Fractal Softworks Forum
Starsector => Mods => Modding => Topic started by: KlonTom on April 14, 2012, 12:49:05 PM
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Hello, im new here, but i have one thing to propose for modding community here.
There is such free indie game as Battleship Forever(http://www.wyrdysm.com/games.php), and this game has one most simple but in same time amazing spaceship battles ever done.
But what is more valuable for us is Ship Maker subprogram, which let us construct ships for this game.
Every ship in BF is constructed with small PNG parts with their own parameters, such as color or number of HP. So in this editor you actually constructing ship from "spare parts" and colour it as you wish. And after we make our ship we can make screenshot of it and after some redacting get one hella nice ship sprite for Starfarer.
So ye, this is mine little guide about how to get Starfarer ship sprite from BF Ship Maker.
1) Install BF (http://www.wyrdysm.com/games.php)
2) Go to BF forum for Custom Sprites (http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=23)
I recommend parts from next threads
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=5823
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3035
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=5348
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=5299
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4551
And unpack it in Custom Sprite directory of BF.
3) Now startup BF ShipMaker, you will see something like this
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-1.jpg)
4) Go to Tools->Group arrange. This will pop up screen like this
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-2.jpg)
As you see there is 4 group of parts, to switch between them you have to press ~ and use 1\2\3\4 keys for every group respectfully. But mine work flow goes around arranging needed parts in first group, and using rest three as storage for possibly usefull parts. So initially drag and drop all not used parts in first group to fourth group, just because they look bogus and we can use it only for getting some silhouette.
5) Look closely for sets of parts that you downloaded, and choose which one you like and will use in your ship. After this just drag and drop them from folder to a groups 2-4 in Ship Maker. There is pretty much unlimited storage, but it can become really complicated to orient in them if there is too much parts, as it shows only in rows by 3, and to scroll it up and down you have to use only mouses scroll wheel, which is pain in the ass.
You can multiply select parts in groups, by using Shift+click between two parts, to select everything in between. And to delete the parts that you dont need\dont like, select them\it and press delete. To move multyple parts between groups, select and just drag and drop them in different group.
6) Now drag and drop ,parts from 2-4 groups, that you gonna use in your ship to first group. Close Group Arrange window by pressing Esc, and lets start constructing our ship.
7) Now press Z to open your groups parts scroll window at side of your screen, now as you click part, its instantly goes for constructing, look for a place where you want it and using J I K L and Shift+ J I K L, position it as you want, and click to place it.
Now choose colour for it from palette to the left. First three colours will transfer their parameters to a parts which coloured by them even if you change it, so use them to define base colours of your ship. Rest 9 colours will just colour part in to their colour but not change it if you change palettes colour. To change colour right click over colour.
Now press M to mirror your part. It will mirror every unic part, so if your building non symmetric ship, dont use it.
And use A and Q keys to define "Depth" of part. Depth goes from 1 to N, where N is number of used parts and define order of parts. So part with Depth of 4 will show over parts with depth 5+ but will be under parts with depth 1 2 3.
Depth designated by parenting. Core of ship is always 0 depth, and will be UNDER every further parts. Next part will be 1 and 2 depth after mirroring, but we probably will need some depth storage for possible artistic parts over our "core" so instantly make em 5 and 6 depth. Now choose one of our first parts and place new part, it will be depth 3 because Depth 1 and 2 are taken by her parenting and mirrored parts.
And this way we build our ship little by little.
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-4.jpg)
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-5.jpg)
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-6.jpg)
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-7.jpg)
Go to Tools->Save sprites ini. This will save our current sprite config. I recommend you to to use different sprite configs for different ships\ships series to not discontinue its "style".
8) Now we want to a screenshot of our ship. But this pesky grid is no good for us, so go to tools->Change Background, and use earlier created bitmap where White bears In White Antarctica field in White snowfall chase Pale white Antarctica scientists in all White. Or just just fill some random bmp with white colour. Now its perfectly fine for us and we can screenshot it. Press F11. Press F9 and drag over your ship, to choose what needed to be screenshoted.
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-8.jpg)
Also you can use this Change Background feature to load some ships picture to background and use it as silhouette for creating your ship.
9) Now go to \Battleships Forever\SMScreenshots\ where your screenshot is saved, and open it for example in Adobe Photoshop.
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-9.jpg)
First of all rotate whole image 90* CCW and after use "magic wand" tool to select whole white trash pixels, that we dont need. Inverse selection, so only our precious ship was selected and copy it.
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-11.jpg)
Create new file, which will be sized right for our copied ship, insert our ship and than delete "background" layer. Now you are free to edit as you want, ambient occlusion, radial blue, all this jazz. You want it you do it, i dont. Now save it as PNG. We got our basic sprite of ship.
(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-10.jpg)
But Starfarer is counting every pixel for designate how big ship is, and we have to change our ships image size accordingly to size of ship in game. I will use table of sizes from
Fight For Universe: Sector Xplo http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=2091.0 (http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=2091.0) topic:
1 pixel = 1 meter.
* Fighter, approximate long axis is 10~15 meters.
* Bomber, approximate long axis is 20~30 meters.
* Gunship, approximate long axis is 35~50 meters.
* Corvette, approximate long axis is 55~90 meters.
* Frigate, approximate long axis is 100~160 meters.
* Destroyer, approximate long axis is 180~230 meters.
* Cruiser, approximate long axis is 240~340 meters.
* Battlecruiser, approximate long axis is 360~540 meters.
* Battleship, approximate long axis is 560~960 meters.
* Dreadnought, approximate long axis is 1,080~1,860 meters.
* Mothership, approximate long axis is 2,200~5,200 meters.
* Titan, approximate long axis is 8,000~16,000 meters.
* Flagship, approximate long axis is 86,000~126,000 meters.
* Arkship, approximate long axis is 2,240,000~8,860,000 meters.
So with help of your graphical redactor tools, resize your ships images height to an needed size, and voila we have our handmade ship sprite ready to get rigged in Trylobot's ship editor http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=375.0 (http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=375.0).
So yeah, something like this... I hope this will help somebody, and will let your community to create more and better mods.
Also there is plenty sprites of superior ships at BF forum itself http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=2&sid=fae510afd3629cbf7b6e74b6a9d9262b (http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=2&sid=fae510afd3629cbf7b6e74b6a9d9262b), but id highly recommend you guys to create yours ships from scratch, as its much more FUN to play after.
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Because it doesn't fit the art style. QED.
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Because it doesn't fit the art style. QED.
But you can reap apart the ships that are currently in Starfarer to get themed set of sprites and once again use them in Ship maker
Also mods like
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=431.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=162.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=1219.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=852.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=642.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=2012.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=1827.0
Are hardly in starfarers style. They totally overhauled style.
And mods like
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=1576.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=1885.0
http://fractalsoftworks.com/forum/index.php?topic=1558.0
Are in opposite way too similar to stock ships, and you can see in most cases where and how they where remirored or repainted.
So my guess was, that it would be great new way of creating things, in new way.
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Yeah, the ships created with this tool aren't going to fit Starfarer's art style, but most people aren't going to care. In my opinion, I'd rather see people new to making ship sprites using this tool than making generic kitbashes.
Good work on the tutorial though, hopefully some people find it useful.
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It's pretty hard to duplicate the starfarer art style, being as it's generally done pixel by pixel with tremendous care.
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Btw i dont fully understand this "art style" thing. I mean, its modding, and you want to make something that every kickassian would appreciated from time it was created, to dark times when all what was awesome will be lost. Something grand. Something awesome. Something new.
And I dont think that you can create something awesome with help of it. Its already was created, just look at those kick ass sprites:
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5932
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6452
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5769
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5988
http://www.wyrdysm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5915
And there was many many others.
And even if its arent fit in to game, or you "see" you ship differently, more detailed, you can always draw them over in picture editor how you like it.
Starfarers stock ship are god level designed masterpieces, draw pixel by pixel to end skyhigh result. But I dont think that if you will chose to go different way from their style, you will end bad or ugly way. You will end in your way, and probably somebody will not like it, damn there will be for sure somebody who dont liked it, but there will be also at least one who will like it, yourself.
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So yes, this is mine little guide about how to get Starfarer ship sprite from BF Ship Maker.
Thank you very much for that exceptionally comprehensive & well-written guide. :)
Because it doesn't fit the art style. QED.
Right on schedule. I knew there would be someone along shortly to trumpet that from the roof-tops, as if warning the town that the Mongol hordes were attacking.
Oh, by the way? "QED (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q.E.D.)", my ass; you haven't actually "demonstrated" anything.
Yeah, the ships created with this tool aren't going to fit Starfarer's art style, but most people aren't going to care. In my opinion, I'd rather see people new to making ship sprites using this tool than making generic kitbashes.
I could not care less about the fact that every single sprite that every single modder produces is NOT 100% identical to art style used in the game's official sprites. Some people are seriously hung up about that, and want everything to slavishly mimic the official art, but every community has its fanatics and fringe lunatics. :D
I'm all in favor of anything which makes it easier for people to deal with the tedium of sprite creation and get new hulls into the game. Hulls which serve as vehicles to carry a modder's ideas out of his head and into the community for players to enjoy them. The kitbashing trend is starting to grate upon me, and some sort of an alternative aesthetic is certainly welcome. If the newest alternative takes the path of coming via the Battleships Forever ship-building tool, I'm okay with that.
It's pretty hard to duplicate the starfarer art style, being as it's generally done pixel by pixel with tremendous care.
Agreed in full, mate.
Let's take it a step further. I'd like to see much more energy applied to balancing mods rather than waxing, polishing and detailing them with chrome bumpers for purely visual appeal. Right now there are some stupidly over-powered mods on this forum which are pleasing to the eye, but the creative concept for the mod resembles something scribbled by a five-year-old kid who drank a bottle of Red Bull. ::) Reallocating that same energy which had gone into making things pixel-perfect and instead using it to eliminate hyper-testosteroned gameplay fail would be much more beneficial.
In the end, it's what a modder DOES with his or her finished sprites that's most important; not the sprites for their own sake.
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"Doesn't fit the art style" hahaha, oh wait, you're serious? ;D
By that logic quite a few mods should scratch all their efforts so far.
Not to mention that modding is inherently about changing stuff.
Some mods only tweak stats, others go for a total conversion (including graphics, hud, etc.), lots go for a middle ground.
I see nothing wrong with ships having a different feel to them (strictly talking about mods, vanilla should have a pretty good reason lore-wise to pull it off), besides the end result of the Ship Maker can be drawn/filtered/autismed(yes-I-used-it-as-a-verb-get-over-it) over to hell and back if one desires to make them more similiar to the feel of vanilla Starfarer.
tl;dr: that's a crap excuse.
That aside - holy crap, those sprites on the provided links look really nice! o_O
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These sprites are FANTASTIC. Looks like a great tool for us to use.
Agreed on the above point regarding balance though. I rarely use mods since most of them are HILARIOUSLY unbalanced.
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Not to be ungrateful for such a thing, but I don't suppose there could be a screenshot of some of the ships made by this ingame? I would like to see how they look compared to the vanilla ships, just to see the difference in "tech look" as it were. Though it does look like quite the useful tool I must say
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Not to be ungrateful for such a thing, but I don't suppose there could be a screenshot of some of the ships made by this ingame? I would like to see how they look compared to the vanilla ships, just to see the difference in "tech look" as it were. Though it does look like quite the useful tool I must say
Look at the links further up in the thread.
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Didn't see links for screens of the ships in battle, for example. :P
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I could not care less about the fact that every single sprite that every single modder produces is NOT 100% identical to art style used in the game's official sprites. Some people are seriously hung up about that, and want everything to slavishly mimic the official art, but every community has its fanatics and fringe lunatics. :D
So true; man, feel lucky you never had to deal with Homeworld 2's modding community. If you did so much as make a ship that deviated from the standard designs, they'd lynch you.
...
In the end, it's what a modder DOES with his or her finished sprites that's most important; not the sprites for their own sake.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
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Some of those sprites in the links to look good for a new faction in trying to make (too lazy to make my own ships :P)
Are they free to use?
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Some of those sprites in the links to look good for a new faction in trying to make (too lazy to make my own ships :P)
Are they free to use?
Are you about whole section of custom community made ships, which made from custom community made sprites, for free indie game, which community is long time dead?
Well, as far i know there where no problems with that at a time when it was alive, so there will be no problems now.
Didn't see links for screens of the ships in battle, for example. :P
I showed how to make ship sprite. "How to make ship sprite into ship" guides was already nicely done before me.
Not to be ungrateful for such a thing, but I don't suppose there could be a screenshot of some of the ships made by this ingame? I would like to see how they look compared to the vanilla ships, just to see the difference in "tech look" as it were. Though it does look like quite the useful tool I must say
I leaved in the end of guide link to a forum where BF modding community dwelled for last 4 years, and after its death there is many remnants of the past. Whole fleets from past.
Also in mine third post is links for some "recent" topics out there.
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I use this tool for sprite creation long time ago and i stop it because it wasn't... Hehe how do i say that... Look how can i import ALL Kae sprites in those 4 groups? Basic i only use them. As i see it i can only import 1 by 1 and there is over 500 of them...
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I use this tool for sprite creation long time ago and i stop it because it wasn't... Hehe how do i say that... Look how can i import ALL Kae sprites in those 4 groups? Basic i only use them. As i see it i can only import 1 by 1 and there is over 500 of them...
As you see there is 4 group of parts, to switch between them you have to press ~ and use 1\2\3\4 keys for every group respectfully. But mine work flow goes around arranging needed parts in first group, and using rest three as storage for possibly usefull parts. So initially drag and drop all not used parts in first group to fourth group, just because they look bogus and we can use it only for getting some silhouette.
5) Look closely for sets of parts that you downloaded, and choose which one you like and will use in your ship. After this just drag and drop them to a groups 2-4. There is pretty much unlimited storage, but it can become really complicated to orient in them if there is too much parts, as it shows only in rows by 3, and to scroll it up and down you have to use only mouses scroll wheel.
6) Now drag and drop parts that you gonna use in your ship to first group. Close Group Arrange window by pressing Esc, and lets start constructing our ship.
So yeah, just drag and drop them in Group Arrange window, in any group you like. Select all of them in folder (ctrl+a, or just lasso em, or select first and shift click last) and just drag and drop in desired group. In group you can also select multiple parts by selecting one and then shift+click selecting whole bunch parts in between, and move after from group to group. To delete parts-select and press delete.
To open group arrange windo, go to Tools->group arrange
I recommend using first group as working group and the rest as storage. Every group can take 2-4 sets of parts without significant problem, and your working group will be filled with only usefull sprites.
Go to Tools->Save sprites ini. This will save our current sprite config. I recommend you to to use different sprite configs for different ships\ships series to not discontinue its "style".
To save you sprite groups profile, do what i said in quote. You can have specific sprite profile for every ship series, or ships individually, to not discontinue your style.
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Tnx ;D
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Thankyou for the comprehensive guide KlonTom, the BSF Shp maker looks like an awesome tool for people who have a hard time when it comes to kitbashing
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The sprites look a bit simple but I make take a piece or two to fill in blank space.
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@KlonTom: Please don't be offput by the lukewarm responses of some of my fellow modders. In general we are aware of the BSF utility, and most choose not to use it for one reason or another --- but that's not really important. This is an excellent guide, many new modders will definitely appreciate it, and actually seeing such detail on its use has almost inspired me to try it out and see what I can make in the way of re-usable parts.
Thanks for the excellent guide!
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I have no problems with this, but I'll continue kitbashing.
I just like how a large number of the vanilla ships lend themselves to kitbashing easily, (or maybe I have an eye for it)
of course most of my ships have no particular plan in mind, I'll grab four or five different sprites then figure out someway to mix the various bits to get something new.
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@KlonTom, thank you for great guide. Original BSF textures aren't good, but these custom texture packs fix that problem :)
...stupidly over-powered mods...
Against vanilla races? Maybe... But if you're putting them against decent enemies, you get an epic fight :)
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Oops. Didn't expect to be taken that seriously. Sorry for any offence caused.
Personally it's very jarring to see something that doesn't match the art. It'd be fine in a 3d game I guess, but the line thickness and shadows and such don't even match. I personally haven't a clue how to mess with filters and colours, so forget it.
As for replacing the available parts, that's a lot of work. If someone were to do it first, perhaps. But the good kitbashes tend to have parts sliced up into little bits along panel lines, on-demand for when they're needed, not taken from a palette (as far as I can tell).
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(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-4.jpg)
How did you get your ship to look like that?
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Finally a decent tutorial, I've been wanting to get into spriting and this is gonna be sweet
@sproginator: Warning. Do not quote the entire first post, for any reason, when it is a post of this nature (an in-depth tutorial including many images). It makes viewing the thread ridiculous. -Trylobot
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People have been using it, and for quite some time. (ie, even back when I was around and posting heavily XP)
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People have been using it, and for quite some time. (ie, even back when I was around and posting heavily XP)
I think this is a great place to start for new spriters, maybe make this thread stickied or something
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So i've just made my first "sprite" but i dont have photoshop so i am unable to make the background layer transparent, Any suggestions?
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Have you tried gimp? it's an alternative to photoshop,
http://www.gimp.org/ (http://www.gimp.org/)
That or paint.net
http://www.getpaint.net/ (http://www.getpaint.net/)
Both will probably take some time to get used to,
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Well no one is answering my question. :-\
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(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-4.jpg)
How did you get your ship to look like that?
You can download various ship parts and incorporate them into the editor. You can also edit the colours, he just darkened the shade of red that was being used on the parts and added more layers to it, i suspect that is the case here anyway
Hope this helps
Sprog
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(http://i1150.photobucket.com/albums/o613/KlonTom/Untitled-4.jpg)
How did you get your ship to look like that?
You can download various ship parts and incorporate them into the editor. You can also edit the colours, he just darkened the shade of red that was being used on the parts and added more layers to it, i suspect that is the case here anyway
Hope this helps
Sprog
Well see the way he did makes it look like it could belong in starfarer they way they are by default is just strange.
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The ships just seem like they lack the infamous lights, piping, and cluttered look that the starfarer ships characteristically have.
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Awesome eh? :P
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I leaved in the end of guide link to a forum where BF modding community dwelled for last 4 years, and after its death there is many remnants of the past. Whole fleets from past.
Actually isn't dead... th15 actually came out of hiding to tell us that he's working on a new and improved BSF, rebuilding it from the ground up with his own engine.
Regardless, your ship looks good! Nice tutorial. Now off to make a few ships of my own...
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I have already made 5 haha
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Can i please use your tutorial here and incorporate it into a main one i am making?
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The ships just seem like they lack the infamous lights, piping, and cluttered look that the starfarer ships characteristically have.
Open them up in GIMP, or Photoshop or something, and spruce them up in there. Alternatively, wouldn't it work to make a 'drawing board' by using massive picture dimensions, copy-pasting all of these ship parts into the picture, then using them to build a ship, out of the editor, in whatever art program you like to use?
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I started off my first ships using this, I think it's a good way for less-experienced guys like me to get into full-on ship sprites. The only problems I have are with making it look good with the weapons in the game, since you can't have parts of the ship going over the turrets. :(
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Is there a way to move parts on the grid with just the keyboard?
The mouse in the shipmaker is buggy at best. And often will jump as you move the mouse, or just not move at all. I'm finding it nearly impossible to place parts exactly where I want them.
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@douglasg14b. if i remember correctly you can do little moves by holding shift and using the arrow keys to do micro moves.
@vinya. there is a way but it involves placing a section, setting a weapon onto that section and then placing a duplicate section over the top to get the effect of a gun barrel poking from the side or something. you can also set pieces to move based on the movement of a weapon so you can build proper 3 barrel turrets and such if you have the sprites