and dedicated carrier if your fleet gets bigger - but not that good on hunter killer type small ship (in my opinion, generally speaking)
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ThePollie

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #631 on: February 12, 2019, 02:57:10 PM »

Oh, I tried counter-blinking. It didn't really work. I blink, he blinks. I blink again, he blinks again. I'm out of blinks, and he does so again and isn't even in range of missiles anymore. Wolfs are just a pain in the ass to deal with.
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pairedeciseaux

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #632 on: February 12, 2019, 03:05:21 PM »

Well, getting in range to shoot missiles is one thing, but staying in range to fire that medium energy weapon and (IIRC) small ballistics in the back could be a better approach.  :P
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ThePollie

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #633 on: February 12, 2019, 03:09:05 PM »

Getting in range, I can do that. Problem is the AI always wants to drive backwards for the entire fight. Only way I can convince them to go forward is if I'm drastically outnumbered or about to overcharge. Throw in SO and jumping, and I get a lotta fights where I spend all my time chasing an opponent that simply refuses to engage, but also doesn't want to retreat. I've had fights be decided by who's combat readiness lasts longer, and have started using hardened subsystems to exploit that.
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Vensalir

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #634 on: February 12, 2019, 03:09:23 PM »

I'm not a terribly experienced player, but I feel that the best counter to the Wolf are high burst damage weapons, possibly with very fast projectiles. The Antimatter blaster and Omni blaster are very effective at this. Heavy blasters are possibly even better.

DME also has a medium sized heavy laser that packs a huge wallop and has zero travel time, that works really well for me. Just bait them it, take the damage and then smack them in the face. They will either overload or get a ton of damage.
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pairedeciseaux

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #635 on: February 12, 2019, 03:16:09 PM »

Yep, and DME also has the Light Rail Accelerator small ballistic weapon that can help to overload and damage fast moving targets (including Wolf and even fighters).
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ThePollie

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #636 on: February 12, 2019, 03:21:27 PM »

Now if only I could find any of these in a store, I'd try to make use of them. I can find plenty of tiny PD lasers, though.
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Vensalir

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #637 on: February 12, 2019, 03:59:59 PM »

You can find them in DME black markets. They're not terribly common, but they do pop up every now and then. If you stick around their systems you're bound to find them eventually. Or you can get a commission with them and get access to even more goodies.
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ThePollie

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #638 on: February 12, 2019, 04:03:57 PM »

Yeah, I tried that. All three markets, nothing for months and months.

Reminds me of old school days, trying to trick out my Hammerhead and running it with hammer torpedoes and massed machineguns. Does make for some crazy loadouts, but I'd like to try some of this other stuff.

Do Star Sylphs spawn in shops? I've never seen another one, either.
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Wyvern

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #639 on: February 12, 2019, 04:15:36 PM »

I -think- I've seen a Star Sylph in SCY's Prism Freeport, but I won't swear to that; if they show up there at all, they're quite rare.  Generally the only one I end up with is the Blade Breaker modified version that you can find as a derelict in one of the sigma-distorted systems.
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ThePollie

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #640 on: February 12, 2019, 04:31:36 PM »

Well, I put an Omni Blaster on mine. In love with this gun. ASM their shields and then crack their ship in half with that doomsday cannon.


-

Well that was fun, then I warped into a zone, got Emergency Driven into by a fleet packed with SO frigates and was destroyed almost instantly.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 04:54:52 PM by ThePollie »
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solardawning

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #641 on: February 12, 2019, 05:24:59 PM »

I find this conversation kind of interesting. We must play very differently; I've always found enemy ships with SO to be extremely easy, and generally have assumed that it's intentional. They're very restricted on OP due to the huge cost of SO, do not play intelligently like a player can when controlling one, and have weapon range stuck at 450 units, which is like bringing a knife to a gunfight. They usually can't get within firing range of a cruiser without already having their shields overloading!

If I had to crack a guess as to what's different, though... it sounds like you play with frigates. I never do. I hardly even ever use destroyers past the immediate start of a game and a few delivery missions for credits.

I think that widely, in vanilla as well as modded Starsector, frigates just aren't very feasable for the player to use. Using more smaller ships means you are going to lose them. Frigates are there like 'trash mobs' in an MMO, so that the player has a type of ship they can have thrown at them constantly in large number that are easy and satisfying to blow up.

Range advantage is king, and bigger ships get more range from Integrated Targeting Unit. After range, it's the amount of flux efficient damage you can bring to bear to pop targets, and the size of your flux pool multiplied by the efficiency of your shielding.

When in doubt, you can also add Converted Hangar to all of your destroyers and cruisers that aren't naturally carriers, and give them a cheap fighter. Ones that are naturally reasonably fast work best. Spirales work out well because of their Skipjet Injector, but vanilla burst laser interceptors (Spark, I think they're called) that you can recover from the AI danger systems are also fantastic support for a fleet of big ships. Both can take down frigates on their own in sufficient number, so they're the answer to small ships that try to stay out of your weapons range.
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ThePollie

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #642 on: February 12, 2019, 05:56:24 PM »

Yeah, I play with Frigates, in the early game at least.

The problem isn't really killing a SO ship, the problem is escaping one when I can't. DME ships aren't durable enough to face tank, but that's exactly what you're forced to do if you can't out-pace the opposition. If I get jumped by a 220 speed SO'd frigate against my 160 Star Sylph, my only option is to dump flux and try to slag him with one salvo. If I fail that, I basically die while I vent in front of him. Even if I succeed, the second SO'd frigate behind him slags me while I vent.

Once I get carriers and additional frigates, it becomes a lot less of an issue. Early game? When it's just me and maybe a wingman? It's easy to get into unwinnable fights with no chance to avoid them and just get wiped then and there.
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Shad

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #643 on: February 16, 2019, 07:16:55 AM »

Is it just me, or did Blade Breaker fighter get a lot more expensive? I could not find it in the the changelog, but Firesprays at 18 OP, Lycosids at 12 OP etc? It seems a little much. As good as BB fighters are, waves on conventional DME fighters now feel better value.
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Harmful Mechanic

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Re: [0.9.0a] Dassault-Mikoyan Engineering v.0.9.9e
« Reply #644 on: February 16, 2019, 09:09:01 AM »

I upped some costs, yeah. It's part of a general push to make them more of a niche option than a straight upgrade. If you have relatively high OP, or a low bay count, they're a more attractive option. Some of this also has to do with AI/autofit balance and keeping NPC Blade Breaker fleets from being completely insane.

(I'm generally bad about remembering to note Blade Breaker stuff in changelogs, a relic of the days when they were in development but not implemented in any real player-facing context.)
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