Fractal Softworks Forum

Starsector => General Discussion => Topic started by: Thaago on October 24, 2012, 06:24:22 PM

Title: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Thaago on October 24, 2012, 06:24:22 PM: I'm playing my first vanilla game in a while and went to outfit an Onslaught. No Storm Needlers were on the map, so I decided to give Mjolnirs another shot. Gotta say... not too bad:

Spoiler
(http://imageshack.us/a/img513/3383/onsmjo.png) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/513/onsmjo.png/)
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The light needlers work amazingly, and the Mjolnirs have such good accuracy that my sides are very well protected. Their flux efficiency is truly terrible (I do think a small buff would be nice...) but their damage output, accuracy, and turn rate make them just murder on smaller ships for as long as you can fire them. Can't really fire the TPC's and the Mjolnir's at the same time, so I'd recommend turning the Mjolnirs off when engaging frontal targets (until out of TPC charges).
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: naufrago on October 24, 2012, 07:51:52 PM: Mjolnirs are bad and you should feel bad!

Whooopwhoopwhoopwhoopwhoop *scuttles off*
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Sunfire on October 25, 2012, 05:05:30 AM: Do the six light needlers overload shields on cap ships quickly enough?
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Thaago on October 25, 2012, 07:08:45 AM: They do pretty well - the overall kinetic yield is a little low, but the energy damage from the TPC's and Mjolnirs is also ok against shields.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Sunfire on October 25, 2012, 08:01:06 AM: Quote from: Thaago on October 25, 2012, 07:08:45 AM
They do pretty well - the overall kinetic yield is a little low, but the energy damage from the TPC's and Mjolnirs is also ok against shields.

So it's good against everything but just ok against caps, so do you use it in conjugation with other stuff? (what is that stuff?)
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Thaago on October 25, 2012, 08:56:46 AM: Its currently flying in a fleet that has a Hammerhead and a pair of Enforcers, both with mixed loads. I agree its just ok against other caps, not great. The only ship it has a real problem with is the Paragon - the eh kinetics compared to using Mk IX's or storm needlers make that shield a beast to get through (but once you do get through you can do a lot more damage during the vent). Then again most ships have a problem with the Paragon. :D
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ArthropodOfDoom on October 29, 2012, 04:46:05 PM: WOOPWOOPWOOPWOOP MORE MJOLNIRS WOOPWOOPWOOPWOOP

Seriously though, good on you for using Mjolnirs.
Looks like you and I are the only two who use them. :/
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: blamatron on October 29, 2012, 06:26:00 PM: Quote from: ArthropodOfDoom on October 29, 2012, 04:46:05 PM
Looks like you and I are the only two who use them. :/
add me to the list.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Neroid on October 30, 2012, 01:23:23 AM: That ship is just a waste of credit, it always overload and the hull&armor isn't that great >:(
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Faiter119 on October 30, 2012, 01:40:36 AM: Quote from: Neroid on October 30, 2012, 01:23:23 AM
That ship is just a waste of credit, it always overload and the hull&armor isn't that great >:(

Did you just say that the Onslaught has bad hull and armor!?

That armor can tank a Reaper without crumbling. And the ship can beat ANY other ship in a 1v1.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: intothewildblueyonder on October 30, 2012, 09:25:39 AM: Actually I have made (not for this purpose but I did test them against it in the simulator) conquest-variants that the AI could beat the Onslaught in
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on October 31, 2012, 03:23:11 AM: The Onslaught has the highest armor and hull in the vanilla game, how can that not be great? i never overload with it. and you can get 2 Onslaughts for the price of 1 Paragon.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Sunfire on October 31, 2012, 03:57:57 PM: Quote from: Faiter119 on October 30, 2012, 01:40:36 AM
Quote from: Neroid on October 30, 2012, 01:23:23 AM
That ship is just a waste of credit, it always overload and the hull&armor isn't that great >:(

Did you just say that the Onslaught has bad hull and armor!?

That armor can tank a Reaper without crumbling. And the ship can beat ANY other ship in a 1v1.

except maybe a paragon, but paragons can beat anything so...
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on October 31, 2012, 04:37:00 PM: TBH, any ship can beat any ship, given enough time, ammo, different situations and one hell of a captain.

just look at star wars, a single fighters destroys an entire drone command ship :P
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: robokill on October 31, 2012, 08:45:08 PM: Just a tip move the top left and right flake to the center medium turrents and switch the top middle one for something else
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Reshy on November 01, 2012, 02:01:06 PM: Quote from: ValkyriaL on October 31, 2012, 04:37:00 PM
TBH, any ship can beat any ship, given enough time, ammo, different situations and one hell of a captain.

just look at star wars, a single fighters destroys an entire drone command ship :P

I'd like to see a hound down a paragon.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on November 01, 2012, 02:08:23 PM: leave the paragon with 100 hull and overloaded, and the hound will down it. Heh heh heh... ;)
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: PCCL on November 01, 2012, 02:24:37 PM: Quote from: Reshy on November 01, 2012, 02:01:06 PM
I'd like to see a hound down a paragon.

given enough ammo, it can.

I don't think there exists enough possible ammo in all its hardpoints to hold enough potential damage to destroy a paragon though....
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Aleskander on November 01, 2012, 02:37:48 PM: Even a beam-fitted paragon?
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: hadesian on November 01, 2012, 02:39:27 PM: I reckon it's doable... but how defies me.

You'd definitely want something like a heavy needler in the medium, which means a LAG in the small. You'd also want to give it some shielding or something, and certainly extended mags.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Axiege on November 01, 2012, 03:03:37 PM: I don't think there's anything that has enough firepower and ammunition that can be put on a single hound.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on November 01, 2012, 03:33:29 PM: I think its about time we put that to the test. :P
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: intothewildblueyonder on November 01, 2012, 04:33:29 PM: well make a paragon with no weapons and find out :P (using dev mod and variant edit both the paragon and hound)
I'm pretty sure the fortress shield will prevent any real damage getting through, maybe if it was loaded up with high flux weaponry that could never hit it
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on November 01, 2012, 05:37:20 PM: I believe a heavy mauler and a light needler could do the job, will certainly take an eternity but hey.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Gothars on November 01, 2012, 05:42:48 PM: Quote from: ValkyriaL on November 01, 2012, 05:37:20 PM
I believe a heavy mauler and a light needler could do the job, will certainly take an eternity but hey.

All ballistic weapons would run out of ammo.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on November 01, 2012, 05:50:46 PM: Yeah well, the Hound cannot use energy weapons, makes the selection of weapons rather limited doesn't it? i believe HM have about 300-400 ammo with mags, that's plenty to kill a paragon, the needler never runs out of ammo. so just let needler do its job and then pound it with the mauler while it vents or lowers its shield. it will die eventually.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Gothars on November 01, 2012, 06:19:13 PM: Quote from: ValkyriaL on November 01, 2012, 05:50:46 PM
the needler never runs out of ammo

Sure it does, the light needler can only fire 100 salvos of 10 needles each, which makes 50 damage, x2 because kintec. Thats 100x50x10x2 =100 000 damage .The standard Paragon has 25 000 Flux and a shield efficiency of 0.33, so you would need 75 000 points dmg to bring it down once. One heavy mauler cant destroy a paragon during one overload.
All that presumes of course that the paragon is not returning fire for some reason.

For the Onslaught it's different, I think every frigate could bring it down.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on November 02, 2012, 03:35:15 AM: You can kill an onslaught with a single frig, but not ANY frigate. the rear guns will kill you because you need your flux for your guns. and you will inevitably get hit by those mark IX's at least once and they hurt. and you have to survive actually flanking the beast first.

BTW Paragon has a shield efficiency of 0.6
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Gothars on November 02, 2012, 04:02:35 AM: Quote from: ValkyriaL on November 02, 2012, 03:35:15 AM
You can kill an onslaught with a single frig, but not ANY frigate. the rear guns will kill you because you need your flux for your guns. and you will inevitably get hit by those mark IX's at least once and they hurt. and you have to survive actually flanking the beast first.

Mh, right.
I just tried the hound. Against a standard Onslaught winning is possible in theory at best. But I think it would be quite doable if the rear cannons were non-kinetic. Then a combination of front shields and a heavy mauler should do the trick.
The brawler would probably be tricky, too.

Quote from: ValkyriaL on November 02, 2012, 03:35:15 AM
BTW Paragon has a shield efficiency of 0.6

Well yeah, I was looking at the elite one in "Last Stand". With normal crew the standard Paragon has 0.45.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on November 02, 2012, 04:29:15 AM: Quote
Paragon,paragon,Battleship,fortressshield,25,18000,1500,25000,31250,1250,350,30,15,10,5,5,3500,OMNI,,360,0.6,0.6,,,450,1000,300,800,25,32,25,150000,504

I have no idea where you see 0.45 in that

0.6 is the standard regular crew value, 100% in everything.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: Gothars on November 02, 2012, 04:54:23 AM: A standard (meaning elite variant) Paragon has hardened shields.
Title: Re: A good Mjolnir Onslaught
Post by: ValkyriaL on November 02, 2012, 06:06:56 AM: Ooh yeah, hardened shields, completely forgot about that one. yeah your right.