Fractal Softworks Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Starsector 0.9.1a is out! (05/10/19); Blog post: Skills and Story Points (07/08/19)

Pages: 1 ... 19 20 [21] 22 23 ... 69

Author Topic: [0.9.1a] Diable Avionics 2.04 (2019/05/14)  (Read 448818 times)

Chronosfear

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 200
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #300 on: April 19, 2016, 08:47:08 AM »

Some Feedback ( based on a combat skilled character ) focusing on Diable for the first time.

I really loved you sprites since you mod started to shine here on the forums.
But i couldn't love them as I would like to.
I always thought : meh pd ( didn't notice PD-Missiles ;D ) and firing arcs.
Also all the ships seems to really turn slowly.
I think the error sits on a chair behind the screen ( the ships are long but narrow ) in which case I think, turning feels even slower.
But after playing aroung a while i got used to it.
 

So as I said, with SS+ I got a  deeper look on them.

Don't want to say anything about the ships ( Storm is the largest i've flown so far ) and they all perform well and are fun to fly ( when u get used to )

Weapons ( only the ones i've used )
!! Don't change anything cause of someones opinion  ::). Its just my humble feeling about it. Overall the faction is a great addition to the game and I love them !!

Small
Spoiler
Magicbox PD Missile
Just 3 Words : I love them !
Some more : And Diable needs them to cover their back on most ships.

Micro Missiles.
Great in Large numbers ( eg : Storm-class with 15 ( 8 of them build in ) equiped ) puts a lot of pressure to the enemy and get a real threat once you´re missile specced.

Banish Torpedo.
Strong Torpedo with a tendency to get shot down while turning/aiming. Still very reliable, fast and dangerous.

IBIS
Like the vulcan, feels a bit weaker though. ( But the stats tells a difference so i am proably wrong )

Recson S
Never used it. For me, it fires to slow to really be a threat for shields.

Burchel Beam Repeater
Very Strong PD, still feels somewhat weak for 7 OP. Not sure why.
[close]
Medium
Spoiler
State Support Beam
Lower range and more damage. Not my first choice for a support ship or as a support weapon like vanilla beams.
But I like to use them on my frigates vs. fighters and other frigates ( due to the higher damage )

Recson V
I really needed a weapon to build pressure on shields of cruiser and battleship  sized ships while still able to somewhat handle frigates, so i tried this one.
I honestly was a little disappointed. It´s a bit to inaccurate to my liking. 
The damage is impressive and can even be used to pierce armor but I noticed the AI sometimes dropping shield between my volleys  :D
in which case the damage bonus is "lost"
Flux cost is somewhat low. Which is a big +

Grave HMG
The slower firing and harder hitting assault chaingun. I like it.
The shots travel fast and the accuracy is high which makes this weapon decent against faster ships and fighters

Trifire Scatter-Cannon
My curently weapon of choice against shields ( and armor ) of larger targets.
Yes it fires Slower then the Recson V and builds more flux , but i still prefer this one over the Recson V

Thrush LRM System
Fills a nice niche as a support missile weapon against smaller targets.
The slower reloader and ammo capacity compared to the Pilum LRM makes this weapon weaker in longer engagements.
On short battles. The higher speed of the missiles makes up for that.

Finally BTW : ? Where is my medium micro missile launcher  ??? ^^ <- that could be my favorite
[close]
Large
Spoiler
Since I am lacking on ships with large mounts ( I´ve only got the SS+ Gulf which probably is a child of Diable ) I only used the Mostro Cannon Array.
My first thoughts were : Another Burst weapon ( 4 barrels burst and then wait for it )
But I used it, and what can I say : I'm in love . This descriptions fits very well : tear through armor at an alarming rate )

Movie of Gulf ( with SO ) with 2 of them
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Rc8aGxK21Q
[close]


Thank you very much for your time and efford for this astonishing mod.

Chronosfear




 













Logged
Be the change that you wish to see in the world.
My words are backed with nuclear weapons (Civ)
Gandhi

adimetro00

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 124
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #301 on: May 09, 2016, 04:33:38 AM »

Well, IMO the lore of the faction seems... simplistic. do you have any plans to fresh out the lore a bit to tie to vanilla a bit? Otherwise, awesome work on the ships and weapons! I especially like the transforming ship.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2016, 04:35:21 AM by adimetro00 »
Logged

Gorgonson

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 37
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #302 on: May 11, 2016, 08:15:11 PM »

I've just finished a Diable playthrough of Nexerelin - the entire sector is a deep, glorious maroon.
To honour my retiring captain, I'd like to give some feedback on how I felt about the Diable ships and weapons.

I began with a small combat fleet, comprised of a Calm, a Vapor, and a Draft.
The Calm performed exceptionally well.  I filled the 8 missile mounts with Micro Missile Launchers, which are incredible - not necessarily for their damage, but for how confusing they are to opponents.  The Vapor served quite well as a clean-up crew, and I love the versatility of the weapon slots.  The Draft, however, underperformed.  The Arcus Armor wasn't reliable, and was no substitute for a decent shield, not to mention it would occasionally glitch out and slide away from the prow of the Draft.  Despite these shortcomings, outfitting it with Micro Missile Launchers and ordering it to hang back proved a fair compromise.

Have I mentioned that I love Micro Missiles?

From there I upgraded to a Gust.  I lamented the reduction in Micro Missile potential, as I captained the Gust over the Calm.  I splurged on a Valiant Wanzer Wing, which was amazing for securing early objectives, before transitioning into an escorting role - I imagine that was the general idea there.
When I started facing nuts the Gust couldn't crack, I purchased a Haze.  Given the further reduction in Micro Missile slots, I fitted the Haze with Thunderbolts.  I was taking down capital ships with that thing!

Here I will digress for a moment - I love the aesthetic, and the placement of overlapping hardpoints was a great choice.  A Recson V over a Grave HMG looks so nice, and performs just as well.

Despite the potent nutcracking ability of the Haze, I began encountering fleets with increasing numbers of fighter wings and other small nuisances.  I had to fight fire with fire, and I happened across a Maelstrom.  Remember when I said that I love Micro Missiles?  I was in heaven - the sheer output of missiles made the opposing ships act absolutely stupid.  I went overboard, however, and fielded far too many offensive weapons.  After a humbling near-defeat, I embraced Diable's defensive missiles with open arms.  I love the Magicbox PD Missile - it's cute and effective.  My only gripe is that as Diable ships become more expensive and impressive, they are outfitted with comparatively fewer small missile slots.  I don't know if this is a Starsector limitation, but I found myself wishing those small hybrid slots were small missile slots instead.

After the Maelstrom, I sidegraded into a Storm - this allowed me to field additional Wanzers.  I have each one a shot, generally preferring to deploy Valiants, Ravens, and Frosts.  At this point in the game, I could zoom out so far that the missiles and fighters zooming around were almost indistinguishable.  I had to sit back and trust that the superior Diable Avionics Wanzers would deliver, and they did.  The swarming technique culminated in the takedown of a Paragon using only a Maelstrom and several fighter wings.  The poor thing couldn't cope with the sheer number of threats, however small they may be.

So I bought a Pandemonium.  My entire Diable career had been leading up to this point.  I had loved the missile, embraced the missile, and become the missile - and I was disappointed.  For the flagship of Diable Avionics to neglect the missile to such a degree made my soul weep.  Sure, it fielded large numbers of Wanzers to an absurd degree, but it just didn't have that level of missile-saturation that the Maelstrom did.  In addition to this, the previous lack of small missile hardpoint real-estate was compounded.  I had six small slots in which to field Swarmers and Magicboxes, leaving no room for Micro Missile Launchers.  I mean, I could annihilate a Paragon without being touched - thank you Uhlan Siege Laser - but it just wasn't the same without an innumerable horde of Micro Missiles re-enacting the moment of impregnation.

---

To summarise.  I had a great time with Diable, though I got the impression that the focus shifted from missiles to Wanzers at some point during development.  The ships reflect this, leaving the capital ship of the Diable as a combination of both the Maelstrom and the Storm, though without the cornerstone of Micro Missiles.  It seems the desired playstyle - due to the small shield arcs and mediocre flux dissipation - is for a long-range bombardment from the Pandemonium, supported by wave after wave of Wanzers.

The single simplest change I could propose to fill this hole, would be to introduce a medium-sized Micro Missile Launcher equivalent.  If I could install some sort of Micro Missile Battery in the many universal medium slots on the Pandemonium, I would be so happy.

When I have a tad more time, I will expand further on the weapons and ships, as well as the activated abilities.
All in all, thank you for giving me such a pleasant sector-conquering experience.

- G
« Last Edit: May 11, 2016, 08:19:33 PM by Gorgonson »
Logged

Tartiflette

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2787
  • Kickstarter is NOT a magic spring of free money!
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #303 on: May 12, 2016, 12:08:36 AM »

Hum, I haven't replied in a while, sorry for that. So thanks for the feedback everyone!

Chronosfear

Recson S: they don't have an impressive DPS sure, but their damage per shot is higher than any vanilla small weapon, making them a larger threat for lightly armored ships. They also tend to overload their target more easily since the flux isn't spread in a burst allowing the AI to lower its shield in time. It isn't as good as a Needler for forcing the shield down, but it will kill that pesky frigate sooner nonetheless.

Burchel: with their longer burst, they aren't quite as good as a Burst PD against missiles, but they have a lot more charges.


Adimetro00

Yes the lore is quite barren, a consequence of being somewhat inspired from another IP I suppose. I've been mulling over some ideas to flesh the whole thing for a while. Nothing of the scale of Scy's lore, but enough to to fill all the descriptions and add some flavor I think. I still need to talk to FlashFrozen about it though.


Gorgonson

Draft: as you discovered, it is more of a hang-back support ship than anything else. Without shield and mostly missiles, it also can keep the 0-flux speed boost on most of the time, making it a bit harder to catch than it sound. I may change the built-in weapon to the same as the Versant though, if only for consistency sake.

Pandemonium/big ships VS lack of small missiles: it is actually a careful balancing decision. As the ships get more and more offensive oriented and close range, they get less and less small missile mounts. The reason is simple, if you can mount support micro-missiles or Magic-boxes, you can also mount more immediately dangerous weapons. Like Harpoons, Atroposes, Thunderbolts, Reapers... Believe me you don't want to face a cruiser with 12 double Atroposes at close range. That is less an issue with support oriented ships that hang in the back and can't just erase any overloaded ship from the face of the universe in one volley. The only one that kinda bother me on that front is the Calm, and I should maybe change four of the small mounts to built-in micro missiles.
   On the other hand, all those "missile slot deprived" hulls have a lot more universals medium mounts to load Thrush, Plovers (that will be nerfed btw) or Banish torpedoes.


People keep asking for a medium Micro-Missile Launcher, but there is already one in the form of the Thrush, a long-range Harpoon/Micro-missile MIRV hybrid!
Logged
 

Gorgonson

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 37
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #304 on: May 12, 2016, 03:34:12 AM »

You make a fair point about the versatility of small missile mounts - I think converting some of the mounts to built-in Micro Missile Launchers would be a great idea.
Those endearing swarms of tiny missiles were just so iconic, I feel as though I grew attached to them, only for them to be phased out.

I see how the balancing perspective shifts from micro to macro as the game progresses.  I definitely noticed my build preferences changing as more and more fighters and smallcraft were fielded.  Despite this, I generally engaged in close-combat with each ship I used.  I was in the thick of it, whether I was piloting a Gust, a Haze, a Maelstrom, or a Pandemonium - though this might say more about my playstyle than your balancing endeavours.  The only difference is that 'close-combat' covered increasingly greater distances as I upgraded ships.

I ultimately didn't feel so different playing a Pandemonium, compared to a Maelstrom or a Gust - the largest change was the reduction in small missiles which I could use to saturate my foes.
I did just try out a four-Plover Pandemonium, and yes, it was disgusting - I was killing Archbishops and Cathedrals from off the screen.

Has the idea for a Recson X ever crossed your mind?

And finally, regarding the Thrush - given that the Micro Missile aspect seems to be a contingency plan for the failure of the initial payload, I rarely see them trigger.  I had hoped to see the Thrush splitting into a number of Micro Missiles right before impact, but it seems to be just another long range missile that flies fast and slams into the target as usual.

I don't mean to sound critical, I love you and everything you do.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2016, 03:53:58 AM by Gorgonson »
Logged

adimetro00

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 124
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #305 on: May 12, 2016, 04:29:10 AM »

Tartiflette, What inspired FlashFrozen to make this? What do you think about renaming the mech-based fighters? Is Wanzer good enough?
Logged

Tartiflette

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2787
  • Kickstarter is NOT a magic spring of free money!
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #306 on: May 12, 2016, 05:11:37 AM »

Tartiflette, What inspired FlashFrozen to make this? What do you think about renaming the mech-based fighters? Is Wanzer good enough?
It's based on one of the Front Mission's wanzer manufacturer, although the relationship doesn't go much further than naming conventions and having mechs. I don't think wanzers should be renamed, because there isn't really a good contraction for Fliegerei Panzer (Fliegzer?), unlike Wander Panzer becoming Wanzer.
Logged
 

CaptainWinky

  • Lieutenant
  • **
  • Posts: 77
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #307 on: May 12, 2016, 06:14:58 AM »

Micro Missiles are nice, and Thrush LRMs are even better on a larger ship especially with Fast Missile Racks.  Recently I tried out the Mayorate with my usual assortment of other mods including Diable.  I found out that a Mayorate Del Azarchel cruiser with Diable Thrush missiles is really brutal.  The Thrushes have a range of 7000 so you can pick any frigate or destroyer in sensor range and fire off two or three waves of missiles to take it out immediately.  After using up the initial load of missiles I keep firing them as soon as they reload to keep pressure on whatever I'm fighting.
Logged

adimetro00

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 124
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #308 on: May 12, 2016, 06:26:04 PM »

Tartiflette, What inspired FlashFrozen to make this? What do you think about renaming the mech-based fighters? Is Wanzer good enough?
It's based on one of the Front Mission's wanzer manufacturer, although the relationship doesn't go much further than naming conventions and having mechs. I don't think wanzers should be renamed, because there isn't really a good contraction for Fliegerei Panzer (Fliegzer?), unlike Wander Panzer becoming Wanzer.
I've noticed that, because of that statement, those Front Mission Portraits from the Portrait Mod somehow fit this faction pretty good.
Logged

Wyvern

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 2410
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #309 on: May 13, 2016, 11:41:38 AM »

One piece of feedback: The Uhlann Siege Laser is, imo, too good.  Specifically, its range is very out-of-gamut for vanilla energy weapons - it's essentially a plasma cannon with the range of a gauss cannon.

Now, I know that the Diable capital ships need that range due to their turret mounts being way at the back of the ship.
So my suggestion: Either make the Uhlann a built-in weapon for Diable capital ships and not something you can mount on other ships - or make it 900 base range, and give the Diable capital ships a special "+300 range for large weapons" (or even just "+300 range for the Uhlann Siege Laser") built-in hull mod.
Logged
Wyvern is 100% correct about the math.

FlashFrozen

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 988
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #310 on: May 13, 2016, 03:07:20 PM »

The Uhlan has some serious drawbacks, namely, actual inaccuracy and shots will be absorbed by missiles, two problems the regular plasma cannon don't have with perfect accuracy and special plasma proj that can ignore missiles.

Benefits to the uhlan are +100 alpha, and much longer range and the hidden trait of being able to utilize expanded mags for even heftier burst.
Logged

Argonaut

  • Ensign
  • *
  • Posts: 18
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #311 on: May 19, 2016, 10:50:51 AM »

I love these designs and the quirks and abilities of the various ships. (Haven't gotten to cruisers yet.)

I have a problem, though: fighter/wanzer-heavy Diable forces break me with not much chance to strategize or retaliate, when equally and often more numerous fighter-based groups of different factions don't leave a scratch.
The fast missiles wreck my destroyers in a volley or two, and my own fighters and bombers seem unable to hold a candle either.
Logged

Troika

  • Lieutenant
  • **
  • Posts: 80
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #312 on: June 11, 2016, 01:29:30 PM »

Try keeping your ships in a tight formation so you can maximize your PD coverage.
Logged

NightfallGemini

  • Commander
  • ***
  • Posts: 171
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #313 on: June 12, 2016, 02:50:36 PM »

I assume you mean the DA mod-ship boss. The trick is that Wanzers have low replacement chassis counts, so maximize PD and you're good to go. Alternatively, max out on high chassis count fighters and have a couple good carriers.
Logged

FlashFrozen

  • Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 988
    • View Profile
Re: [0.7.2a] Diable Avionics 1.63 (10/04/2016)
« Reply #314 on: June 12, 2016, 03:08:56 PM »

Alternatively try loading up on ion cannons, emp weapons, armor shredding weapons or phase lances
Pd weapons aren't necessarily the best against these fighters, they often are distracted by the missile spam ( as intended ).
Logged

Pages: 1 ... 19 20 [21] 22 23 ... 69